Fellow atheists: Do you sometimes get the impression that (details) ?

Question

Fellow atheists: Do you sometimes get the impression that we actually take this religion business rather more seriously than the godsters do? And if so, what might be the reason(s) for this?

What I mean is: They dodge and weave, make up untenable explanations, constantly revise their definitions and insist that we're misconstruing them no matter what they claim. It's been a long time since high school debate team but I'm certain that if any of us had ever indulged in such tactics, our coach would have benched us and told us to quit wasting his time.

Impressions? Speculations? "WMA, are you short on caffeine this morning?" . . . .

(Aside to believers: You're welcome to weigh in on this, or you can sit it out and say a prayer for us heathens, if you like.)

Interesting. Many of you have reminded me that taking the other side seriously means, first and foremost, understanding that they mean what they say. Sam Harris makes that point in "The End of Faith" -- the Islamists are not kidding when they say that Western civilization has to go.

Answer 1

Yeah...I see what you're getting at, WMA - like a switcheroo on the fact that the people who believe in the existence of "the Devil" aren't devil-worshippers but Christians lol

I don't, however, think we take it more "seriously" than believers do. Some of them take it seriously enough to kill for it. But I do think that we take a more serious approach to the "rules" of solid debate, certainly. But then that's the curse of rationalism, isn't it? If we're going to demand that things make sense, then we have to fight the battle in a way that makes sense. If your key argument is "God did it", then God can twist and turn and reinvent and reinterpret just as much as he likes, and isn't bound by our petty human rules...y'know, like logic? And so by extension, neither are his followers, who believe he represents a better solution than what we can reach by using logic and evidential burdens.

Answer 2

Most of the time I don't take this seriously. What I do take seriously is the misconception that Christians have with atheists and the laws they are trying to force on others. What I worry about is personal freedom. We don't have too much of that. Christians say they are prosecuted. Maybe they have a point. All I know is if I tell people I'm an atheist half the time I'm treated as a 2nd. class citizen or even "removed" from a job. I don't see this happening to Christians. They can stand up and proudly say they are Christians without repercussions. Sure we make fun of them on TV and such, but does that really interfere with there personal freedom? NO! But ours is. We ARE still prosecuted against. This isn't a belief as with Christians. It's a fact.

Answer 3

Well one must consider that most godsters are RAISED as godsters, and they are taught that the bible is the one true truth in the world. Me being raised as a godster, I found myself first hungry to read the Bible to find the truth and backed it up faithfully because that is what I was taught.

This is where it splits

most godsters stop at that point and have a bit on knowledge on the Bible and basically just go through the motions at church but are there mainly for networking

Then there are those like me that can go 2 routes do their own translation of the hebrew Bible and translate it (Unbiased) or search other theories such as Buddism or Islam, or New age, or Scientology. I have studied them all in a better to understand what God is to me and religion is to the world.

The True teachings of Jesus according to The Gospel of Thomas ( Dead sea Scrolls deemed un-authintic by the catholic church and thus disreguarded) is...
Selflessness of oneself, make every decision of your life in an effort to help the majority of humanity. When one can truly live ones life in such a way(which is inpossible in this individualized capitolistic society) I feel that one truly begins to change. One begins to sense things different as almost inturned to a cosmic Lattice that connects everyone in the world with everything. It could be interdementional who knows the answers to such things.

But I can tell you that there whas a psychologuist, he is new age(forget his name) but he did studies with 2 twins in different buildings. Brainwave monitoring systems were put on both twins. In this dark room, one twin was blindfolded, the other was given a sequece of a flashing white light. The other twin brainwaves peaked at the same time that the light was flashed to the twin which proves that there is some connection with one another, though we do not understand it yet.

Takes a sip of coffee and passes it

Answer 4

Hey!! Who says heathens don't believe? Maybe it is a use of the term you haven't come across but among Pagans: Heathen describes those who follow the ancient Gods of the Danes, Saxons, Angles, Frisians etc. That would be me then. We very much believe that everybody finds a path in life and something which makes sense of the universe to them. Just because I gain from my beliefs that doesn't mean I think everybody will. It doesn't mean that I can't engage in a rational conversation . I admit any shortcomings quite easily once they are pointed out to me. I love a logical debate. I Agree that people from fundamentalist religions of all kinds tend to bluster when they find themselves challenged. I think mainly because they have completely missed the point of their own religion and are using it as an emotional crutch.

Answer 5

i'm a Christian. at circumstances i bypass throughout the motions. I do stay in a international the place I do get drained and weary. yet I do have self assurance what I carry forth. i think that if one would not be attentive to Jesus as Savior they'll spend an eternity in hell. i be attentive to you're actually not threatened by utilising this fact, yet you do ought to be attentive to this. For once you stand till now God you would be devoid of excuse. If atheism provides me greater effective than this then please tell me approximately it, and that i will develop into an atheists. Revelation 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there will be not greater dying, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any further soreness: for the former issues are exceeded directly to the comprehensive beyond.

Answer 6

You do make a good point, and they try that with me too.

I am not an athiest, but I am not a Christian either.

People that do that are not trying to convince YOU, they are trying to convince THEMSELVES.

Their own doubt plagues them, and they will try to "prove" their point with these tactics, or else they have failed in their own faith.

An athiest doesn't have to do that, because when new facts are presented, they do not have to evaluate if they are sac religious, such as evolution.

Scientists don't have all the facts, that is why there are new discoveries. Quantum physics has nearly proven that nothing truly exists, but the Buddhists have believed that for centuries, which doesn't mean we should all follow Buddha, just that it was essentially right.

Hmmm. I could use a cup of coffee, (to drink), so I will get one!

Answer 7

No, I actually know exactly what you are saying. I care passionately about the truth and will never duck or weave or use circular arguments. I'll always try and find the context if I am quoting.

So often I find creationists and wotnot just plain lying and dissembling with no shame whatsoever. It's not that they aren;t serious though, i think they are so serious that they will do *anything* to prove their religion, including fabrication. It's like they are secretly scared to be wrong.

I love being wrong, it's how I learn. It makes me so mad when religionists call me a 'liar' because I don't believe in their deity. If that isn't a dishonest accusation, then nothing is...

(passes the coffee)

Answer 8

I take my arguments seriously because I'm usually ganged up on whenever we have a theistic debate in the class, I'm the only atheist in the class, and there are only 6 known atheists in the entire school! I usually have to be serious and die hard because otherwise, I'd be stoned (trust me, it happened to me once before.) I understand others point of view on the Christan side, since I came from that particular mindset, but they are the ones that seem to fail at looking at it from another angle, atheistic or otherwise.

Hope this helps! ^_^

Answer 9

I think that some do, and some don't. I think that the matter of "faith" makes it seem like some believers who DO take religion seriously, don't, because it's hard for us to imagine that someone who believes in something based solely on faith, and devote their lives to that thing, are taking it seriously. I think that in our minds, it seems *so* incomprehensible to decide to just give over to faith in the face of no evidence, that it seems to us that faith equals laziness.
On the other hand, I do know that I, personally, started to take religion much more seriously once I started to doubt it. I never researched religion, or spent as much time thinking about it and worrying about it, as I did after that. I never searched for God with as much ferver as I did then. It actually took me years to stop fighting to "save my faith", and just acknowledge that I was atheist, because growing up a believer, I was perfectly aware of how serious a thing it could be *IF* I was wrong. I think that most believers don't realize that the majority of atheists don't just give up believing in God at the drop of a hat.

Answer 10

Yes, I believe WE do. I prefer knowing the truth. I prefer using my brain, using reason and logic. It seems so many [at least on this site] are terrified of living - Rapture? The religious communities are so confused and disoriented. They cannot and will not see this thus making it impossible to reason with them.

They do not seem to notice the hold their belief has on them. To live with so much fear and lack of reason causing so much ignorance is astounding. So many of them issue the statement "I know all I need to know from the bible".

Should we all read 'Snoopy Goes Home' and make the claim that it is the truth? One book? The arrogance of having the one and only truth, of being able to know the mind of their so called creator and to think this world was created especially for them and their beliefs is ridiculous.

I don't want their prayers, I don't want their foolish ideas promoted in any way. I want them to stop with their almighty proclamations of truth and wisdom that takes away their freedom and puts them in danger of a force that is so "evil" it can no longer be distinguished.