alright, so lets say I'm an atheist...?

Question

For the purpose of this question, I am an atheist:

I do not believe in a God,
I dont believe in Jesus or anything like that.
I believe that after we live, we die and that is all.

I can murder, and I can steal, and do all sorts of terrible things. How do you prove that what I am doing is wrong? Because the law says so? Because you dont like it? Why must I be moral, and why must I conform to the rules of society? How is that different from sheep leading sheep?

Just a thought, not meaning to offend. I would appreciate a serious answer.

but you say you follow it because it is common sense, or because you dont want to.
Realize that common sense is just what regular people would do in a certain situation. Before, it was common sense to believe in a God, and now it is "common sense" not to belive in a God.

You say you do it for philosophical reasons and because you dont want to do bad things. If someone doesnt care and does them anyway, you cannot punish them and justify this action.

vishal. so if i were to increase the overall happiness of a population, maybe drug trade and drug sales should also be legalized.

Or furthermore, if a population wanted someone dead, is this justification for going out and murdering?

Answer 1

Ok.... let's assume...

Correct on the the non-beliefs...

Correct on the can murder, steal and such....

Can't really "prove" it's wrong...

Yes, the law does say it's not allowed.

And yes, I don't like you doing that...

There is no actual reason for you to conform...

I'm not a shephard, so I'll give that last one a pass.
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So, I'm with you so far...

Laws and morality are defined by the society you live in, you're usually socialized into a certain culture. These attitudes become in essence a part of you, you internalize the values of your community.

Belief in the supernatural does not mean you cannot kill, morality isn't an absolute code existing within you. All those things are equally true for a person of faith, in fact some believers are more willing to kill because they see it as a religious duty.

We're all free to choose. As to the "wrongness", there is no absolute right/wrong, your culture defines levels of approved models of behaviour, they're agreements, not commandments.

Everyone has an option of not conforming, even you. You either follow the rules, or suffer the consequences, ranging from being looked at funny, to legal action against you. If you assume an atheist is more inclined to break the law, I can say you're mistaken. Most atheist are thinkers, not criminals :)

That help any?

Answer 2

On a basic level, laws such as 'don't steal', 'don't murder' are 'good' because they help preserve a stable society. If you cannot trust anyone, it is difficult to even have a society.
On top of that, almost everyone is aware of their conscience-I would probably not have to argue that child abuse is 'wrong', something in you finds the thought so horrible, it is dificult to even think about it. Same with things like the Holocaust, or the Rwandan genocide. this shows that we start with an innate sense of how the world should be, and how people should be; and we are aware this does not happen often. From childhood onwards we make all sorts of excuses about why/how we didn't really do anything wrong, because we find it difficult to admit-why else would children say things that they know cannot possibly be believed, along the lines of "it wasn't me/I didn't do it/it was him".
Also, on a deeper level, our actions affect and change our character, even talking about things often enough makes them more 'acceptable' to us.
However, none of this would 'prove' something to be 'right' or 'wrong'; to do that, you need an objective standard of measurement, i.e. God.
Is this helpful in any way?

Answer 3

If God doesn't exist, then it seems we have invented religion (at least in part) to control people's behavior. It's not a matter of an objective moral code, it has more to do with ensuring self-preservation by agreeing not to harm one another. If we mutually agree to obey a certain moral code, our obedience gives us a measure of protection from lawlessness -- we don't have to worry about the others who have agreed to obey the code.

Religion is much more conformist than atheism, so I'm not sure what your last point is. If you're just asking in general why people follow the rules, the answer is that some don't. You are free to be as criminal as you want, so long as you can evade the law. However, it isn't very nice.

Answer 4

There is a simple way to prove that your actions are immoral, and it uses the Utilitarian principle. The utilitarian principle essentially says that an action is morally right if and only if it has the effect of increasing the overall level of happiness among entities capable of feeling. The best moral actions, therefore, are those that maximize happiness.

Murdering someone is an action that decreases the overall level of happiness. Therefore, that action is morally wrong.

There are various other philosophical theories on morality (Deontologism, Teleologism, Social Contract theory, etc.) and they all agree that killing is wrong in nearly all cases (making exceptions for self-defense, etc.). I could just as easily have used one of those.

Answer 5

Many Christians also claim that only those who believe can live a moral life and those who do not believe in god have no moral compass. That implies that one lives a moral life, not because it is the right thing to do, but because god expects us to be moral. Again, the fallacy with this reasoning is that mitzvahs and morals should be followed for personal philosophical reasons, not because some god or holy book dictates rules to us.

Answer 6

Let's assume I am a Christian. I can murder, I can steal, and I do all sorts of terrible things. How do you prove that what I am doing is wrong? Because the bible says so? Because the law says so? Because you don't like it? Why must I be moral and why must I conform to the rules of society? How is that different from sheep leading sheep?



See how your questions doesn't work yet or do I need to be more blatant?

Answer 7

the classes we are meant to check approximately mankind and ourselves are the only subject concerns. whilst guy chooses to forget approximately appropriate to the classes, there is hatred, greed for potential, greed for glory and all the different sins that we are able to. The question isn't despite if or no longer there's a God, that's despite if or no longer we are working to develop the talents that the Torah, the Bible and the Koran teach. that's the talents which will develop the human innovations to a extra physically powerful point of thinking. by means of fact lots of elect to argue the petty info or deny the fee of the lesson, mankind is keeping themselves down on the point of a %. of animals. we are individuals of the animal kingdom yet we've what no different animal has. we've the skill to succeed in for the celebrities and raise our mind previous our roots of instinctive habit. We could desire to develop our individual intellects in the previous we are able to attain the peace defined in the Torah, the Bible and the Koran.

Answer 8

You don't have much of a grasp of ethics, do you? You imagine that the only source of ethical behavior is religion. Here is something you won't like at all: We evolved from and as social animals, predisposed to a collection of behaviors that allow us to live in groups. As the groups increased in size and complexity from clan to tribe to city-state to nation, the behavior needed became more complex, and was codified into laws. Some of these laws were expressed as civil laws and some were expressed as religious laws.

Hover they were expressed, they were the product of the society in which they were enacted.

The rules of society, as you call them, then, come not from religion but from society.

You are moral because you have a neurobiological predilection for morality.

Answer 9

I'm tired of hearing this question. Our morality is derived from basic human emotions: sympathy, empathy, etiquette, altruism, disgust, jealousy, and so on, this is where our morality comes from.

We are social being pre-programmed to cooperate and maintain social order, what is so hard to understand?

How do you explain the fact that atheists comprise about 10% of our total population but only 1% of our prison population?

Your question begs a follow up question as well:

Are you saying the only reason you don't do these horrible things is because you fear divine punishment?

Answer 10

Call it 'human nature' , human instinct' 'mother nature' whatever you want, but humans, like most animals are born with an innate instinct to care for its own kind.

That's family, community, tribe, nation.

Native American Indians, Eskimo's, Aborigines were protected from man-made monotheist religions such as Islam and Christianity etc and have managed to thrive for 10's of '000's of years just fine.