What's wrong with my logic?

Question

"The complexity and order we observe is always the result of a designer. A watch requires a watchmaker, a computer requires an engineer. The universe and life are far more complex and ordered than these things so they require a Supreme Designer, who we call God."

I'm not asking whether I am right or wrong, rather what is the flaw in this argument?

related question: http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=ApG5_WUFMXwUPF_ZQxm43XXd7BR.;_ylv=3?qid=20071219113530AAZQg3c

(((Pangel))) :-D

Answer 1

Couple of things:

"The complexity and order we observe is always the result of a designer."

You can't prove that statement. Since we can't prove God is the designer, we can't say that all things are the result of a designer, because we have many designed things without a designer, so we assign God as the designer, and yet we have no proof.

Answer 2

There are a few problems.
First is an unsupported statement that complexity is the result of design. A designers job is actually to reduce complexity. Ideally the product should perform its job flawlessly with no moving parts.
Next is the idea that the world is a watch. It is an argument from analogy. One big difference is that the world has life involved. A watch does not. Next is the idea that complexity can not come from random processes, or from self ordering processes. It can and often does. Then you have the watchmaker himself. The watchmaker is more complex that the watch, so who designed the designer.

There are many more problems and Reverend Paley's argument has been refuted many times. No matter how you dress it the Watchmaker argument is a bust.

Answer 3

The logical flaws is "argument from personal incredulity" and inaccurate comparisons.

Arguments from personal incredulity state that, because the person cannot imagine something, it must therefore be false. This argument implies that because the speaker cannot imagine the universe developing without a designer, it cannot have done so.

The second flaw draws the comparison of current function with design. While a watch or computer, to function as they now do, need to have had a designer, the changes in the universe took place over so long a period of time that they are possible based on functionality EACH STEP OF THE WAY.

For example: The earth was formed out of debris from the sun's birth. Gravity drew greater and greater masses of rock & gases together. We were slammed with comets to get our water. The under pressure the core grew so hot as to become molten, and our continental plates floated along the top. Life formed from organic molecules that are relatively common in the universe, base probably on the energy from the sun, lightening, and volcanic activity.

Each step of this process led to a fully functioning planet. As time changed, the functions shifted slowly and in small stages, but over 4.6 BILLION years, these have led to a planet that has life on its surface, which has grown more complex via natural selection.

No designer is necessary when changes occur with such slow speed and small increments.

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Answer 4

merely because of the fact some guy who's been ineffective for 1000's of years says it is so, that are actually not making it so, genius. your comprehensive "logical" argument right here starts off from a fallacy. You presuppose that what the Bible says is genuine, hence not something that disagrees with the Bible can hence be genuine. you're actually not arguing good judgment, you're arguing perception, and there you have merely your man or woman adventure and opinion to recollect upon. you could not greater say that my good judgment is backwards than you could say that your good judgment is nice judgment.

Answer 5

First, it implies the universe has "order", which is far from an established fact. Second, it implies that only a Supreme Designer could have made such things, but doesn't explain the origins of said designer. If the complex universe deserves an origin, then the more complex designer must have come from something even more complex, etc.

Answer 6

It is true that man-made things need a creator. And that, by faith, man has decided to credit the universe to a creator god. But who created god? If everything is created, you cannot just say god always was and will be. A being as complex as god must have had a creator, too.

Answer 7

The obvious flaw would be that the designer must be more complex than the universe. If the universe is so complex it needed a designer, the more complex desginer, being more complex, must also be too complex to exist without a designer. A designer-designer if you will. Which would have to have a designer-designer-designer. And so on.

Answer 8

One flaw is that there is no connection bewteen watches, computers, and the existence of "god." Did watches evolve from simple chinese water clocks? Didn't current computers evolve from calculators, code breaking machines, and Commadore 64's? These objects as well as all other technologically advanced things have evolved from very simple beginnings. And there is no connection to any "god."

Answer 9

Then who designed god if thats the case? yes there is flaws. All those things like computers were made by humans. you cant base what we make or design on if the universe was designed.

Answer 10

1) Begs the question, since whether or not we see design in nature is the point of contention.
2) Modern human artifacts, such as watches and computers, are indicative of technical expertise derived over many generations, and thus a better argument for evolution.