As a vegan/vegetarian, is there a nutritionist, doctor or scientist on planet Earth that can present evidence?

Question

against what you believe whereas you believe the evidence?

It seems no matter what the evidence or who the presenter, they are meat industry shills, yet you cling unwaveringly to what could be considered veger shills.

What is the criteria for an authority that both sides can agree upon?

sandstorm---I believe we have met at the common ground on this point and moderation is definitely the best path no matter what the subject.

You gave a good answer and I appreciate your effort. It's too bad most people (on either side) can't match it. Krister gives good answers when he's not being curt.

I've really learned a lot from you folks on a subject I hardly gave a crap about a few weeks ago. You all should be proud. Really.

Also, thank you for presenting what you'd call acceptable sources.

krister---the Asians during the Chou dynasty learned to ferment the soy and they ate fermented soy. Today, most products are made with unfermented soy which hasn't had it's toxins purged.

Are you saying that the Asian world has been using unfermented soy all of this time?

krister---"I'm not trying to be a smart @ss at the moment."---that's funny..LOL

evil----you didn't answer the questions asked.

divinity-----I believe you, but I also believe that if I posted here that my doctor said I should not eat soy, people would claim my doctor was paid off by the meat industry. I've learned that most answers here are knee-jerk and conditioned.

krister----the Asians learned how to ferment soy over 1500 years ago. Do we really know how the soy affected those people before that? I don't think there's any knowledge of that at all and if there is, link it dude!

Answer 1

Criteria:

1. Their research should have been conducted in a scientific manner (yes, there IS unscientific research, believe it or not). This includes (but is not limited to) multiple replicates and a proper statistical framework.

2. It should be repeatable by anyone with the appropriate skills.

3. It should not involve hearsay, half-baked 'facts' or excessive speculation.

Example: "I fed tofu to my grandma and she got breast cancer" doesn't mean tofu causes breast cancer. A version of this 'research' is what your role models like the Weston Price Foundation are doing.

4. It should find its way into the appropriate journal (in this case, it would be a Food Science or Biology related journal). That usually means it has been reviewed and deemed acceptable (but even then it's not foolproof!).

5. It shoud be a reputable journal. Food Science Journal of Afghanistan doesn't count.

The vast majority of scientists and doctors agree that a vegetarian diet is as healthy as ,if not healthier, than an omnivorous diet. What more do you want?

Edit: Regarding the big soy debate, there is plenty of contradictory information, both at the academic level and at the 'shill' level. Until that debate is resolved, I'm going to stick to eating *moderate* amounts of soy as part of a balanced diet. That's because I like the taste of tofu. Of course, one shouldn't HAVE to eat soy. There are many other sources of plant protein.

Oh and thank you :-)

Answer 2

I don't see anything that you have presented as able to defeat the evidence that thousands of years of human experience has provided.

I'm not trying to be a smart @ss at the moment.

I agree that soy formula and GMO soy is very bad.

Breast is best.

--------------------------------------------------

Asian peoples have been using fermented AND unfermented soy for a long time.

To be honest, I think that you sound a bit crazy to suggest that unfermented tofu and soy milk use hasn't been widespread throughout Asia for a LOOOOONG time.

People in China and Japan have even been using edamame all of this time as well. Edamame is as far from fermented as you can get. I'm confused as to how you would be lead to believe that unfermented soy has become some sort of taboo ever since they discovered how to ferment soy. It's, in fact, been quite the opposite.

Answer 3

I was advised to limit my intake of meat by my doctor, that's enough evidence for me to stay away from it :S
If you had a medical condition directing linked to eating soy products, or a condition that may worsen from soy products then of course people would have to accept your doctor telling you to stay away from soy. However these claims against soy are pretty recent, where as it is no secret that meat contains cholesterol and saturated fat, of course not everyone has a "broken" heart (that's what I like to call it :D ) like me.

Answer 4

I have some basic education in nutrition through my degree in health information administration and one year of nursing school.

My wife has a masters in nutrition.

I don't automatically believe everything I hear even if it does come from a vegetarian source.

Anything that somebody comes up with has to be supported by the medical profession as a whole and by the American Dietetic Association for me to consider it credible.

Answer 5

It's already been established that veg*n diets can be healthy.