Isn't it pernicious &crazy that many citizens either naturalized or nativeborn of immigrants want passionately

Question

to punish undocumented immigrants who came to America for many of the same good reasons they or their ancestors came for when they came to America? Sure we have an immigration problem causing other kinds of problems, like just living is a problem, like population growth is a problem but loathing them, the undocumented immigrants who are here admittedly illegally and who are not criminals except by the loathing blanket definition of their haters is draconian, uncaring, and hypocritical. In fact it may be logically contradictory and unamerican.

Just where does the vituperative desire so many have to punish them come from? Are we seeking a solution or revenge? You tell me!

I'm anti-hatred, anti-bigotry, and pro-caring and pro-logical who sees so many acting the ways and manners I am against. I said we have a problem but I am trying to put it in historical and logical perspective. I don't like the mob mentality of the hoi poloi who call someone else's kettle black when they also carry a black kettle.

I have asked other Q's related to the immigration problem hoping to bring common sense into play. Some of those Q's are still open to answers.

I'm glad no one has called me names or attempt any put downs or used insults to make their points. Anger is OK but we can channel it to seek positive solutions through critical thinking and a positive attitude. I hope We all don't want the US to become a police state conducting an inquisition against 12 million illegal immigrants.

Not to understand history and not to have a memory of the past is a mistake that can be overcome. Soren Kirkegaard, the christian existentialist philosopher, once said famously, to paraphrase him, "we all live moving forward while looking backward from time to time."

To the people who minimize the importance of history and knowledge of the past: I guess there is no point to learning how Newton back in the 17th century @ 1680's or 90's discovered the law of gravity and used it to explain how apples fall and the planets revolve the sun in elliptical orbits? If the Past is so irrelevant to the present why do we have the gift of long term memories and a language ability to communicate with others about the past in the present?

My serious and carefully phrased Q is a reality check for those who read the Q carefully and think about the problem that has to be solved so every one wins in the future.

My Q is not arguing on behalf of repeating past mistakes regarding the immigration problem. So I hope you who think I am doing by asking a thoughtfull Q will avoid plastering me with that dirty paint, speaking metaphorically that is.

Use of caps is unnecessary internet screaming and it does not help support, much less prove your repetitive assertions.

all of us learn from past experience and the example I gave about Newton happened to be a direct rebuttal of the position that the past is not relevant to us in the present. It happened to be in science but it could have been something else. We learn from our past mistakes and accomplishments in all areas of knowledge. It would be myopic to assert otherwise.

Answer 1

People who come migrate to another country legally jump through all sorts of hoops to get their citizenship, they don't appreciate people getting the same things they're entitled to just because they knew a back passage.

It's like waiting in line to see a movie for 5 hours only to see someone push, and elbow everyone out of the way and get in after 2 minutes (and not pay for the privledge either).

Answer 2

Times and objectives have changed since 1900. It doesn't matter if they haven't committed acts of violence, because in my (and fellow legal Americans) books, it is still a crime!

Times have changed. We can't keep having this happen in this country. Work, opportunities, and chances are becoming increasingly hard to come by. These opportunities should be saved for us! You should NOT have any say (if you weren't born here or are illegal)...

Answer 3

nope sorry there are criminal illegals my ex was one of them.

and i don't care, if you were born here you are a u.s citizen and have every right to express yourself.

you need a reality check.



***ADDITIONAL***
and your quote does you no justice, it means look at the past see what it has done for us. and move on towards the future.

it does not mean repeat the pass as you see fit.

if we kept repeating our past we'd be stuck in the same exact place. the past consisted of a different era in life. much harder and very unruly. now "the future" the united states has established itself. and iS very different from the "past" so we can not repeat the "past" we can only move forward. to do so we've established rules to govern us and to protect our economy. illegals are harming us. legal immigrants do not harm us. we cannot as a nation take in every single person in this world. we will have a collapse. WHY? because the past you refer to had significantly less people. now look at 2007. finacially our goverment our economy cannot handle much more. we are already at 300 million people. now that is a lot different then how much we had in the past.

additional again....

YOU ARE REFFERENING TO TWO DIFFERENT KINDS OF PAST. SCIENCE AND HISTORICAL HISTORY.

ALTHOUGH SCIENCE AND HISTORY DO HELP US LEARN FROM THE PAST YOU CANNOT APPLY OLD HISTORICAL HISTORY TO OUR SITUATION RIGHT NOW. THERE IS NO WAY YOU CAN JUSTIFY DOING THAT. THOSE WERE TWO DIFFERENT WORLDS.

SCIENCE HELPS US PROGRESS, WE LEARN FROM IT. WE PROGRESS FROM IT. BUT JUST REMEMBER IT IS ALWAYS EVOLVING, WHAT WE BELIEVE YESTERDAY AS SCIENCE WILL CHANGE TOMORROW BECAUSE WE ARE ALWAYS FINDING OUT NEW THINGS.

HISTORICAL HISTORY, YOU CANNOT CHANGE. BECAUSE THAT IS HISTORY. OF COURSE UNLESS SOMETHING NEW IS DISCOVERED.

ANYWAYS. WE LEARN FROM OUR HISTORY. BUT WE SHOULD NOT REPEAT IT. BECAUSE WE'D STILL BE IN THE SAME PLACE. IMMIGRATION WAS A NECCESITY HUNDREDS OF YEARS AGO BUT TODAY IT IS NOT PRACTICAL.


AND YOU CAN;T TWO-FACE YOUR QUESTION, IT IS WHAT IT IS.




"Isn't it pernicious &crazy that many citizens either naturalized or nativeborn of immigrants want passionately
to punish undocumented immigrants who came to America for many of the same good reasons they or their ancestors came for when they came to America?"


THIS IS WHAT I'M REFERENING TO.

Answer 4

wow we got interesting people here specially JConly from the newly built trailer park in west Michigan. as long as we got people like Jconly who can read and write.....illegals aren't going anywhere. that guy is not only attaking illegals but all the legal immigrants. he is talking about ancestors like he has actually done something for this country besides making a carrier out of collecting social security.
if people like JConly attack all immigrants then obviously all the minorities, plus more...will feel sympathetic towards illegals and they wont go anywhere without a civil war.
and to answer your question, i totally agree with you. so far we only have about 14 to 20 million illegals which is about .046% of your population. deportation is not ethical but total amnesty is also not right. we should kick illegals out who have commited crimes and let the families and hard working people stay in the country. but first we should build a big wall between mehico and usa so more illegals can't come in the country.

Answer 5

This is a common tactic of the pro immigration crowd. They refuse to admit that this argument is weak and flawed. You simply cannont compare those who originally immigrated to America to those immigrating to America today. Then America was and undeveloped and non-industrialized nation. Those who originally immigrated to America deveolped it, passed immigration laws, and turned it into the great industrialized nation that it is today. To make this comparison is a far stretch and obvious the pro immigration crowd has no further tools of persuasion left in their weak arsenel.

Hey "Pro-Bush" bet you didn't know I risked my life defending your right to put me down during the first gulf war as an officer in the Air Force. Would you be brave enough to say something like that not just to me but to any military officer? How about any of the enlisted military men and women who also defend your right? I didn't think so. Think before you speak and you will not make out to be such the fool you are. Care to re-phrase your statement on what I have done for not just you but for every single citizen of the United States? Didn't think so. There are much better men and women than you who will do so on your behalf.

Answer 6

I don't know about you but I'm a Native American. Born and raised in Phoenix, Arizona. I am of Irish/Norman decent but I was born HERE. That makes me a NATIVE. If I want to keep people that want to come here illegally out, that is my right as a Native American citizen. You can't really call me a hater because I don't hate illegals. They are criminals plain and simple.

Answer 7

I think its crazy to try and compare 300 years ago to today.

And if you will read, most people arent tryin to punish them, they are trying to change how things are so that the illegals are not financially punishing us.

Answer 8

no. the people who came here legally worked hard to do so. illegals broke the rules, the same rules the the immigrants criticizing them had to follow.

if i worked to earn money to buy an xbox, id be mad that everyone else stole one from the store

Answer 9

man, i could have sworn i was in 2007 and not the 1800s. why do people bring the past up to justify the wrong doings of illegals? go figure.

Answer 10

FOR THE LAST TIME, IF YOU WERE BORN HERE YOU ARE NOT AN IMMIGRANT! LEGAL CITIZENS HAVE THE RIGHT TO KICK ILLEGALS OUT OF THEIR COUNTRY.