Breeders: What do you consider a "normal" or "acceptable" death rate for newborn pups under the age of 2 weeks

Question

There have been a few questions lately that have included statistics or comments regarding death rates. Please don't include culling of neonates in your number unless it was for a birth defect.

Thanks for your input... I'd just like an idea if my averages and thoughts on it are way off base.

I'd also love numbers from those who have rescued and whelped litters as well as those who have dealt with newborn pups at shelters.

*I* am not having any issues with either the pups I whelp that are my own, nor those that I assist in whelping for others. I am purposely not giving out the numbers I have as I do not want to skew the answers.... this is an honest "I just would like some input" kind of question.

Birth defects aside (and if there are multiples of those it really does mean the dogs probably shouldn't be bred) *I* personally have had a less than 10 % deathrate... and that includes a roommates irresponsibility resulting in 2 squished pups... as well as loss of a pup when the dominant b*tch killed another b*tches pup (strange because she usually mothered the dang things long after the mothers quit).

I'm like Loki and Basset ... Breeding is hard work and I can't stand when any die. I really don't understand why someone would keep breeding dogs with a high neonatal deathrate.

Answer 1

Honestly, I don't consider *any* death rate "acceptable"...which is probably part of the reason I hate whelping puppies.

In 20 years, I've had:
2 puppies who never really "got going" and died within 24 hours of birth.
1 puppy euthanized due to spina biffida.
2 puppies euthanized due to ectopic ureter.
I lost one little girl 6 days after she was born, a fading puppy.

I have had other "deaths" in the form of stillborns/babies who didn't make it through a c-section. I guess these guys never took a breath, so I shouldn't count them...? not sure.

Averaging 1 litter/year and 4 puppies per litter...I guess I've been lucky.

God, I hate whelping puppies. The first 5 weeks kills me. I think you've just talked me out of the litter I was thinking of for next spring!

Answer 2

I don't consider *any* deaths acceptable.

Over the years, in 9 litters with 61 puppies concieved and 58 delivered alive (3 stillborn) I've raised 55 of them to "selling age". Of the 3 that didn't make it, 2 were crushed by their dams and one was killed when he fell out of the nest and was mistaken for a chew toy by one of the adult males.

However, the statistics are probably correct because the BYBs and puppymills aren't as conscientious about making sure the puppies make it. One basset breeder I know goes to work during the first two weeks, instead of staying home and watching them 24-7 like I do. One litter she started off with 9 pups and ended up with 4. Other breeders may simply not want to spend the money or effort on pups that may have trouble.

EDIT: As far as the argument against "coddling" pups, puppies I have given special attention to include:

Spot - Not breathing when born, needed to be rescusitated (sp?). Lived to be 13 years old, never sick a day in his life until the cancer got him in the end. Group winning Can/Am Champion, one of the top Bassets in Canada, he now appears is North American pedigrees coast to coast.

Fred - definitely the runt of the litter, got supplemental feeding. Turned out to be the biggest and strongest pup in the litter. He is currently 9 1/2, still going strong.

Cruiser - born with a hole in his belly and intestines coming out, had emergency surgery to close him up. Now six years old, you'd never know he ever had a problem.

Just because a pup has trouble doesn't mean there's something wrong with it. Defective pups should be humanely euthanized for sure, but the dams will sit on the good ones as well as the poor ones, accidents can happen to otherwise healthy pups. A pup that gets stuck and takes too long to deliver doesn't mean there's anything wrong with it, just that the pup is large or awkwardly presented.

Answer 3

I do not raise puppies. I do however farm, and raise both meat goats and meat rabbits.

A 10% loss in any breed of animal seems to be fairly standard in the newborns.

I just got a new Great Pyrenees puppy a few days ago. She was from a littler of eleven. One puppy only lived two days, and died. That would be right about on the money for what is normal.

If you are having more than a 10% loss, I think you should get a Vet's advice on how to reduce this number.

~Garnet
Homesteading/Farming over 20 years


I've never bottle raised rescue puppies. I have done kittens. Of the kittens I've bottle raised, 100% of them lived to full adulthood. They also ALL had mothers first milk (the mother was killed by a car, when they were two days old). In other words, they were normal healthy kittens.

I've been raising goats since 1999. I use to kill myself trying to save every newborn baby. I've learned that very often if a doe rejects a baby, there is a reason, I'm just not able to see it. With goat kids that have been rejected, or abandonded, the sucess rate is very low. I get them to about three or four months of age, and then find them dead seemingly of no cause. I've had my Vet post mortum some of them, and she could find no cause either. Sometimes newborn animals are just not healthy, or strong, and even with the best of care, they die.

I wouldn't count pupies rescued from pounds in your stats. Those puppies have been exposed to every disease known to dogs, once they enter the pound. I would venture to guess their death rate is much higher than normal.

Answer 4

I worked for a kennel in which a puppy death was unacceptable. Puppiies were monitored carefully - weighed 3 times daily. Any weight loss and the puppy was fed supplementally. A dehydrated pup was given subQ fluids onsite.

When I worked there, there were some stillborn pups - maybe 10%. There was one pup culled because of a birth defect that made it unable to eat properly.

PERSONALLY (and I am not a breeder) I think that coddling pups makes lines grow weak and unhealthy over time. I would want to see a death rate in pups - natural selection at work. But this is one of many reasons that would prevent me from ever breeding - natural selection isn't pretty and I don't want to watch it. :S

Answer 5

Out of 21 pups, I have lost 2. They were very tiny from the beginning...probably concieved several days after the other pups. Thats why, now when I have a female being bred, I breed her for 2 days in a row only. That keeps the pups all close to the same age and birth size.

Answer 6

I am not a breeder, but I know several who are and have helped with litters in our rescue. I think a few pups dying is unavoidable, but if you are having more pups die than just one ot two here or there, then something is wrong. If a pup is dying in every single litter you produce or if a certain female is losing more than her fair share then that is a good sign that either the breeder sucks or that female should not be bred again. I think too many breeders think a certain percentage is just an acceptable loss and don't look into the WHYS of it. Like a said, one here or there is unavoidable, but if the litters you are producing are weak, if puppies are fading, etc., then something is really wrong.

Answer 7

I have had two litters of Shih Tzu pups. I lost 1 pup per litter. My first litter was 9 puppies and the second was 7 puppies. So, I guess you would say, statistically speaking I have a 12.5% loss.

However, you are also dealing with a toy breed dog that has litters that are not typical for her breed. So, that will throw a wrench in the works.

Answer 8

out of 6 litters ( 7,7,6,10,5,12) this ***** only lost 2 and it was in the last litter. a fabulous (now spayed) female that resides on the couch at age 11!! The 2 she lost one was still born and the other faded over 12 hour period.

add* so basically, i would say that "0" is an acceptable number. it is very important to have a healthy female prior to breeding and as important for her to remain healthy thru pregnancy. there should never be a puppy death. i was very upset when mine lost the 2.

Answer 9

I foster pregnant dogs from my local shelter usually about twice a year. Mind you most of these dogs are mixed breeds that were found homeless and often time dehydrated and under weight. To be very honest with you, in the total 8 births in my home I've never had a still birth, only one puppy died two days later from a birth defect.

Answer 10

I am not a breeder but I have read several books written by breeders. One who bred rottweilers said that she "never tries to revive them [the sickly pups]; the mother knows better than we do and rejects them for a reason". She went on to say that for her, a sickly one who dies turns up every 2 litters.