Atheists v. Christians.... which side really has the best case?

Question

Christians and Atheists!!! We all know why we're at eachother's throats here at R&S. We're fighting over fence straddlers! The I-haven't-decided-yets. The fence straddlers 9 times out of 10 are looking for is the side that can present the best case.

So... WITHOUT insulting the opposing side, I would like to give everyone the chance to represent their positions

1. Please briefly state your position (Atheist or Christian).

2. List THE MOST convincing argument/or arguments you have to back your position (it can be a single thing or 100 things… flaws in logic, contradicting bible verses, fulfilled prophesies, scientific/historic evidence against/for the bible. a miracle witnessed, personal testimony, whatever. Be origional.)

As for this Q& A session: the position with the most arguments wins (arguments, not entries & they must be legitimate arguments. no sarcasm. no insults.)… whomever has the highest rated post on the winning side gets best answer.

GOOD LUCK!!!

Answer 1

You may not have realised this but a vast majority of atheists don't care what other people believe.It's only when others try to force their beliefs onto us that we object

Answer 2

Andre is wrong, if before the big bang, everything was anti-matter, it only takes one molecule of matter to have sprung into existence to set off the massive chain reaction that we call the big bang.

My argument, is OK Christians, you have a God, and this god is the creator of the universe, so what about all the other Gods that came before? Ra, Odin, Osiris, Thor, Zeus, Gaia and all the other? Why are they mythology and not religion?

The common factor is that humans have always found ways to explain things, and there you are a small minded human, and this giant ball of fire comes up each morning and warms you and makes your crops grow etc, where does it come from, how does it move across the sky? It's not a massive leap to think that someone made it all happen and that this someone must be someone very special and powerful. There we have the formation of all religions.

How do things we can't comprehend happen? It is not within human nature to say, don't know, ask me one on capital cities. No man will look for an answer no matter how wrong or fantastical it is.

Then we have another defining human trait...power. Someone comes along saying I know who makes the sun come up in the morning. This person becomes powerful. Knowledge is power. This man now has respect and power. He says that the great God Ra or Apollo, or Helios, or Sol, or Savita makes the Sun come up and this person knows how to please this God.. Low and behold we have religion!

It's not just Christianity, all religion is borne of ignorance and the desire for understanding. Is that wrong, hell no, without any other answers, what was mankind meant to do?

No in this day and age the evil is not religion, it is hypocrisy. Jews having the odd rasher of "Penguin" meat Muslims having a private bar in their houses. The Australian Catholic arch-bishop demanding that all Catholics boycott any service or product related in any way shape and form to the makers of South Park, after an episode that lampooned the church... so much for turning the other cheek, eh Arch-bishop???

Then lets us not forget all the killing that has happened in the name of religion. The countless billions of people who have died in the name of God?

The other evidence I have is all the thumbs down I'll get for this answer. If everyone truly just believed in the writing of any of their religious books, then I wouldn't get a single thumbs down. Let us see eh?

Answer 3

My position is:

Religious Atheist

Both Christians and non-religious Atheists would support their arguments over the existence of a God. Obviously there is nothing that would compel the other side to switch in either case.

My own perspective is that of someone who does not worry about the question, therefore does not need an answer to it.

My religion focuses mainly on living a productive and morally sound life. The existence or non-existence of a God is completely irrelevant. What matters is the way we choose to live our life right here right now. Be good to others, and respect everybody, with their beliefs included. Surely if there IS a God, He could not disagree with this? If there isn't, the rewards in life would be more than enough to ensure a peaceful death.

So my position is that there MIGHT be a God, but whether there is or not is absolutely nothing to do with me.

Not only is it my religious position, it also seems (to me) to be the most logical argument. After all, nobody likes fighting, and most of the fighting revolves around this question.

If I were forced to claim there WAS a God, I would use the label for myself, because I have the utmost power and responsibility regarding the rest of my life, and can also have heavy influence on others. Surely, following this fact, it can be a logical argument to say that any one decision of mine has the potential to make a global difference. Omnipotence for the insignificant, ladies and gents.

((((hugs))))

May peace go with you throughout your life

Answer 4

I note that you two times capitalized the adjective "atheist." because it truly is not a noun, like, say, "Christianity," the note atheist isn't capitalized. purely those who crazily insist that atheism is a "faith" are susceptible to capitalize the note, oftentimes as a ploy to "stick it" to those non-believers. So, in holding with that remark, i will wager that you're, in reality, a religionist, likely a Christian, and also you're adverse to the perception of atheism. If i'm incorrect, sue me. at the same time as I also imagine that maximum (i.e., ALL) religious human beings are delusional, I actual do not understand common the top thanks to attach the note "paranoid" to atheists. It purely would not make experience. Paranoid about what?! As a lifelong healthful and satisfied atheist, I actual have by no skill been paranoid about something, now to not educate those who struggle through religious-depending delusions. I purely experience sorry for them. it truly is our compassion you neglected on your rush to call atheists paranoid.

Answer 5

well, the answers you get are going to be biased. Just saying

Ok. I think that atheists have the best case, because I'm one. Atheists don't really try to convert people.

1. contradictions in the bible
2. impossibilities- omnipotent and omniscient
3. when people say the bible is proof that god exists, you have to believe in gods existence firstto believe that the bible is proof
4. in my opinion, there is more evidence against stuff in the bible, such as the ressurection and creation
5. why would a good god kill people just because?
6. why does a good god dwell in darkness anyway, and why is there evil? If god is good and in control of everything, and creater of everything, the god must have created evil. So, god can't be totally good
7. who created god?
8. If god knows everything that will happen, then obviously there's no free will and if you're punished it's not your fault-it's because he knew that it would happen. What kind of good kind loving god would do that, seriously?
9. No proof/evidence
10. how can one person die for everyone's sins? And if he really wanted to suffer, he should have somehow lived instead of dying.

Answer 6

You pose this question as if Christianity is the only religion that believes in a god. The real debate should be is there such thing as supreme beings? Is there heaven or an after life.

I made my decision a long time ago based on the following: If there are so many different religions in the world- how can there be a right one. I believe religions were created to explain the unexplainable and help keep order. Religious institution are legal bodies - an in the US do not hold much power indivually any longer.

Good luck on your quest - but please remember all the other religions of the world.

Answer 7

The first response is false; something can come out of nothing -- it's called virtual particles, and you can do experiments to demonstrate their existence. But, even if the claim were true, and there were a god who pushed the button some 13.6 billion years ago to start the universe moving, that does not show that that god (or any god) has any interest, let alone intervention, in human affairs.

The real bottom line here is evidence. There simply isn't any to support the existence of any sort of god; there is a fair amount showing that no such thing exists [ref. 1]. Christianity is based on the notion of original sin, which is in turn based on biblical tales which are now known to be false on the basis of more evidence than anyone here would have time to read. Without sin, salvation becomes an empty concept, and to attempt to achieve it is a waste of time.

Noted Catholic theologian Hans Kung examined the question of god in excruciating detail [ref. 2] and correctly concluded that neither the existence nor non-existence of god could be proven on the basis of logic or evidence. Not surprisingly, he chose the affirmative, explicitly acknowledging that it was his choice.

Neither the bible nor the Qur'an makes any convincing case for the existence of god. Both have errors; indeed, the Qur'an is simply a fraud. [Ref. 3, 4, 5]

Answer 8

Atheist -- anyone who spends any time on here will find the best arguments on both sides pretty easily. I think the reason Christians get frustrated with the atheist position is because they want a theory that will explain everything. An all-powerful God explains everything...except His own existence. Atheism cannot provide the answer to everything, because all the answers are not yet known.

This is not my best argument (I'm not sure it is an argument), but as I said, good arguments are posted on Y!A every day -- I'm sure whatever I would say, several people have already said much better.

Answer 9

Atheism
Arguments for:
1) Scientific; no evidence, no deity(s) (the question remains whether a deity would fall within an empirical domain. David Hume makes important arguments for why one would not.(1))
2) Argument from reasoned disbelief (if 1 is found lacking, this becomes weaker as well)
3) Problem of evil (problem, can we know if anything would appear evil to an all-knowing being?)
4) Incoherent theology of most traditions (no need to argue with what has not been adequately articulated)
5) Noone has met the burden of proof to show there is a deity.

Theism
Arguments for:
1) Anslem's Ontological Argument (modern Ontology work has somewhat reduced the efficacy of Kant's rebuttal)
*All other logical (including mathematical) arguments fail.
2) The argument from faith (rebuttal: faith flew planes into buildings)
3) Argument from personal experience (rebuttal: see 1 under Atheism)

Causal argument's cannot work on either side, as causality only applies within space/time, and this excludes 1) God, and 2) the origins of the universe (space/time itself), since there can be no "before" time.

All that we are left with is strong agnosticism (given the rebuttal to 1 under Atheism). An overlooked consequence of saying that a deity dies not fall within an empirical domain is that you are also saying it is irrelevant (it produces no effect within space/time). I am a strong agnostic/irrelevantist.

Answer 10

Atheist, because the Universe and all that is in it did not need God to "create" it.

The Universe is perfectly logical. There is not a single thing that does not make sense. And everything is understandable once we learn enough about it.

God was created out of human need. His creation, in the mind of man, make perfect sense.

The Universe is incredibly vast, so much so that we are but an insignificant speck. It's highly probably that there are or were or will be other civilizations.

The "religious experience" is a trick of the mind as is being in love, experiencing fear, being exhilarated. The same can be said about "being with God" or "feeling his presence".

There is way too much ambiguity in the Bible and the Quran.

There are many religions. All of them cannot be the true religion.

Good and Evil are not forces, they are perceptions.

People are easily duped and very gullible. They also have little control over their egos and cannot admit when they are wrong. Because of this they become increasing adamant, to the point of being irrational, when challenged.

People are mentally and emotional weak as well and need God and religion for support.

Answer 11

1) Agnostic, I think atheists attempt to denounce God, which would be viewed as sinful. I simply don't know what to believe due to lack of concrete evidence.

2) God is described as all powerful and he tests us. According to the bible, in the past he was quite active and always giving messages, sometimes in person. Why doesn't he do this anymore, and why didn't he tell us he didn't want to talk to us anymore? Is he done delivering his message? Why can't he appear when challenged if us having faith in him is so important?

It appears that religion is a tool for social control, and if it is I think the ends justify the means. Their have been numerous times in the past when the man-made leadership (absent any known intervention from God) decided what the tenets of the faith would be; what books go in the bible and what the rules of its institution is. Examples include the Council of Nicea, Emperor Constantine, and the ruling made during the Dark Ages that pre-marital sex was against the church (the policy was meant to control out of control births from un-wed mothers). They just find policy that they think can guide society, and craft it into the religion.

Like I said, I think the ends justify the means to support it. Not to insult anyone, because please keep in mind my point of view, but if people have to believe a fairy tale to have moral values and behave, then so be it. I personally like to borrow Christian morals because I think they are well founded, but I see no reason to follow the religion in its entirety.