If Astrology is pagan, why did 3 Astrologers visit Jesus?

Question

This is a genuine question, please don’t assume I’m anti-Christian.

It is common knowledge that astrology had it’s origin in ancient pagan religion (people thought the stars were gods that gave the people guidance etc).

Why then did pagan men (3 astrologers, AKA 3 wise men), go to do obeisance to Jesus? God required the Israelites to only worship one God, but these men worshipped many…

Barkditch - I'm the one asking the question...

The Bible calls these men magi, or “astrologers,” The connection between magic and astrology is reflected in the visitors’ fascination with the star that had led them to Bethlehem. The Bible clearly condemns all forms of magic and the Babylonian practice of trying to get information from the stars.—Deuteronomy 18:10-12; Isaiah 47:13.

rihannsu - the bible doesn't specifically say what religion the three Magi are (just from the East).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_Magi

To say they were Zoroastrian is speculation. The fact remains however, that they were astrologers, they looked to the stars like they were gods.

Jaye16 - If you read verses like Isaiah 47:13, Deuteronomy 18:10-12, and 2 Corinthians 6:17, 18, you'll realise that the bible not only "makes fun" of things like astrology, but warns people to stay away from it.

The bible promotes looking to God, not the stars.

senor_oso90004 - nice little guessing answer there, however, how much did you base it on; your own speculative opinion or research?

The bibles accuracy has been proven time and time again by archeology (dead sea scrolls etc). The text we have today is very similar to what was originally written. Do you not think that the hundreds/thousands of eye witnesses of Jesus would have had something to say if 30 years later the Gospel writers made up miracles in their text??? Think about it…the Pharisees knew that Jesus performed miracles and they tried their best to HIDE them! Without success.

I stand corrected:

"the account does not say there were three astrologers. People assume they were"

mariskalen kampf Strudl v.Wurst! -

1) Yes the Babylonians studied the solar system...but they still believed the stars etc were gods who directed their lives...so yes, it IS common knowledge.

2) It is the BIBLE that labels worship of any other god as idolatry etc and what we label pagan. Any religion outside of the Israelite’s and Christian religion in the bible is considered pagan.

3) What makes you so sure the 3 wise men had God's backing? They were sent by Herod so he could kill Jesus! God used the men to His advantage, but the men are not to be venerated in any way.

Jaye16 - the wise men were misguided at the start, but then warned by God in a dream to not lead Herod to Jesus. After this event however, the bible doesn't say whether the men became worshipers of the true God or not.

mariskalen kampf Strudl v.Wurst!

Many historians will tell you I'm not making assumptions - research the origin of astology! What has biblical translation got to do with this??? It is the same story in every bible. False prophet??? Eh? You need to stop over analyzing my question so much, you still haven't even answered it yet...

For those who wanted references:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astrology
Astrology didn't start to separate from religion (i.e. believing that the stars are divine and have an influence on life) until around the 18th century. That's when they started studying the stars purely from a scientific standpoint, i.e. Astrono(my). The astrologers in Jesus' day would have believed that the star(s) were divine.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_astrology
Astrology started in Babylon; "the conclusion was drawn that all the great gods had their seats in the heavens": they used to worship the stars.

For those who wanted references:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astrology
Astrology didn't start to separate from religion (i.e. believing that the stars are divine and have an influence on life) until around the 18th century. That's when they started studying the stars purely from a scientific standpoint, i.e. Astrono(my). The astrologers in Jesus' day would have believed that the star(s) were divine.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_astrology
Astrology started in Babylon; "the conclusion was drawn that all the great gods had their seats in the heavens": they used to worship the stars.

Answer 1

Excellent question! The answer is - they knew when and where he was going to be born! How did they know that? The birth of the Messiah, the King of the Jews and the light of the entire world was foretold hundreds of years previous by the Prophet Daniel in the book of Daniel.

Did you know the Israelites were sent to captivity in Babylon during their exile from the promised land? When they were, the king of Babylon(Nebuchadnezzar) took the best and the brightest of the Hebrew young men, changed their names, and made them serve him in this court. Daniel was one of those men. He was known among the "spiritual" advisors to the king(magi) as being a man with real prophetic power & the ability to interpret dreams.

It's no stretch of the imagination to assume that these Persian scholars saved his writings & passed them down for generations until the time that the Messiah was actually born.

The Jews could have figured out the time and place Jesus would be born from their own scriptures, but they weren't thinking about it literally like the Persians were.

Answer 2

Hi Paul, Wow what a response to this question, I can see by this question it stirred a few people up. I wanted to respond to this knowing my beliefs may not be socially accepted. I know you've been reading a bible finding a few things just don't add up? Well it's because there are a lot of missing books and texts in the bible since the bible was edited in 1611 into the King James Version The due to too many questions like yours being asked. Baptists edited and revised it in 1979 to the new King James version a lot of these people on R&S run around preaching with. Sumerian, Babylonian, Mayan and Egyptian Astrologers have been around since 6000 b.c a lot longer than the Pagan religion. The whole bible was edited to remove all reference to extraterrestrial content, from it but they didn't do such a great edit by you finding and questioning this you have almost discovered who god is. Read your question again and what you wrote in brackets. Bright Star, virgin birth son of god, Astrologers, Angels coming from the clouds , the Nephilim , God ascending into the heavens, many gods, etc. Have you seen the medical symbol we still use of two snakes around a sword, these are in all ancient Sumerian, Egyptian, Mayan and Babylonian texts and Pyramids. Then look at a picture of a D.N.A strand .Paul I'll leave you a few site addresses you may find your answer to this and a lot of other questions you find in your bible. When I found this in a bible a while ago and I kept finding more. It really opened my mind up to research and study this and I found out a lot of others have to, cheers mate from Australia.

Answer 3

2 Very Important aspects to this Q.
1A) Jesus' birth, when & where?
2B) Where is Jesus when the astrologers find him?

A- Why do Joseph & Mary travel to Bethlehem?
Romen Empire Ceasar Augustus, decreed every1 return to city of your birth, to register.
Surely, it was 2 God's direction that Ceasar Augustus
made his registration law.
This made it possible for Jesus to b born in Bethlehem,
the city the Scriptures had long before foretold
would be the birthplace of the promised ruler.
A- What marvelous things happen the night Jesus is born?
Out in the fields a bright light gleams
around a group of shepards.
It is Jehovah's glory!
And Jehovah's angel tells them:
"Have no fear, for, look!
I am declaring to you good news of a great joy
that all the ppl will have,
bc there was born to you today a Savior,
who is Christ the Lord, in David's city.
And this is a sign for you:
"you will find an infant bound in cloths and lying in a manger."

A- How do we know that Jesus was not born Dec 25th?
December is a rainy, cold season in Bethlehem.
Shepards would not be out in the fields overnight
w/ their flocks at that time of year.
Also, the Roman Ceasar Augustus would not likely
have required a ppl who were already inclined to revolt against him to make a trip in the dead of winter to register.
Evidently Jesus was born sometime in the early autumn of the year.

B- What shows that the star the astrologers saw
was no ordinary star?
While they were at home in the East,
they saw a new star,
and they have followed it hundreds of miles to Jerusalem.
When they arrive in Jerusalem*, they ask:
"Where is the 1 born king of the Jews?
For we saw his star when we were in the east,
and we have come to do him obeisance."
When King Herod @ Jerusalem hears about this,
he is very upset.
So he calls the chief priests & asks
where the Christ is to be born.
Now, when they leave, an amazing thing happens!
The star they had seen in the east, travels ahead of them.
Clearly, this is no ordinary star,
but it has been specially provided to direct them.
They keep following it until it stops right above the house** where Joseph & Mary are staying.
When they enter into the house**,
they find Mary w/ her **.

B- Why do we know that Satan provided the star
that guides the astrologers?
Who do you think provided the star that moved in the sky to guide the men from the east?
Remember, the star did not guide them directly to Jesus in Bethlehem.
Rather, they were led to Jerusalem where they came in contact w/ King Herod,
who wanted to kill Jesus.
And he would have done so if God had not stepped in
& warned the astrologers not to tell Herod
where Jesus was.
It was God's enemy, Satan the Devil,
who wanted Jesus killed, and he used that star to try to accomplish his purpose.
Matt 2:1-12; Micah 5:2.

Did anyone take notice of the fact that when
God had His angels declaring the birth of the Savior?;
Nothing is said about the star.
That Jehovah did have the birth of His Son,
the Savior of the world announced.
He would have no use,
nor purpose for the men from the east.


* Did you make the connection?
Jesus was born in Bethlehem;
the star lead them to Jerusalem~~ to King Herod...
Not to Jesus.
** Did you Notice?
By the time the men from the east, found Jesus
1-he was not a baby, and
2- not in the manger @ his birth; but in a house.

Even Satan the Devil can turn himself into an angel of light.

Answer 4

Matthew does not specify how many of these men came, nor does he call them "wise men," much less "three kings." He uses the Greek word ma'goi, which means "astrologers."

These astrologers followed a "star" from the east. (Matthew 2:2) But the "star" doesn't lead them to Bethlehem. Rather, it leads them to Jerusalem...to Herod the Great who wanted to kill young Jesus.

The following is a link that take a person to "Jesus' Birth-The Real Story" (As appeared in The Watchtower December 15, 1998):

http://www.watchtower.org/e/19981215/article_02.htm

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Here are a couple of quotes that show exactly what Astrology is:

"[Astrology] is essentially the same as astromancy, DIVINATION by stars." - Universal Standard Encyclopedia, 1955, Vol. 2, p. 471.

"as•trol•o•gy .... DIVINATION that treats of the supposed influences of the stars upon human affairs and of foretelling terrestial events by their positions and aspects" - Webster's Third New International Dictionary, 1962, Merriam-Webster.
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For those who believe in the Bible, Astrology is CONDEMNED IN SCRIPTURE:

"There shall not be found among you any one who...practices DIVINATION.... For whoever does these things is AN ABOMINATION TO THE LORD [JEHOVAH]" - Deut. 18:10-12, RSV. Cf. Is. 47:10-13.
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Here are some links to information that will additionally assist in showing why Astrology is NOT for Christians:

http://www.watchtower.org/e/20050808/article_01.htm

http://www.watchtower.org/e/20001108a/article_01.htm
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There have been many studies and experiments which show that astrology simply does not work.

But MORE IMPORTANT TO CHRISTIANS, is the fact that the Bible condemns it. The following is a link that take a person to JUST A COUPLE of aspects as to why astrology is just physically impractical:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JWquestions-and_answers/message/831

Answer 5

Why is it assumed that astrolgers would be anti-Christian? All of creation reflects the glory of the creator: the position of stars is not random, so there is certainly a mathematical relationship between the earth and everything else in the universe around it. What exactly the position of the stars as we observe them can tell us is largely a matter of speculaton, but nonetheless the Magi received a revelation in a way that was meaningful to them. Yes, we are warned not to practice divination, but the oracular is not condemned. For instance, we are not told what discipline Huldah might have used, but her insights were good enough to attract the attention of powerful people in her day.
Over the centuries, Christian mystics have used art, music, numerology, and runes as meditational devices. Although these may be associated with pagans, such tools do not have to be used in pagan ways. Essentially pagans observe the world around them, so it should not come as a surprise when God reveals Himself to them in a way the Magi could understand.

Answer 6

There are too many weak assumptions in you question, which of course lead to a questionable conclusion. Actually, it is a play on words.

!) You say "it is common knowledge...". Wrong. That is what YOU have been told. Actually, in Sumer and Babylon, where astrology comes from, they knew the solar system very well. They knew the planets and that they circled around the sun, (how many did the Christian church kill or burn for saying that?) not to mention the constellations, which endure until today.

2) You are deriding ancient religion as "pagan". Actually, we do not know what they were. So, we throw them all in one bag and label them "pagan". Tsch, tsch.

3) If you really believe that Jesus is the Messiah, you should be much more respectful when talking about the three wise men who came from Persia. They KNEW who he was, which was no small feat at the time. Who would undertake such a trip with valuable presents if they were not convinced of the importance of that event? A tradition had been handed down, and for centuries they had been observing the sky, looking for his star. When they saw it, they had no doubts.
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You replied

"1) Yes the Babylonians studied the solar system...but they still believed the stars etc were gods who directed their lives...so yes, it IS common knowledge."

Answer: common knowledge does not imply it is a fact.

"2) It is the BIBLE that labels worship of any other god as idolatry etc and what we label pagan. Any religion outside of the Israelite’s and Christian religion in the bible is considered pagan."

A: YOU are saying the three wise men were "pagan", not the Bible.

"3) What makes you so sure the 3 wise men had God's backing? "

A; I did not say that. I said they kenw who Jesus was.

"They were sent by Herod so he could kill Jesus! God used the men to His advantage, but the men are not to be venerated in any way."

A: ????????? They were not "sent" by Herod. He asked them to tell him when they found Jesus. Try to be more rigorous in your statements.


Like I said at the beginning your so-called "sources" are questionable.

For one, if you quote the Bible you should also quote from WHICH bible. For each Bible you quote, I can quote one who will state things very differently. We all know that Bibles have been translated and misinterpreted for centuries, to the point that the meaning has been completely distorted by zealots (like yourself?)

You do not know what the Babilonians were thinking the planets were. You just are QUOTING an unknown source. Your whole question is tainted.

Yet you keep pressing on with false assumptions, which makes you, what? Just another false prophet?
LOL!.
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I answered your question but you will not have it.
You equate astrology to paganism. Wrong.
You equate the three wise men to astrologers. Wrong.
You concluded, based on wrong assumptions, that these men worshiped many gods. Wrong.

THE WISE MEN KNEW WHO JESUS WAS, and they worshiped him.

Yet, many Jews, who definitely were not pagan, did not want to recognize him.

It sounds like you are out on some kind of a witch hunt here.
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Ok, let me turn your question around,

Why are the three wise men who came from Persia, which recognized and WORSHIPED Jesus as the king of the Jews, long before anybody else, called astrologers? This would imply that they were pagans, which, obviously they were not.
..
.

Answer 7

The Truth of all things comes from the Silence within. Everything else will always leave a doubt behind and lead to further speculation and inquiry without end. In the Silence we know and in the mind we believe we know. The vast difference is enough to see played out in the world of ego/mind vs Spirit. Unending speculation is vanity as Paul pointed out. But it will always go on until the Silence within is discovered. Then the mind comes to its end and becomes only a tool rather than the structure itself. Namaste'

Answer 8

My answer is in Line Dancer and Adam's Rib along with Bamby's comments. I don't see the mention or description of the particular so called star here.Remember the star gazers as they were refered to followed that ~star~.They lived or started their long journey no doubt in the Babylonian area and would spend DAYS and perhaps some nights travelling or resting themselves and animals .Nevertheless they followed that ~~star~~TO Herod ,a pronunced enemy of God. My only point is who owned that ~star~.or guided it.These star gazers had to prepare for such a long trip and that ~star ~ had to wait for these weary land travelers perhaps men of age. The so called star could have been a ball of fire as it was close to earth without the effects of the sunshine on it to make it glow.Remember Satin is a master of lies and disguise .

Answer 9

I believe that rihan is correct.

What I don't understand though is where astrology and the belief in it is considered wrong or sinful? As long as a person doesn't WORSHIP astrology, I don't see a problem with this.

*EDIT - No I have to disagree with you, the wise men had faith with GOD who led them from signs in the sky. They had FAITH even though they did not know exactly where God was leading them, and in Matt. 2:12 it states that were divinely warned in a dream to depart another way. You are right though when you say that we are warned against such things as astrology, but not because they are so much wrong (God created them, how wrong could they be?), but mankind has a habit of worshiping the wrong things and forgetting God.

Answer 10

Christianity is & was heavily influenced by various Pagan traditions. The ancient Hebrew Preists were as much into Astrology as were their Pagan contempararies. I'd take the curses against Magick in bits of the Bible with a pinch of salt to be honest. Translated correctly, put in context, they probably aren't as anti-magick as they'd first appear. I think they were a condemnation of the magickal con-men of the day who'd sell you a dodgy natal astrology chart for your child. I don't know! Would need to look into the verses in question in detail.
I'm sure Jesus studied Astrology, if he were a Hebrew Rabbi then he would had to have had done as part of the job training. The Magi present at his birth suggest he was a magickally important child, to Pagans as well as anyone else. Some people postulate he in fact was a Pagan, well sort of.. After all he did go missing in Egypt for years as a young man as lines from the Egyptian Book of the Dead are quoted in the Bible as being said by Jesus, "My fathers house has many mansions".
I'm sure this makes unbelievable & uncomfortable reading for "Christians"(modern-western-Protestants) with the beliefs they have been given?