Does Boeing's new 787 plane use dangerous unproven technology?

Question

Making a whole plane out of what is basically plastic? Is it a good idea? Plastic is brittle, it can shatter easily. If a normal plane is in a relatively low velocity crash the aircraft can bend and absorb some of the energy. Boeing's new plane with shatter into a million pieces. Would you fly on one?

Answer 1

The choice of an all-composite fuselage is good from a weight perspective, thereby cutting down on fuel costs(perhaps by 3% due to fuselage alone). But the composite is brittle, less shock absorbent and omits toxic gases when burning. It sounds like cracks and fatigue are harder to detect. But Boeing has something in place to take care of this. They claim that composites have already been used in wings and other aircraft parts and should not pose any issue. They apparently can model an air crash scenario and have demonstrated it by dropping a 787 fuselage recently. So looks like they have their bases covered.

The other news is that carbon fiber does not handle lightning strikes better, leaving cracks and failures. I happened to see a crash on TV involving a helicopter over the Brent sea. The chopper went down after getting hit by a lightning and the rotor blade was made of composite.

Unless they have already done it, they need to do more tests on their new plane soon in order to win their customers' hearts.

Answer 2

Some good answers above, some wrong.
Simple answer....many things omitted!
CFRP is made of Carbon Fibres which are set in a resin. The setting is Oven based, or Autoclave (An oven with high pressure). The fibres are supplied in a cloth form, minimum width about 1/4 inch for fibre placement and up to 48 inches wide for larger flatter laminations. The fibres are Unidirectional or Woven (Like normal cloth). The cloth is about 0.010" thick, (Can also be around 0.005"). The cloths are laid in a pattern to suit the fibre directions, most simple panels on the side of a fairing are approximately 8 lams thick, about 0.080". They have extra lams where reinforcement is needed, such as where a hinge is bolted.
Such panels and Fairings have been around for several years now, and we know how to make them and treat them.
The new development in the 787 is that some main Class 1 structural items are to be CFRP. Namely the Wing Spars.
The 1st main wing spar in a large A/c is actually the A400M, but I think the 787 will beat it to first flight.
Spars in fighter A/c have been made before with no problems.
At the end of the day....when you board an aeroplane now, do you actually know the fundamentals of what's holding what together? Probably not. Would you fly on a B-52 if you knew that thos BIG wings are held on by just 8 bolts each...(They are 4 inches diameter) So, don't worry..it's the same difference.

All new A/c have to be tested to destruction, not just the 747 (A poster above). Prior to destruction, the components are put through thousands of hours in a fatigue rig, bending/flapping/twisting it. Once it has passed it's exam, they wind up the crank until it snaps! They then know the maximum points.

I would like to see a few thousand hours of Fatigue testing on the Spars though :-)


The comment below ref the Airbus from New York is an ill-informed remark. The A300 Fin came off because of wildy excessive left then right then left then right movements caused by the Pilot on his foot pedals......and that was due to incorrect training by AA. There was clear instructions issued by Airbus, which were not observed by AA instructors. Whether they missed them or ignored them we will never know.

Answer 3

The plane is not made from plastic. The 'Plastic Airplane' is just a by-product of the media because the material the plane is made from is man-made(like plastic). The 787 is made from carbon fiber and carbon epoxy which, when made properly (as Boeing will) results in an extremely strong aircraft.

I would fly on one.

Answer 4

I'm all for it, myself. Can you imagine any aircraft manufacturer risking their reputation, let alone their passengers' lives in something that's "brittle" and "shatters into a million pieces"? You clearly don't grasp the materials technology in use here.

I'd just mention that the helicopter accident at Brent Spar wasn't due to the composite rotor blade. It was due to a faulty (or, more accurately, badly applied) metal abrasion strip which arced during the lightning strike and caused blade damage. The ironic thing is that if that metal strip had been missing altogether there would have been no major damage.

Answer 5

I am looking forward to flying on it! Using great new technology not only to make a lighter, stronger aircraft but also to improve the passenger experience. Better air handling systems, larger windows, pressurised to a lower altitude, state of the art lighting. FWIW, almost everything in current aircraft emits toxins when burning, so no difference there. That's why the crews need to get everyone out of a plane so quickly when there's an inicident and why we have all these rules about not reclining seats during taxi, keeping stuff out of the aisles, etc.

Answer 6

The carbon fiber material has been around and used in various applications for years. Both Airbus and Boeing are currently using the carbon fiber to make the airplanes as such as Boeing 747, 777, & 787 and Airbus A320 and A380. Caboon Fiber of America (CFA) is the only approved carbon fiber manufacture/supplier for Boeing and Airbus. They also supply carbon fiber for all of Formula 1 teams, Corvette Z06 body, and Subaru Evo parts. You can be sure that the carbon fiber material is as reliable as the aluminum material.

Answer 7

Mike Tyson and Floyd P are spot on but remember when the 747 was first introduced the wings were tested to destruction the same as the dreamliner not only this, but the fuselage is subjected to extreme temperatures to make sure there is no danger of structural failure.

But as with anything in aviation nothing is written in stone, I wish it could be the skies would be a much safer place.

Just one last thought many modern gliders are composite material yes they creak and grown but very rarely do they suffer structural failure.

if anybody else knows of this happening would love to know.

To answer the question Yes I would give it a try just to see how she flies

P.B Glider Pilot

Answer 8

Consider a large portion is made out of the same material that's used on Formula One cars and has been used on aircraft for 25 years. The R & D that goes into these aircraft is astronomical, and the certification is extensive. Next time you're in Everett, Washington I suggest you take the Boeing factory tour if you still don't trust the engineers.

Answer 9

umm the 787 is not made just plastic. The 787 is made from carbon fiber, a very strong, lightweight material. I think makeing it out of a lighter material is great, it has a longer range, and more eco-friendly. Clearly you know very little about this aircraft, Go out and research about it before typing such idiotic claims. I believe the carbon fiber actully handles better in a crash. your just making urself an idiot by talking like that. One of my families friend worked on designing it.

haha JetDoc that was awesome

Answer 10

Absolutely! The Boeing company is putting your life (and millions of others) on the line every time you go near an airport. This huge multi-Billion dollar company is so unconcerned with your personal safety that the are willing to risk the company's reputation and, in fact, their very existence on this "unproven technology" that has been around for more than 100 years.

If you don't like it, stay home. Pull the covers up over your head and hide from the world, but just remember... You have a much better chance of dying in bed than you do in an airplane.

Answer 11

Number one, the composite parts have been in use in military and other commercial applications. I would imagine that they have been stress tested for this application.

Number two, in order to get FAA certification, the aircraft manufacturer would have to conduct lots of tests to show that the product/systems/components are airworthy.