Seriously, what can WE do (if anything) to end the horrible misinformation campaign that vegetarians eat fish?

Question

Please, if you are not vegetarian, don't bother.

People quoting wikipedia of all things, are they that out of the intellectual loop that they think wiki is a real source. Some wannabe just now posted all that *semi* and *flexi* garbage, and vented this:

"Vegetarianism is not some club with RULES....Anyone can be a vegetarian."

Yes, anyone can, if they DON'T EAT ANIMALS. If they don't believe in the cause, why do they insist on belonging to the cause.

No, it is not a club, it is a label. Labels serve an IMPORTANT function in society of turning many words into 1 word.

I should be able to say vegetarian anywhere, and get food with no dead carcass. Those who eat the dead may not understand why it matters, but they should understand that it does.

They say labels don't, matter, or *I don't need a label* or *I don't care about labels.* Well if you don't need them, and don't care about them, then please, do not misuse them or take those that don't belong to you.

Ps. Many fish-eaters call themselves vegetarians simply because they are misinformed. There are a lot of bunk websites out there. Others do it because *people wont understand what pescatarian means.* Well many people didn't understand what vegetarian meant when it first came out. It took many vegetarians to make that happen. NOW, people are again starting to not know what vegetarian means.

Pps., Being a vegetarian who eats dead animals is like being a Christian who believes in multiple gods and isn’t all that fond of Jesus. Why steal the name if you don’t believe?

Is there any way to help defeat the destruction of our label?
PLEASE no harassing meat answers, and yes I ranted a lot because I am mad *grrrrrr*
:)

Don't worry homeboy, I just meant no mean non-vegetarians.

:)

Wine Snob, while I agree, my issue is not with those who are misinformed; it is with those who angrily insist they can even when they know the truth.

I just dealt with a rude person (though not as rude and idiotic as someone else who has recently piped up) who was very angry and snotty with me for not including *pesca* *semi* and *flexa* into my answer about the def. of veg., saying above how it is not a *club* etc.. in her vent about vegs who don't include fish-eaters.

Hence... my vent.
:)
But yes, I would like to help stop the misinformation, and I am understanding when people just don’t know any better.

Thanks, Acille for a great answer, though check out Ms. S's answer; SHE has the new name for us vegetarians.
And Check out KitKat; letter writing sounds good. Maybe legit veg societies would join to help stop pseudo-sites like "about" etc.?
:)

Answer 1

I'll finally jump into this flame-fest with one little suggestion. Feel free to copy the text and link under "Know your source? List it here:" and add it to your answers here. It's not much, but it's a start towards eliminating the misconception that vegetarians eat dead animals! I added it to all my open answers and it's been noticed by a few folks.

I'm spending most of my 'free' web time trying to find out where/when this whole [expletive deleted] garbage that it's acceptable to be a flesh eating veggie started. By following the etymology of pesca-whatever I found one dictionary that added the term in '93 and from their etymology I've tracked back to some Beef Council stuff put out in '90. That's the earliest reference I've been able to find on meat eating veggies. Jan Barkas book "The Vegetable Passion" from '74 has NOTHING about the subject so it appears this junk started sometime in the '80s (unless I already found the source).

Feel free to join me in emailing William Safire about the misuse of the -arian suffix and Pesc- instead of Pisc- . He's like a pit bull on crack when it comes to the misuse of language. When Safire comments about Etymology people listen!

Answer 2

I agree with Matt H.. Is there such a thing as
not that black or almost pregnant? If not
then how can you eat any type of flesh
and call yourself a vegetarian? The age
old word and original definition itself is
the standard from which people's diets
are designated.

It's also an insult to age old vegetarians
like Davinci, Einstein, Tolstoy and
Plato who had the bravery to say:
" I don't need any kind of flesh".
If you don't believe that you can get
the protein you need from plants
eating fish is the easiest way to
tell on yourself. Why proclaim yourself
part of a movement if you don't fully
embrace its concepts?

I'm starting to feel now that I've been too
soft and passive on this issue. Not
only do we activists have to dispell
rumors that fish are vegetables but we
also have to endure being called
sensitive trolls by another vegetarian.

If you really believe in what you are doing
then you are bound to get upset with
anything that threatens the purity of what
you are doing.

Also, if you live in a non-veg-friendly area
this makes it much harder to order a veg
meal than it should be. If you live in California
or New York you won't have this problem.
No one has ever offered me a vegetarian
fish plate there. However in my hometown
I am always having to take the explanation
that one step further.

Since it is that we don't have a right to
get upset according to Nice Guy I guess
we will all have to start calling ourselves
non-acquarius vegans, or non-acquarias
lacto ovo vegetarians. Would that make
you happy Nice guy? All the fish eating
vegetarians can go on calling themselves
that and the rest of us will add five more
syllables onto our diet descriptions in
order to save the world further confusion.

BTW- very hurtful to be attacked and called
names from someone you should be able
to embrace as one of your own. I'm also
very concerned for you Nice Guy. Most
people who are not vegetarians for ethical
reasons don't stick to the lifestyle. I know
that you say you are in favor of reform
and reducing suffering but I wonder if
you truly comprehend the finality of an
animals death( including that of a fish).
You may want to examine
what it is that you truly believe. If you don't,
you probably won't last as a vegetarian.

Answer 3

Your rant has taken the words right out of my mouth! I live in the meat-n-potato-fed midwest, where there is so much ignorance about the issue that I've been driving myself crazy with this same problem. The worst part is going to restaurants where even the mangagers and cooks don't know that a vegetarian order should have NO meat at all. It's difficult to keep a level head and not completely go off on the misinformed masses, but it is crucial to correct them whenever the chance is given.

When someone says, "I'm a vegetarian, but I still eat some fish (or chicken, ew)," etc., the best thing to do is say right away, "Oh, vegetarians don't eat any animals," or something to the direct and simple effect. Try to keep a polite tone and an open and conversation-inviting attitude. Hopefully, the offender will continue by asking questions or discussing the topic...Talking is really the best way to get them to understand the difference between lean-meat eating and actual vegetarianism.

It is also important for people who claim vegetarianism to know what other animal flesh/body substances are floating around in the food industry, like gelatin and lard.

"You don't eat gummy bears? but they're not meat, they're fruit, right?"
"No, they're actually fish bones* and sugar, and vegetarians don't eat anything that requires the killing of an animal for its production."

* don't quote me on this, I don't know what kind of gelatin goes into most gummies. but that's essentially the point.

***

So, probably the best way for us to get the message across is by word of mouth. It may be a slow process, but it will probably be the most effective and non-abrasive method we can use.

A more bold move might be to use peta ad-style signs/t-shirts/stickers with a simple slogan like, "Fish are friends, not food," "Fish = Meat =/= Vegetarian" (the =/= being a "not equal" sign) or even simply "Vegetarians don't eat fish!". Such tactics may be scoffed at or even ignored, but may be effective in certain settings.

Answer 4

To all the people above who seem to think the Vegetarians can eat fish, YOU ARE WRONG! Fish is not a Vegetable, period. End of discussion.

"should be able to say vegetarian anywhere, and get food with no dead carcass."

That pretty much says it.



I suggest you just go Vegan. Then you are not supporting the deaths of animals used for eggs and dairy.

@ Nice Guy: If a white person calls themselves black would an person of African decent not have the right to be offended? I think they do, because it would be obvious that the white person is, in fact, not a person of African decent. This is very similar in that a person who eats fish is obviously not a Vegetarian.
I agree with you, people may get a bit too worked up about it. But I would be upset too if someone claimed to be Vegan and still ate dairy products. It's the misuse of a clearly defined word and the practical frustration that it causes (being served fish when you asked for a Vegetarian meal) that angers people.

@ Niceguy: Hey dude I agree with you, I cant dispute that it doesn't effect me. People know I don't eat fish. But it must effect you, doesn't it? you've never went to a restaurant and been offered fish after stating you were a vegetarian? I'm sure most people would say that they have. It happened to me in the short time I was a Vegetarian. With all the other things we must explain in our life’s do you really think it's necessary to explain that we don't eat fish either if we don't have to? That’s all I'm saying.

Answer 5

Just like spreading the word about vegetarianism, veganism and their benefits all we can do is plug along correcting the errors. Over and Over again!

Like correcting the snide comments from our friend CSU above. Darling child you couldn't be more wrong. There is no Peso-vegetarian. There is Pescetarian. Fish Eater. There is no Pollo vegetarian. There is Avitarian. Bird Eater.

Friend Bearded: the origins of fish friday are not Christian. They are Jewish. Jewish culture predates Christianity. Christianity came out of Judaism. So there ya go.

It brings up an important point though because people don't understand that Kosher/Parve does not equate to vegetarian or vegan. Most folks think it does because the label says "no meat no dairy." But it may contain fish, or the milk found in the belly of a slaughtered calf. GROSS! Both of these are kosher and parve.

Answer 6

Argh - I wish I knew! It was bad enough when people would offer me fish when i asked for a vegetarian option, but soon they'll include chicken, and then red meat, because after all, I might be a "flexitarian", huh? *rolls eyes*

The only thing I can think of is informing and correcting people when they get it wrong - and defining vegetarian as "someone who doesn't eat *flesh*" - so the whole "But fish isn't meat"-thing will fall flat.

In the long run, we might need a new label for ourselves, to distinguish us from the "I'm a vegetarian who eats some kinds of dead animals"-crowd.

Maybe something like anti-carcassian? ;D

Answer 7

I am not vegetarian, but I agree that it is rediculous when I hear that fish is not meat. I believe this stems primarily from the christian attitude towards meat. As I was growing up, we didn't eat "meat" on fridays in lent, but we would have fish instead. I always asked if fish were animals (i knew the answer of course don't worry) when people said yes, I would ask why eating fish muscles was any different than eating the muscles of any other animal, and I never got a good answer.

On a lighter note, go to you tube and check out "Steven the Vegan". It's great

Answer 8

Technically a "vegetarian" who eats fish is a pescitarian. no longer all vegetarians are vegetarian for animal rights. some for wellbeing motives, and which would be why some consume fish.

Answer 9

If someone wants to label themselves that, while its not true, I'm not going to scream at them too much. At least they've gone that far. Instead of getting mad at them, I try to explain that "just fish" also means sea turtles, dolphins, whales, sharks, manatees, seals, sea lions, and tons of other animals (by-catch). Once they realize that their fish is responsible for the death of Flipper, I hope that some will think twice before having that seared ahi.

Answer 10

i know you dont want non vegetarians answering, but mislabeling and incorrect stereotypes will never go away.

plus, is the name really important to you? it should be the cause right? but i see youre point about the restaurant thing.

maybe you should write a book to straighten this out? fight fire with fire