Mormons, Do you still believe Joseph Smith was a prophet of God?

Question

photo copy : http://www.carm.org/lds/docs/HC_v5_394.gif

Joseph Smith said :

". . .I prophesy in the name of the Lord God of Israel, unless the United States redress the wrongs committed upon the Saints in the state of Missouri and punish the crimes committed by her officers that in a few years the government will be utterly overthrown and wasted, and there will not be so much as a potsherd left . . . " (History of the Church, Vol. 5, p. 394.)

How do you explain this ?

Answer 1

I was baptized as LDS a few years ago, but I no longer believe it's teachings. I have found many things in the "Journal of Discourses" a document of recorded talks from prominent members, church authorities and past prophets (early church) that has caused me to no longer want any association with the LDS church. Just this last year I Iearned of the mountain meadow massacre that happened on Sept 11th 1857. My husband has been an LDS member since the 1970's and had never heard of this until now. I was a history major and I am extremely leary when any group, nation or religion tries to erase segments of thier history that don't reflect on them in a positive way--making it flawless/blameless in other words. I feel that the LDS church has done this numerous times and it is unfortunate because it just discredits them. All it takes is faith strong enough to keep true believing members from even considering any of these accounts. What I have been told when I have asked questions to church members (Bishops even) regarding early church polygamy, racism (I can't call it anything else), the mountain meadows massacre, and false prophesies is, "Don't worry about those things, all you need to worry about it your salvation, God will make it right and someday we'll know the answer to these questions on the other side." I'm sorry, that is asking me to blindly accept these things, without question. Anytime you are shut down for asking legitimate and important questions, there is something seriously wrong--red flags should be waving.

Answer 2

I believe Joseph Smith is a prophet, now and forever.

As for the prophecy, what is there to explain? This isn't the first time God threatened a nation with complete destruction if they did not repent.

I actually looked up several court transcripts of the time concerning the Mormons. I am pleased to say, the United States DID repent and did come clean. The order to exterminate the Saints was repeal. The property that was seized was ordered to be returned. We are now accepted and recognized as a religion, and are free to worship without fear. The government protects our rights. We can build our temples. Utah is a state. We can participate in government as full fledged citizens. If that is not repentence, I don't know what is. So the United States is safe.

This prophecy is not unlike the one Jonah was commanded to deliver. The people he preached to were spared as well. They too repented.

Answer 3

I think Joseph Smith is a prophet, now and ceaselessly. As for the prophecy, what's there to give an explanation for? This is not the primary time God threatened a country with whole destruction if they didn't repent. I honestly regarded up a few courtroom transcripts of the time related to the Mormons. I am joyful to mention, the United States DID repent and did come blank. The order to exterminate the Saints used to be repeal. The estate that used to be seized used to be ordered to be back. We are actually accredited and identified as a faith, and are unfastened to worship with out worry. The govt protects our rights. We can construct our temples. Utah is a state. We can perform govt as complete fledged residents. If that's now not repentence, I have no idea what's. So the United States is nontoxic. This prophecy isn't not like the only Jonah used to be commanded to supply. The humans he preached to have been spared as good. They too repented.

Answer 4

Here's a larger portion of that.

>Dined with Judge Stephen A. Douglas, who is presiding at court. After dinner Judge Douglas requested President Joseph to give him a history of the Missouri persecution, which he did in a very minute manner, for about three hours....President Smith, in concluding his remarks, said that if the government, which received into its coffers the money of citizens for its public lands, while its officials are rolling in luxury at the expense of its public treasury, cannot protect such citizens in their lives and property, it is an old granny anyhow; and I prophesy in the name of the Lord God of Israel, unless the United States redress the wrongs committed upon the Saints in the state of Missouri and punish the crimes committed by her officers that in a few years the government will be utterly overthrown and wasted, and there will not be so much as a potsherd left, for their wickedness in permitting the murder of men, women and children, and the wholesale plunder and extermination of thousands of her citizens to go unpunished, thereby perpetrating a foul and corroding blot upon the fair fame of this great republic, the very thought of which would have caused the high-minded and patriotic framers of the Constitution of the United States to hide their faces with shame. Judge, you will aspire to the presidency of the United States; and if ever you turn your hand against me or the Latter-day Saints, you will feel the weight of the hand of Almighty upon you; and you will live to see and know that I have testified the truth to you; for the conversation of this day will stick to you through life.He [Judge Douglas] appeared very friendly, and acknowledged the truth and propriety of President Smith's remarks<<

You do know that it wasn't all that much later that the south seceded from the union and that in itself can be the government overthrown. So, here's how it is:

a. what did he mean by "overthrown"?

b. Was this an official prophecy? Who wrote it? Why was it not canonized, like all prophecies should be?

c. Why does CARM not include the "prophecy" about Stephen Douglas?? We all know that THAT prophecy came about.

That's how I explain it.

Answer 5

Interesting question. If you examine how the US has treated Mormons since those days, you may find that the United States government is indeed "redressing" the wrongs made by US citizens in the state of Missouri. There are lots of rights, privileges and guarantees now upheld and observed in the Bill of Rights and Constitution that were not done so then. Perhaps the prophecy has been fulfilled and you do not realize it.

So, to anseer your question directly. Yes, I fully believe that Joseph was and is a prophet of God.

Answer 6

US treats mormons pretty darn good now. In fact the US gvt has gone to church disaster relief organizations to help with many of the disasters in recent pasts.

Mormons believe that the US Constitution was divinely directed in order to eventually create a nation with the freedoms and wealth (because money is an issue in this world) to reestablish the fulness of the gospel.
We believe that this land is the promised land and that we will be protected as long as we are still turning twds God and not away from God.

Mormons suffered a lot of persecution in the early days of the restoration. It amazes me how so many anti mormons focus on things like the mountain meadow massacre and taken out of context quotes like these and completely ignore the execution order sent out on all mormons by an official US gvt not to mention the houses burnt to the ground, the mobs killing mormons, the women and children that were literally thrown out of their homes while their husbands were away.

Thru all of that persecution the mormons managed to grow in a way and in a section of the US that noone thought could ever flourish as much as the mormons made it flourish. It helped established routes to the west and establish new cities all across the west to the ocean.

Joseph Smith knew the US would not be destroyed. It was a rather empty threat because he knew the US would grow to be a land where this religion would grow and be succesful. It was a very broad promise that the Book of Mormon speaks of over and over again. When a nation turns away from God it is eventually destroyed. That is what he was talking about. It is a big theme of the Book of Mormon.


andie
I have been a member all my life and have heard about the mountain meadow massacre since I was young. It was never hidden. In fact the Ensign recently did a piece about it.
I think it is funny that everytime someone claims things are hidden in the church they have never seem to be hidden from me. Maybe it is that I actually did what the church has taught me since childhood which is to read up and study all that I can about the church, the teachings and find out for myself the truth of all things. If you choose to close your eyes to things dont blame the church. This is like a college student who never studied claiming that they never were taught about slavery in school. Maybe they just werent paying attention.
You said you werent in the church that long. Do you tihnk this subject is something the church would focus on? Hiding and covering something up is a lot diff then just not really focusing on it. There was someone in here that said mormons were forbidden by the church to see that movie on the massacre. Where do these people get their info. There was never even mention of this movie in the church.
I think people should know what they are talking about before they speak. So many people dont have a clue about mormons and act like they are experts.

Answer 7

Of course they believe he is a prophet of God or else they wouldnt be LDS (mormon) now would they?

Answer 8

Yes! Why should we have to explain the words of a dead man?

Answer 9

actually, this area was laid to waste in the civil war...

Answer 10

Still and always will. I know he was and is.
Nothing can change that.

PRAISE TO THE MAN WHO COMMUNED WITH JEHOVAH