Spiritual leader claims Christians misread Romans 1:26-27. --How do you feel about this ?

Question

In the news
Tuesday, April 17, 2007; 5:47 PM
Anglican Head Williams Says Anti-Gays Misread Bible

The spiritual leader of the world's 77 million Anglicans has said conservative Christians who cite the Bible to condemn homosexuality are misreading a key passage written by Saint Paul almost 2,000 years ago.

Archbishop of Canterbury Rowan Williams, addressing theology students in Toronto, said an oft-quoted passage in Paul's Epistle to the Romans was meant to warn Christians not to be self-righteous when they see others fall into sin.
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How is this misread? Paul's meaning is very clear--

"Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/04/17/AR2007041701351.html

Answer 1

Romans 1:24-32(New Living Translation)
So God abandoned them to do whatever shameful things their hearts desired. As a result, they did vile and degrading things with each other’s bodies. They traded the truth about God for a lie. So they worshiped and served the things God created instead of the Creator himself, who is worthy of eternal praise! Amen. That is why God abandoned them to their shameful desires. Even the women turned against the natural way to have sex and instead indulged in sex with each other. And the men, instead of having normal sexual relations with women, burned with lust for each other. Men did shameful things with other men, and as a result of this sin, they suffered within themselves the penalty they deserved.

Since they thought it foolish to acknowledge God, he abandoned them to their foolish thinking and let them do things that should never be done. Their lives became full of every kind of wickedness, sin, greed, hate, envy, murder, quarreling, deception, malicious behavior, and gossip. They are backstabbers, haters of God, insolent, proud, and boastful. They invent new ways of sinning, and they disobey their parents. They refuse to understand, break their promises, are heartless, and have no mercy. They know God’s justice requires that those who do these things deserve to die, yet they do them anyway. Worse yet, they encourage others to do them, too.
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they are allowing cultures to conform the word to themselves instead of conforming to God's way....

i went on thru verse 32 because that whole next paragraph holds so much!

sad that church leaders are succumbing to the ways of the world instead of standing on the word of God

Answer 2

That is a good question, of course. Particularly when someone tries to strip scripture of its divinely-inspired power to teach.

Really, what understanding is harmonious with all the scriptures that deal with sexual intimacy between people of the same gender? What understanding is harmonious with the context here in Romans? Which understanding is in agreement with the rest of the Bible?

If a person or group focuses on a particular scripture that clearly condemns a particular behavior, as in the present case, attaches to it a meaning altogether different from that intended by the divine source of the scripture as well as the writer used to record it, while at the same time ignoring all other portions of the Bible dealing with the same subject; then that person or group is simply constructing a new meaning for the scripture. The person has no authority – divine or otherwise – to do such a thing. Moreover, that person has manifested what is truly in his heart; he does not really want God's teaching on the matter; he wants his own and maybe those of some other imperfect human. True Christians are altogether different. They want to know what God wants – what is pleasing to Him.

So when all the artful contrivings, quibblings and linguistic gymnastics are over, the bald fact remains that each and every scripture referencing sexual intimacy between people of the same gender speaks of this conduct negatively and the conduct stands condemned – no ambiguity, no questions, no concessions. True Christians do not try to circumvent the clear moral laws found in God's word the Bible; nor do they resort to philosophical arguments and explanations in order to sidestep what the Bible clearly says or to justify the conduct practiced by persons who have obviously discarded the moral standards contained therein. True Christians want to know how God feels about a matter, since he teaches us to benefit ourselves. And he teaches that this behavior is wrong.

Hannah J Paul

Answer 3

"Be not deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolators, nor adulterers, nor effeminate [the "passive" or "female" partner in homosexuality], nor abusers of themselves with mankind [the "active", the "male" of the homosexual partnership], nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. (1 Cor. 6:9-10, KJV).
Presumably the Archdruid of Canterbury also believes that these things mean we are not to be self-righteous, and Paul, under inspiration of the Holy Spirit, was lying when he wrote the above.
"But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone; which is the second death." (Rev. 21:8, KJV).
Presumably too John was not to be taken literally when he wrote these words said by God Himself. Therefore God is a liar, and will be in the lake of fire? I think not!
Is it any wonder that the church in the UK is regarded as irrelevant when the LEADERS say such things? It's actually yet another sign of the times (apostasy, or falling away from the faith) prophesied for the last days before the Tribulation. Maranatha (Come, Lord Jesus)!

Answer 4

If the Archbishop of Canterbury condones homosexual activity and ignores the very clear meaning of Apostle Paul, then I understand why many people fled England and the Church of England. This Rowan Williams teaches heresy and false doctrine. We are to flee from such people and leave them alone.

I agree with the statement of self-righteousness because the sin of abortion if no different or no greater than my sins. But I have turned from my sins and with the help of the Holy Spirit who is purifying and refining me I am able to stand against sin. Without Christ I could do nothing against sin. I am a sinner saved by the grace of Christ Jesus. The Lord can do this for the homosexual also. First they need to turn from their wicked ways as I did. If I backslide the Lord forgives me. The difference between then and now is I'm forgiven. I've been washed in the blood of Jesus. I don't want to sin against the Lord anymore.

Answer 5

I fully agree with my Anglican cousin. He's clearly not advocating homosexuality. So either you post the part where you're implying he did advocate it - or you take the statement as he meant it.

St. Paul repeatedly warns Christians against being self-righteous.

The entire letter to the Romans is how each man should live a righteous life. No where - NO WHERE - in Romans does it say go out and use God's word as a weapon of hate.

In fact, that very chapter states emphatically that GOD is judge and jury. Not us.

Jesus himself tells us to look to our own sins. Not the sins of our brothers and sisters. How can you pick the speck of dust out of your brother's eye when you have a plank in your own?

Jesus says LOVE. Not condemn. LOVE one another as HE loved us. That is to be willing to die for even those who would kill us. Father forgive them for they know not what they do.

He didn't say anything along the lines Father smite the homos. Which is how "good Christians" tend to use this paragraph.

THAT is why memorizing, chapter and verse, a single paragraph is so dangerous. You can't see the forrest for the tree. Read the whole chapter. Better yet, the whole book of Romans. Then learn what Romans really means. Read it in several different versions of the bible for an even BETTER understanding.

Answer 6

instructor: All Scotsmen get exhilaration from haggis. student: My uncle is a Scotsman, and he does not like haggis! instructor: properly, he's not a real Scotsman, then. Technically, the HS is working in anybody, top? The HS attracts human beings in the direction of God, for this reason, the HS is working interior the existence of sinners besides as believers. possibly the respond lies interior the fruit of the Spirit. a good tree (actual, spirit crammed Christian) might undergo good fruit, on a similar time as a bad tree (a non-harmonious alleged Christian) might undergo undesirable fruit. Believer a million: you may desire to talk in tongues to be a spirit crammed Christian. Believer 2: properly, i'm a Christian yet i will no longer be able to talk in tongues. Believer a million: then you definately are actually not a "authentic" Christian. The 'authentic Scotsman fallacy' is what ends up in one in all those good form of denominations interior the Christian Church. each and every church believing their church to be the "authentic" church and all others to be pretenders. great Q. thank you. Peace to all.

Answer 7

Sounds like Archbishop of Canterbury, Rowan Williams is gay, too, and he's trying to rationalize something that all Christians everywhere, and for all time, have properly understood to be a seriously disrordered state of being, and a great sin.

Answer 8

I think I know what he means.

Although it does condemn homosexual physical coupling in those verses, the whole argument as it goes up to Romans 3:23 is proving that mankind as a whole is in sin. Sins such as those listed are an outworking of our natural sin nature. Sexual impropriety is just one of the ways sin in us manifests itself (and in Rome there was a great deal of it; you can read histories of the Emperors - they were really bad, and not just sexually).

It also talks of murder, envy, greed, arrogance, heartlessness, cruelty and so on, and also that the Jews who compared themselves very highly with the gentiles were also actually pretty guilty.

This depravity spoken of in Paul's argument is why God sent Jesus to us as a Saviour. He then says that faith in Christ enables our sins to be forgiven and for us to stand righteous in God's sight through Christ - the atonement.

It goes on later in Romans in chapters 5-8 to say how we can be renewed, so that the new creation in us (we become "born again") that happens on believing in Jesus can be established in our lives so we become in practice, as well as by 'legal' position, righteous.

Answer 9

It says what it means and it means what it says. But this is not to say that Gays are headed to hell anymore than non gays. Is the unnatural sex acts men and women do to each other any less reprehensible that the unnatural acts of gays in God's eyes. We ALL need to be as clean as we can for as long as we can. If we fall we need to repent and try harder.

Answer 10

I agree with the general consesnus above my answer, as does the following article:

Does God Approve of Same-Sex Marriage?
- Our Creator Sets the Standard
- Your Accountability to God
http://watchtower.org/library/g/2005/4/8a/article_01.htm

Answer 11

In these end times, you will have many who act as if they are of Christ, but they are not. Know them by their fruit: if they challenge the Word of the Living God, they are not Christian, but are of the anti-christians who are already at work in the earth.
This will get worse as time goes on: we are just getting started, friend. Things are happening that would have been considered unbelievable in the sixties. A bill is trying to be pushed thru this week, called HR1529 -
(the USA). This bill will make it a federal criminal act for you to hand out scripture to someone if the scripture contains anything that notes that homosexuality is against Gods Word. If you do, you will be arrested for a "hate crime". Sounds silly? I live in the suburbs of Philadelphia, PA, where two 75 yr. old grannys got arrested and charged with the same "hate crimes" bill on the state level, as this HR1529 is on the federal level.
They were handing out pamphlets of scripture in front of their church. They were handcuffed, taken away, id'd, fingerprinted,
changed to prison garb, and thrown into the county jail into general population in the prison. They face 47 years in prison, each.
Their charges are the exact same as if you attack physically and hurt another person.
Just like assault is. This bill they want to pass as federal law, is the most dangerous bill ever introduced in American history, and most people don't even realize it.
Under the bill HR1529, if you attack and
injure and rob a little old lady, and another person hands literature to a gay person,
the person who handed out the literature is
in lots more trouble with the law. They get charged with a "hate crime", which is subject under this proposed bill, to 33% MORE PRISON TIME than the mugger.
Why? Because under this bill, special provisions are given to gays - their bodies are more valuable than that of a heterosexual person, even a defenseless old woman. People had better wake up to what is going on with regard to this bill:
It means its a crime for a Pastor to give a sermon in a church; it means if you raise your children with christian values and morals, you could have your children taken from you, because you are a child abuser.
This is an attack on freedom of speech, not to even mention freedom of religion. Whats even worse, is that under the bill, the police can decide if you are "thinking" a hate crime; it doesn't matter if you actually do a hate crime, handing out scripture is "thinking of a hate crime" and the penalty is the same as if you actually attacked someone.
THIS IS THE MOST DANGEROUS PIECE OF LAW TRYING TO BE PASSED IN THIS COUNTRY. IT IS CALLED:

HR1529 - check it out for yourself at:
www.christiannewswire.com -
you won't believe what you read when you read what is in that proposed bill.

WAKE UP AMERICA, YOUR FREEDOMS ARE GOING BYE BYE

Hey, i teach Scripture, and fully expect that just after that bill is passed (if its passed) I
am going to prison. I have no doubt of it.
Our family even has an emergency plan in effect when that day comes, for the care of my son. Thats how serious this bill is.