Can you disprove my God conclusion.......?

Question

Here’s my counter argument about the christian God’s existence: According to the Bible, God is perfect, since God is perfect(Omniscience), his plans/ideas should therefore be perfect(no flaws/ no unintended consequences), now tell me why does"non-believers exist”, isn’t one of his goals is to have “everyone” believe in him?
Proving that a non-believer exists - means that his plan is a failure (god = failure?)
Now, I know some may argue that free will cause us these failures not God. Luckily for me I planned out some explanation why his “free will” idea is also a failure. So here goes. WHY THE HELL FREE-WILL CAUSES FAILURE, isn’t free-will also one of God's creation, and Gods are supposed to create failure-proof creations!!!(lol, I made up that word).
If free-will is one of God’s creation, then why does the ability of free-will give us the abilities of denying his existence, God won’t certainly provide his creations with this kinds of ability (the ability not to believe him, etc.)

contin....

etc.), if these free-will is the source of our failures , then this means free-will = defective, therefore God’s ideas = defective.


Examples why God is not perfect.

1. It takes him 10 plagues to convince the pharaoh of Egypt that he he’s a real GOD!!! – Come on 10 tries? He’s supposed to be omnipotent (1st try should be a success)

2. The great flood – approximately all but the ones in the ark survive. Oh my God!! Why did he create those people in the first place if he knew all along that they will end up being corrupted and evil being? <---- a big mistake their!

3. AND FOR MY GREATEST COMPLAINT OF ALL – God didn’t send the most evil person (Satan/Lucifer) in hell, instead he made him ruler of the underworld (he could roam freely in earth and or in hell whenever he wants). Not only that, God gave Satan these abilities: A) immortality B) Invisibility C) un-evadable temptation/seduction D) free entrance in the Garde

source read the Bible

p.s. i believe in God, not on the christian God though.

Answer 1

Well, in a way you are really trying to limit God by imagining that an all powerful God is incapable of creating entities who have the ability to oppose him.
As much fun as it is, unfortunately I must point out a logical flaw in your arguement.

A perfect God could create imperfect humans, if it was his original intent. And he would do it perfectly.

Answer 2

Well the answer to number 1 is that god heardened Pharoah's heart so that he would not let the children of Israel leave. Why? You'll have to take that up with him. God implied that he did it because he wanted to take the opportunity to make a demonstration of power that could never be denied afterward.

The traditional Jewish answer to number 2 is that the first part of Genesis is not supposed to be taken literally, but instead should be read to reveal a number of lessons about the relationship between God and man. It's the Jews' book, so I figure that they should know.

The problem with number 3 is that it is a restatement of Milton's Paradise Lost, a bit of Revelations (not a reliable biblical writing, IMHO) and assorted medieval Christian myth rather than anything you'll find in the OT.

The thrust of your argument in the body of your question is that if God is perfect, then ipso facto, his creations have to be perfect. The flaw in this line of reasoning is apparent on its face. How can an omnipotent being NOT be omnipotent enough to create something imperfect? The nature of the question presupposes limits on the creative ability of an omnipotent God, and is therefore a logical fallacy

So, the question isn't whether he could create a being as imperfect as man, but WHY he would do so. To ask that question is to attempt to understand a mind that is omniscient by definition, so it's a losing game.

I find very interesting your thesis that free will is a defect. I have to ask, if one lacks the will or ability to deny God, then what is his adoration and repentence worth?

Answer 3

>>"and Gods are supposed to create failure-proof creations!!"<<

why?

what makes you so sure of this? and define "failure"?

you also have an assumption that its god's goal/intent to have everyone believe in him.

I'd say this is more effective as an argument against hell, as if you take out hell, and add reincarnation, than each life shifts into a series of lessons and progressions rather than a much less logical, rational, or just one-shot deal.


>>"Women and men want to be little gods and were decieved by that very lie when eve ate of the Tree of Knowledge of Good andEvil."<<
THIS is the lie.
the serpent did NOT lie. when they ate from the tree they DID become as God, compared to the animals. they knew the difference between good and evil, and had the power and knowleege with which to conciously chose their actions.

it is idolotry and polytheism to alledge that one other than God rules the world.

Answer 4

I do believe in God and nothing that you would say to me would disprove that. God is perfect and who are you exactly to try to disprove him. If your so "final" on that God does not exist why are you posting this in the first place. Are you still trying to prove something to yourself perhaps? Well your "theory" still doesn't seem to "click" with me. God can create whatever he wants and he decided that he wanted to give us free-will and choose for ourselves: Heaven or Hell, God or the devil. He gave us the chance to choose, obviously you decided Hell and the devil. So it all really depends on a persons faith. I choose God and Heaven. God always was and always will be. You can again and again try to disprove him but then there will always be that question gnawing at you: "Does he really exist?" and/or "Will I accept Jesus as my savior?" God said that nobody will EVER understand everything. Only God can. So go ahead and try to disprove him but I want to tell you that Judgment day is coming soon. Maybe after you die or before but you can't always run from it.

Answer 5

God could have created us without free will. You would basically be robotic and you would do what you were told when you were told to do it where you were told to do it at. If God created man that way then no one would be able to say that God has failed by giving us a free will or letting everything happen the way that it has down here on earth. God could've blown up the earth with a snap of a finger in anger at what we have done down here on earth. You may have never had the chance to sit here and ask these questions if he did that either. God didn't fail in creating man and giving him a free will. God knew what was going to happen before he created man and gave him a free will. Have you ever seen a girl/guy walking by and noticed how pretty she/he was and thought that you could show her/him that you were worth talking to and giving a chance to be with? You would pursue them to find out if they are interested in you until you got an answer from them. If you were not satisfied with that answer would you continue to pursue to try and change their mind? If you didn't suceed would you consider yourself a failure or would you move onto the next person and try again later? God created us for a purpose. He didn't fail in his creation or his plan for us or his creation. Everything is the way that God wants it. He loves us and he lets us make our own decisions and take the risk of the consequences of it. He is there to catch us when we fall and to try again. He is a supernatural parent. Do you think that your parents have failed you because they are supposed to be perfect and raise you right? If you didn't turn out the way your parents wanted you to or the way that they tried to raise you does that make your parents a failure in trying to raise you or does that mean that you made your own choices and you changed because you wanted to ? That would have nothing to do with your parents being failures in raising you. They tried, you changed your ways and drifted away from the way they tried to raise you. Is God a failure for trying to raise us in his word when we do not chose to follow? How much fun do you think it would be to have to follow the bible and not be able to decide for ourselves what is wrong or right? Would you want someone else to pick your wife for you to spend the rest of your life with because you think God has failed in not taking away your free will?

Answer 6

I can't disprove your point of view, but then I wouldn't want to, because simply by thinking the way you have and investigating these ideas you have shown a willingness to question your reality and spirituality.
The way I see it is that only by questioning your ideals and beliefs can you find out which have merit and which don't and through such research you will find whatever truth is inherent in your being and life.
As I said I don't want to disprove your thoughts, but I will leave you with this: What if the purpose behind life is based in learning the most we can from every instance and lifetime? Wouldn't that then explain why suffering and pain and all our stuff-ups are allowed to happen considering we learn more from losing than winning... Just a thought.

Answer 7

Your entire rant is based on the most silly, fallacious, and misinterpreted premise of all time-that God gave man "free-will". Since you are marginally aquainted with the bible, what did God say to Adam & Eve in the garden concerning the Tree of Knowledge? WHAT WERE HIS WORDS? DO NOT EAT OF THE FRUIT OF THIS TREE!!!! Is this the "free-will" you refer to? What free-will? HOW on earth do people keep themselves so damn ignorant in not "SEEING" this??? How do you deduce "DO NOT DO SUCH AND SUCH" with free-will? How can ANYONE ever argue about free-will when none was given??? When you were little, and your mother told you to STAY OUT of the cookie jar, did she mean exactly what she said? Or did she mean it "metaphorically" so you could put your own spin on as to what she meant? If the former, you knew better; if the latter (in which case your mother would be a nut-case as no parent should talk in circles to their kids), she could not in good conscience punish you for her semantical screw-ups. But we know that A&E were in fact punished. How? Because death has reigned from then to this very day. Why? Because they chose badly to "raid the cookie jar" so to speak, and this logically entails the fact that no sense of free-will was ever given to them as is so foolishly contended today. So many bad arguments go down in flames because of this basic misunderstanding of the truth of the bible. Your entire position is afforded no immunity to this fact as well. God conclusion soundly defeated.

Answer 8

Your soliloquy was a bit long and obtuse to make a whole lot of sense. If you choose not to believe in God,. then why are you so bothered by those of us who do? I have nothing to prove to you, and even if I tried, my words would travel through that empty space between your ears and become simply a passing thought that would only add to your rantings. God, in his wisdom, gave us free-will, so that we could decide upon which path to travel. That's perfect. Wouldn't you prefer to be loved by someone because that person wanted to love you, not because he or she was forced to love you? I love God because of the sunrises, the miracle of birth, the changing seasons, a waterfall...But you certainly don't have to take my word for it - be a little open-minded and check out God for yourself. Investigate. Say a little prayer. If He doesn't change your life for the better, then you can easily return to the person you are right now. Nothing ventured, nothing gained...Take care.

Answer 9

That's one of the dumbest reason I have seen till now. Hats off to you.

Now before I put my point, remember or atleast try to remember that he has given free will to all individuals and no matter what, He never interferes with His own rule.

GOD wants all of us to love Him, but He never forces us to love Him. That is His greatness. If you desire to reject Him, only He.... yes.. only He makes you forget Him and not you. That is called as free will. You choose and He grants. He always supports in whatever you desire. If you wish to go to Hell, He will take you to hell.

Now why will He take you to hell? You may ask. Doesn't He love you. No, He still loves you, He only wants us to realize that without Him everything is a failure.

He will never tell you to love Him, but each and every second through His great plan He will make you reliase that without Him you will always fail, always feel empty and always have some amout of sadness in you.

Failure is also His creation, denying Him is His power, not yours. You only have the power to choose, nothing else. Whatever you choose He will grant it, but the outcome has to be borne by you alone and no one else till you realize that there is nothing like Him. Then you will see what He is and what He is capable of.

Answer 10

The devil(Prince of this world) and the worldly(fleshly lusts) dominate this world. They exercise the curse that was placed on the earth after the sin in the Garden of Eden. Women and men want to be little gods and were decieved by that very lie when eve ate of the Tree of Knowledge of Good andEvil.
New Testament.

John 12:31 - Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.

John 14:30 - Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in me.

John 16:11 - Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged.

John 15:18 - If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you.

John 15:19 - If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you.