Man, can you believe this?

Question

So I've just watched Discovery Ch.; some myth about 30 kids killed long ago, when a runaway train hit their bus somewhere in Texas.

There is this family who stopped one night at the same spot; the legend comes to life and the 30 dead kids push the car across the railroad, some fingerprints appear on the back of their car and the family even take a picture in which a ghost appears (sic!).

The debunkers come to recreate the whole thing. Their conclusions:
- there is only an optical illusion, we're actually talking about a downward inclination (in spite of the more than obvious upward orientation of the slope), so the car was just sliding (in spite of the fact that the engine was turned off the and the brakes on);
- the mysterious fingerprints are actually old fingerprints which were always there;
- no clear explanation for the ghost, but some muttering about lights and cameras.

Is there any lamer excuse to deny the 'paranormal'?

Can't you just say... I dunno... "I can't explain it"?

Answer 1

If anyone has read any of my answers before they will know that I could hardly be called a debunker and that I am open to evidence of paranormal activity.
However, in this case I may seem like a debunker to some. I grew up in San Antonio, Texas where these railroad tracks are located. I have only been gone for the last two years. I also ran a paranormal investigation group in San Antonio for more than 10 years.
The Railroad track story is an Urban Legend.

1. There is no record public or government of any crash that meets this description ever having taken place at this location. The Texas Rail Road Commission keeps very precise records. So, no documented evidence of any kind.

2. The story is unclear and is said to happen between 1920 and 1950 (again no records for this time period).

3. They are correct about the fingerprints. If you use baby powder or talcum powder you can lift your own prints.
If the car is washed very well before visiting the tracks no prints will appear. I have conducted this experiment over a dozen times.

4, They are correct about it being an optical illusion as that the tree line is lower than the street and this creates an uphill look for a slight downhill slope. A basic level used in carpentry will confirm the downhill slope.
I have done this as part of my more than a dozen investigations. This effects only works going one way (downhill) so one would have to suppose that killed children would let you die if you aren't going the same direction they were going.

5. Yes when your car engine is off gravity will cause your car to roll downhill. Having conducted this experiment on site numerous times the claim that the break was on is questionable at best.

Additional information:

6. The cries of children heard at dusk are from a nearby peacock farm and these children's cries are only heard at feeding time on the farm/

7. The names of children that are street signs in the neighborhood are named after the children of the workers who built the site.
Cindy Sue ( a street name) and the girl that gets associated with the rail road tracks via a Vanishing Hitchhiker urban legend is named after Cindy Sue McCrelles (her father was the developer of the subdivision) and there is a nearby library branch named after him.

So, yes there are much lamer excuses to deny the paranormal then a site that reports consistent phenomena that is available for testing and that all experimental testing shows normal explanations for the reported phenomena.

I wish people would inform themselves and move on to study actual unexplained phenomena. I used this location as a training ground for new investigators to learn how to look for normal explanations (always found).

There are many things I believe can't be explained but the rail road tracks (intersection of Shane & Mission) is not one of them.

As for the picture of the ghost I would have to eaxmine it but I do not dismiss it as not a picture of a ghost. However, it is not a picture of a ghost of a child or bus driver that died on the tracks because no such incident ever took place.

Answer 2

The "debunkers" probably had a goal to provide a natural explanation for what appeared to be supernatural. (Why is it when the investigation doesn't yield a conclusion that everything has a paranormal source they're called debunkers?) Such an improbable story would require a pretty improbable explanation.

What's the alternative? Thirty child ghosts with no physical presence pushed a car that had its parking brake on? The claim that something with no physical presence pushing an immobile object seems far more preposterous to me than does the natural explanation you mention.

The fingerprints claim is a non-issue. Unless they unwrapped their brand new car right before it was pushed it's not unrealistic to think people have touched the car at some point. Besides, how can a ghost with no physical presence leave a fingerprint?

They took a picture of a ghost? How convenient. Where is it?

Maybe some kids did get killed in a school bus, but then again maybe they didn't. Whether this happened or not is really a separate issue than what you're talking about here. The whole story could be a fabrication from start to finish. Personally, I think the "debunkers" were being polite when they deemed this claim to be worthy of their time. I probably wouldn't have.

EDIT: Bravo psiexploration!

Answer 3

Assalamu alaikum. Yes I agree with you that the true love is all about looking in the same direction despite all odds and difficulties.We a believing man and believing woman should respect,love and help each other so their love will become more pure.Insya Allah the sakinah,mawadah wa rahmah family can be reached.

Answer 4

There will always be things we can not explain.
It depends on what you believe I guess. I would
have to experience it myself before I believe anything like that. Gravity could have caused
the car to slide, the fingerprints could be old ones
and as for the optical illusions I feel that could be plausible if it occurred during the daytime.

Answer 5

Can I believe this? Yep.
Is there any lamer excuse to deny the 'paranormal'? You're saying that the Mythbusters are lame in that they do not believe in the paranormal? Or that they made a crappy episode because the legend seems to obvious to bother investigating?

Can't you just say ... "I can't explain it"? That laughs in the spirit of science- the natural human curiosity exists to uncover truth. Besides, that would make poor television. There are only so many urban legends they can test before they start running out of ideas...

Answer 6

i have heard bout that. yeah so this lady went up to that spot and it actually is not a downward slope but actually an upward slope so that cant b explained. then she cleaned the back of her car and got out of her car after finishing up with the ride and used that powder stuff and found tiny kid fingerprints. i thought that was kinda creepy. but i have nvr heard of the whole" taking pictures w/ ghosts" thing. but thanx 4 asking

Answer 7

This is an example of the explanation being there.You just had to look for it.I saw a show about this legend years ago.It's amazing they continue to pop up.The real villain here is the Discovery channel. Psi,well done.I respect your honesty,my hats off to you.If you don't mind I'll make you an honorary de-bunker.Just for today

Answer 8

there has been more than one reorted case of this happening in that spot. perhaps the finger prints had always been there but I would rather believe some of those kids that hadn't been moving on were watching out for that family, but I can't say because i've never experinced something like that personally.

Answer 9

hi mirko

i have read this story many times, and there are supposedly ghosts pictures taken of the site, of a little girl walking along the train tracks....
in later reading i did come across a story where someone investigated the whole story and they also found no records of this accident ever happening...>>>>..as psi has said.....

Answer 10

Psiexploration's answer was bang on. - and very well written.

Incidently the exact same story is used to promote ghost and haunting tours around Hamilton Ontario.

I imagine its a very common urban legend around any "magnetic hill"