Without Attacks on Anyone Believer and Un-Believer Alike?

Question

Let's talk in reality..
I asked a question of Atheists on taking GOD out of everything and some how the answers you have given are truly unrealistic

I work for a Catholic Hospital, let me tell you the amount of people who are dying from addiction, they have no family no friends no hope and you know who pulls them out of the depths of hell and dispair..GOD....Lindsay's Father Michael Lohan and Daniel Baldwin have spoken eloquently about thier Addiction and they have money, family friends and they still could not get sober
only the Spiritual Path of a 12 Step program leads people to sobriety,
BTW: I work with Addicts I know from what I speak I have seen people to hell and back with Addictions many have died ONLY and I mean only has a !2 Step Program helped an Addict and I have never met an Addict that got sober and became a Atheist by the way..
So are you telling me people can get sober without the Spiritual Path of a 12 Step???

Answer 1

Yes. It is called Will Power.

Answer 2

I am a Christian, and I also work in Mental Health - Addiction - for a doctor at a Rehab Facility. While I know too, just how successful a 12 Step Program including God can be in helping people overcome their addictions, I have seen one or two patients who seem to have pulled their lives together and are currently sober who did not use a 12 step program. Both do have a belief in a higher power though - one a Christian, one happens to be Muslim. Both are on long term prescription drugs intended to keep their cravings at bay. They are missing the support that others in a 12 step program could provide. Of the patients we have who claim no religious belief in a higher power - we do seem to see more struggle, more falling back into their addiction, more non-compliance with treatment, etc. We're not the only one's who notice this, several of the doctors and staff were discussing this very topic just the other day.

To sum up, yes, I think it is POSSIBLE for some people to overcome their addiction without having a strong faith or using a 12 Step Program, but I also think it's much harder. As a Christian, I do believe that God will help us through any of our trials (even addictions) if we ask him to, trust him and do our part too.

To J.P. - it's AWESOME that your Dad was able to make a change in his drinking habits that quickly. It's called sheer willpower, and for a VERY FEW - I mean VERY FEW - it has and can work this way. HOWEVER - there really are people, many, many people who - if they even taste one drop of alcohol - really will find their lives destroyed by their addiction again and will be full-fledged active alcoholics. 12 Step Programs for Alcoholics, as well as other 12 Steps for Narcotics, etc. are wonderful programs that help TONS of addicts maintain a drug/alcohol free lifestyle. One of the 12 Steps is acknowledging that there is a higher power who can help you.

I also agree whole-heartedly with JG-OR " the person does not work on who they are deep down, how they perceive themselves, and any issues they have stuffed down." << 12 Step and other Addiction Recovery programs, if worked hard, honestly and correctly can help a person with all three of these things.

Good luck and many blessings to all who struggle with addiction - even those who aren't ready to deal with it yet.

Answer 3

Yes, people can and do get sober without spiritualism.

In fact, many atheists go through 12 Step programs. When it comes to a higher power, they look at the doorknob to the meeting room as their 'higher power' because it means they are bringing G.O.D. into their lives -- "Good Orderly Direction," not a false belief in a spiritual realm.

In fact, there is growing evidence that 12 Step programs are DANGEROUS, because they convince the person that their addiction is uncontrollable, that they are victims of disease, and totally renders the person powerless.

My father was an alcoholic. His cure came in one day, and not because of any coming to God. It was the day my older sister found him passed out drunk on the floor and said, "Dad...? DAD?! MOOOOOM! DAD'S DEAD!"

And you know what? He enjoys a beer now and then. He'll have a glass of wine with a meal at a fine dining establishment. But since that day, he has never gotten drunk, never lost control and binged.

He took control back from the alcohol and reasserted his OWN control over his life.

That's a LOT better than convincing himself he was a hopeless victim who if he tasted even one drop of alcohol, it would totally destroy him again.

Answer 4

I think their are many paths to becoming sober. It all comes down to the individuals desire to become clean. I think this applies to any form of addiction, chemical or physical.

It is not about a 12 step program or any other form of sobriety. I believe any addiction comes down to the persons heart, do they want, in the core of their being, to become clean. If so, then a 12 step program or any other program can work. Take it one step farther, if, at the same time, the person does not work on who they are deep down, how they perceive themselves, and any issues they have stuffed down. The last three things I mentioned is where true freedom is found, not in 12 steps or even will power!

I admire your compassion and willingness to be used to help people. YOU ROCK SISTER FRIEND!

Answer 5

There are other recovery programs out there that are not spirituality based. Secular Organizations for Sobriety is one. They have people who come through them and get sober. They are relatively new I believe and I don't know of studies comparing success rates. I bet the relapse rate is unfortunately high for spiritual and nonspiritual programs. Addiction is tough. At any rate no one is saying people can't choose to be religious if they want to be just they shouldn't force it on others or that people have to be religious. I know a lot people claim to find religion after making huge mistakes in life and trying to get through addictions but that doesn't justify selling people fantasies. There are other ways of helping people overcome addictions, take responsibility for themselves, and make better choices but I guess they may take a bit more effort and work.

Answer 6

Since God doesn't really exist, you've simply proven that people don't need God to cure an addition.

Of course, you could say that some people need the delusion of God, but the delusion can be anything, or even replaced with medication, such as Wellbutrin.

And since you work in a Catholic Hospital, let's talk for a moment about the vast number of dying patients that are miraculously healed by God, versus those at secular hospitals.

Answer 7

Yes they can, but it's not as easy.
However much I've tried to believe in God, I find it impossible.
In the 12 step programme God replaces the "dependence", which is at the heart of addictions, it's not much to do with physical dependence, (that is over fairly rapidly) He also does your willpower for you.
God fills the hole that was previously filled by alcohol/drugs. It works very well for very many people who retain sobriety.
I see nothing essentially wrong with that if it works for them.
However some people, like myself, prefer to deal with problems ourselves, and with help from the temporal world, as we cannot delude ourselves to the extent of believing in some sort of personal God, or the Higher Power as he is refered to in the 12 step programme.
The way that I regained sobriety was with cognitive behavioral therapy, it was the hardest "thinking" work I have ever done in my life, it is not easy, and you need to really want to "get sober".
Having been to AA meetings, and heard about people doing the steps, I thank God that I didn't have to involve him, or go to those meetings, which were just not me.
Good luck to those that it works for, and also good luck to those who want to get sober by other means, it is pure propaganda to say that the 12 steps is the only way to retain sobriety.

Answer 8

I have two Uncles and one Aunt who got sober without the Spiritual Path of a 12 step. And they've been sober for years.

Answer 9

This is a logical fallacy called “noble lie”. Some people get well due the hope in god doesn't mean that god exist.

So are you telling me people can get sober without the Spiritual Path of a 12 Step???
Yes they can it is called placebo effect, and it has been scientifically demonstrated also.

Answer 10

Many people get sober without and kind of god. There are hundreds of secular 12 step type programs, that naturally you have never heard of because you can't take your air filled head out of a bible for 5 seconds.

Answer 11

No rehabilitation program or 12 step based recovery program could withstand the scrutiny of an independent research study of success rates because such a study would most certainly expose these programs as being no better than no treatment at all. In fact, independent studies have been conducted and reported that conventional treatment and 12 step based programs are frequently less successful than no treatment at all.