"Vegans": Why are marshmallows considered non-vegan but produce fertilized with rendered animal parts is ok

Question

"oh me-troll, why do you have to keep on etc.."

Just answer the question.

BTW-I'm not a troll because I admire your efforts and I'm not afraid to say so. I just ask tough/unpopular questions. I'm secure with that.

Remember, the question is "why"?

matador----you didn't answer the question asked.

C'mon. Where are all the "vegans" who constantly give my answers thumbs down? You must have an answer yes?

BTW---none of this "at least we're trying, what are YOU doing?" B.S. That's not the point of the question and it doesn't answer the question. Neither does complaining that I'm being unfair. That's a guilty answer.

goody---"True Vegans won't even it veggies that they know are fertilized with animal parts or not even animal manure is acceptable by a true Vegan."

It's true, but expect to get many thumbs down here because the "vegans" here have trouble with the truth.

allie---"Giving up marshmallows is different than giving up vegetables."

The point isn't to give up vegetables, it's to stop calling themselves vegans.

allie--"Being a vegan is about doing everything "within your power" to avoid contributing to animal cruelty.
Marshmallows would fall under "within your power"
Vegetables would not."

That isn't the definition of veganism according to the founder.

"Veganism is a way of living which excludes all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, the animal kingdom, and includes a reverence for life. It applies to the practice of living on the products of the plant kingdom to the exclusion of flesh, fish, fowl, eggs, honey, animal milk and its derivatives, and encourages the use of alternatives for all commodities derived wholly or in part from animals."

Highlight this part: "Veganism is a way of living which excludes all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, the animal kingdom"

It shouldn't be considered a defeat if you can't meet vegan standards. Your efforts are admirable without a doubt. But the vegan bar is set extremely high. Vegans here cheapen the definition.

krister---then you choose to not be vegan. It's your choice. I'm a meat eater yet I admire what you do. Don't ever stop (not that you would).

krister---I read this answer before. It doesn't resonate any truer on this question than the other.

BTW---I didn't thumbs down anyone here, except for the "who cares?" answer. I respect your answers if you answer the question.

Umm..I thumbs down the matador too.

krister---I'm an atheist.....karma and the soul are fantasy to me. I deal in reality.

"Karma weighs down the soul"

lo_mcg--you did not answer the question asked.

mookie---you are offering assumptions about the founder whereas I offer facts about the vegetarians that call themselves vegans. The truth is inescapable.

ryan---you did not answer the question asked.

mookie---I DO believe vegans exist, just not here.

krister---your definition of veganism is a mutated version derived to make the goal easier to reach. It's been changed to increase your numbers because most people are unwilling to sacrifice to reach the goal as the founder dictated.

There needs to be another word to describe you and your ilk. Somewhere between vegan and vegetarian.

Like I've said before "If I have a half of a million dollars am I a millionaire because I'm trying the best I can?".

Answer 1

nothing with animal parts are okay with Vegans. True Vegans won't eat anything with animal in it not even rennents of cheese! True Vegans won't even it veggies that they know are fertilized with animal parts or not even animal manure is acceptable by a true Vegan. I know some vegans and they grow their own veggies.. they told me they used clover because it's high in nitrogen and will erase any animal fertilizer that previous gardeners may have used. They then used mushroom fertilizer to fertilize the soil. They say it costs more than regular fertilizer! After awhile few showed me their garden and things were well grown! My garden looked sick compared to theirs! Oh for marshmallows not all are non-vegan you can get some vegan ones made from bean gum at many health food stores! I often get the bean gum marshmallows for myself! I'm not vegan though I'm a vegetarian!

Answer 2

Vegans often claim that cows are bad for the environment, but manure is the best you can get for growing organic food. I live near an organic farm that actually uses animals (oxen) to plough the fields. They use mules in the harvesting. That is how it was done many years ago, but to some that's exploitation of animals. That was a very interesting question and it is way above the standard of many on here.

Answer 3

We can avoid gelatin without leaving our communities.

We can't grow all of our own produce and other food unless we move out to the middle of nowhere. Even then, how will we pay the mortgage on the land if all that we do is grow and make everything that we need.

People that move out to the middle of nowhere in isolation just so that they can live a "pure vegan" lifestyle are not vegan.

They are selfish sociopaths or poser-Jains at best.

They had the opportunity to live a life as cruelty free as they could among people that didn't understand why they did it and they threw away the possibility of making new friends that may have taken a serious look at the way that they choose to live.

People need to see that a vegan diet can be perfectly healthy.
Those that abandon their communities for personal purity are hypocrites and have deserted their obligations to show those around them what is possible and likely when one does their best to live as cruelty free as is possible in the current state of civilization.

You may want to get in contact with The Vegan Society, the creators of the word "vegan", and let them know that they have been spreading the wrong definition since 1944. It is not about being "100% pure" it is about living as an advocate for those with no voice. If you isolate yourself from society, you have castrated your own influence over those that you live and work with

http://www.vegansociety.com/phpws/index.php?module=faq&FAQ_op=view&FAQ_id=1

You seem to have veganism confused with Jainism, one of the world's oldest religions and arguably the most extreme. The only way to escape the cycle of karma and reincarnation is to lay idle and starve to death. Helping or harming anything or anyone creates karma. Karma weighs down the soul whether it is good or bad, so helping people prevents your soul from achieving it's highest level.

Jainism is about "purity" and veganism isn't. Veganism is about outreach, which is the opposite of what you repeatedly say that it is.

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You refuse to accept the definition of veganism and I have accepted that. I do not post answers for you but for the other users that read your nonsense.

PS - I am an atheist as well but what does that have to do with anything? It still doesn't change the fact that you have confused veganism with Jainism or some other path to purity.

Answer 4

I am not a vegan, but I will answer.
Giving up marshmallows is different than giving up vegetables.
No one can live without vegetables. We all need veggies to survive, whether you eat meat or not you can't deny that vegetables have to be a part of a healthy diet.

So what I am trying to say is that giving up vegetables is out of the question. Giving up marshmallows is a different story. Being a vegan is about doing everything "within your power" to avoid contributing to animal cruelty.
Marshmallows would fall under "within your power"
Vegetables would not.

Not everyone can leave where they live to grow their own veggies.
We have families, jobs, school, lives that are centered in one area, what makes you think that everyone can just pack up and leave when you know that for some it's just not possible?

Edit:
I've read your questions, and I get you point.
You say that the only way to be a "true vegan" is pack up and move to the middle of nowhere, leaving behind family, friends, work, school, just to grow your own food.
I just don't agree with you.
I'd agree with krister, it's not all about "personal purity", it's about animal safety.

Knowing that right now I am doing what I can to avoid contributing to animal suffering. Sure I know that I am not doing everything humanly possible, but I am doing everything that I can, at this point in time, given my circumstances. That's what is important in my eyes.

Like I already said, it isn't about personal purity. I live with meat-eaters, they eat meat around me. Sometimes when they eat chicken, their "chicken air" gets near my food I inhale "chicken air" while I am eating!! Does that make me less of a vegetarian??!!?
By your standards it would...

Answer 5

I think its because its taking it too far.

Most vegans just want to do what they can, in an effort to make thier own world a better place for themselves.

If a vegan was a farmer im sure they most likely wouldnt fertilize with rendered animal parts.

and if a vegan wants to take it as far as your taking it im sure they would buy local organic or grow the food themselves.

for the most part people are happy with thier own level of commitment. there isnt really a massive need to digress down to the atom level for compliance.

the other thing about it, is that its pretty unreasonable for a vegan to turn up at a farmers door and demand things.

Then also on the other side of the coin, im sure non animal based fertilizers are around and i dont think vegans should have to go massivley out of thier way to comply with thier goals.

if theres a reasonable alternative to a animal based one that wont cause any hardship or financial loss to use over the animal based one, then why is there a need to use animals? plant based sources will hurt our environment far less, you know what i mean?

either way, i dont really think your question is a serious question.

your not actually asking for information here, do you actually require the answers to your 'tough questions'? or are you more interested in poking at other people and thier way of life?

Answer 6

You seem to be enjoying this newfound idea of yours because you keep pointing it out it in many of your answers.

If your idea is correct, then Donald Watson, the man who developed the term "vegan", was a hypocrite.

*Gasp!*
*Blasphemy!*

How dare I say that, you ask?

Because he simply lived... that's why I say that. Because along the way, I'm sure he stepped on insects in his garden (if he had one) or bought commercially grown produce, and I'm sure he used some kind of product that had rendered animal parts in it, and I'm sure that he drove a car that had animal parts in its tires (or got chaffeured in one), and he used paper for his newsletters and teachings, which came from trees which housed animals and insects... you understand what I'm getting at, right?

By simply LIVING, an animal is exploited. There is a line between doing intentionally and doing, within reason and practicality, everything in your power to prevent it.

Black Byrus gave the PERFECT answer to your question the other day, but you refuse to accept that vegans do exist.

I could sell my car, move to the countryside, start my own garden.. but that would still not be vegan. Somehow, some way, I would still end up harming an animal in some way.

Answer 7

If you take it that far; then it's impossible to eat an apple without eating some molecule that once belonged to an animal or maybe even your grandfather.

That's beyond the realm of human control.

This is called pedantics; debating about obscure and insignificant details.

The "troll" name is actually guite funny to me. In this case, it reminds of the figures in fairy tales that give the hero some kind of ridiculous riddle to solve.

PS: The Hindu/Jain thing; most people believe Hinduism is older. Jains say their religion is older than Hinduism. Since my wife is Hindu I'm adding my two cents on that. It's irrelevant that the questioner is atheist; any debate on vegetarianism is likely to bring up religion. If you don't want to hear about religion then don't ask questions that are related to religion.

Answer 8

You are as sanctimonious as some of the fanatical contributers to this forum whose egos you are presumably seeking to deflate.

Your questions are not 'tough', they are predictable and easily answered, and have now been answered many times by many people.

Your obsession with the word vegan and with lecturing vegans on what they should be doing and how they should be living, and what they should be calling themselves is tedious.

Perhaps you should choose another word whose etymology is not so straightforward and transfer your obsession to that.

And while you're at it, look up 'temperate', then use it correctly in a sentence. I already live somewhere temperate.

Answer 9

Just a minor correction - the world's oldest religion is Hinduism. Jainism arose as an offshoot (much like Christianity arose from the Jewish religion).

Answer 10

I don't eat marsh mellows..nasty! Maybe people don't understand that the gelatin is made from animal bones