Don't I necessarily need space/time to exist, since the Great Descartes proclaimed "I think, therefore I am"?

Answer 1

And afterwards Descartes postulated that the mind acted with the brain/body through the pineal gland. He himself knew that his idea of the mind outside time (though not necessarily space) collapses into occasionalism.
Descartes is in a tug of war in himself over physics and non-physical existences. After his physics was demolished by Newton, his best contribution is the focus on subjects as matter for philosophy; and consequently he is far from dead as a source for philosophy.

Answer 2

Well, you sometimes see "scientists have discovered DNA is an intricate helix. Only intelligent beings can devise such intricate things, therefore Intelligent Design is true." It's easy to use knowledge from the "other side of the fence" and then turn it to your advance. They hope that those who are aware of those three arguments, and have a more atheistic or scientific point of view, are gobsmacked by the argument and not able to say one word anymore. It needs to be said that not only those particular theists you mention, use this pathological way of thinking to create their desired result. There are people from all sides of all sorts of fences who use this way of thinking to create the results they want to achieve. Their view is simply distorted into reading only what they want to read and ignoring other facts, then coming to a conclusion and then setting their conclusion free on the rest of the world, in their own mindset, to "open their eyes." The best way to achieve that is pick out theories or experiments which aren't completed yet, typical generalisations or subjective terms. For example; we don't know what happened to create the universe. That doesn't necessarily imply that God did it; it simply means we do not yet have the resources to investigate it fully. There are people working on it as we speak. Etc... Now the funny thing about this way of thinking and argumenting, is that it hardly ever gets those people who initiate it, their desired result; and when faced with someone who is more knowledgeable in the field they are discussing, they often get more than they bargained for. As you probably well know ^_^

Answer 3

Existence is the interaction of energy in space-time

Even virtual realities require distinct amounts of space time. WOW may be virtual, but real computers and energy sources are required to create it.

Also I know of no thoughts that are not speculations of energy/space-time interactions.

Descartes may define existence from thought, but thought arises from energy & space-time.

Answer 4

Not "necessarily;" part of Descartes' reasoning involved Mind, or "I Am"ness, which moves into spacetime as Soul-individuation, Holy Christ Selfness. This is a root source of his "Mind-body" dualism, which is overcome with Holy Spirit re Matter, Mater. However, this is a more insightful and profound aspect of Descartes, and relates to his dream/vision of visiting a Church, being buffeted off-course by a wind, etc.

"A Philosophy of Universality," O. M. Aivanhov, is a worthwhile popularization of some notions.

Answer 5

Well existence, at least as we perceive it, I think makes no sense without reference to space and time. After all, how do we distinguish between existent and nonexistent things if we don’t have a universal framework that establishes the existence of something or the nonexistence of something?

Granted one can say ideas exist, and ideas don’t occupy space or time, but ideas emanate from things that do occupy space and time, namely our minds, and ideas take time to formulate. Hence, they are confined by the factors of space and time. I know this makes me sound like a pure materialist, but it seems to me to be nonsensical to talk about disembodied beings that exist outside of time. I am not saying that existence cannot have another meaning, that transcends space and time, but how do you quantify it or describe it. You can merely say such an entity exists, in a way that we don’t have words to describe. Yet, what is the use of believing in such an entity, because by automatically deeming that an entity’s existence is ineffable, we preclude our right to discuss it in any intelligible fashion.

It is no wonder that all talk of God, which is a being who is supposed to exist outside the confines of space and time, always gets bogged down in confusion. When people say God is great, or God is good, they are in essence making illogical statements, because such notions as greatness, goodness, being powerful, are notions that we realized from our observation of the natural physical world. These terms are what we use to describe things and beings in this world, who are physical. To apply them to something that is not defined by its physicality or by time, is the equivalent of me talking about how tall someone is by the way they smell. It just doesn’t make any sense.

Answer 6

TG is DEFINITELY WRONG...who can only have thought?...a living matter...which is the brain...and matter occupies time and space...disprove that!!!

This only proves...the Q'er is better top contributor...than the OTHER....properly premised Q...interesting....intelligent!!

Very wise Q my friend....I need this kind of thinking and Q...it gives me time and space to further live...and be entertained...loves it....more of intellectual Q's...it is something and can't be called NOTHING. it is therefore....NOT USELESS...A PRODUCTIVE....MENTAL SUBTLENESS...real and existing....That is what you are asking...MAN'S CONSCIOUSNESS...THAT IS WHAT DESCARTES...WOULD LIKE TO SAY....THE ONLY PROBLEM IS THAT ....

...now he has lost his time and space for he is I'm SURE IS DEAD...no more time and space left for him but his soul...which is not matter...that does not occupy space....so he has no more time and space to prove me right or wrong in my A....bye!

BY THE WAY ONLY NOTHING does not occupy nor need time and space.....what can you say TG?

By the way, God comes from Nothing...and He is A Spirit God...reconcile TIME AND SPACE....are you still there TG? ...contribute please....

Answer 7

I think you missed Descartes' point. He wasn't saying that thinking equals existing. He was saying that thinking PROVES you exist.

Answer 8

I would think that much is obvious since space/time is existence in and of itself. Without our perception of the movement of time, we would not have the thought process. Without space our matter/energy state would not exist.

The argument could be made that the existence of mind is independent of space/time, but I would challenge anyone who made such a statement to prove it.

[add] I think it is important to point out that 'space' in this instance is not a reference to spatial coordinates, but rather the matter/energy universe. I think some of the answerer's are missing that point. And that 'space/time' refers to the whole of existence.

Answer 9

Yes, space and time must exist in some sense, this is a conclusion of "I think therfore I am"

But we can know more than this, a lot more. . . . .

Answer 10

thinking involves space because it takes space to allow your brain to grow. What descartes was saying is thinking is what makes you who you are. If you aren't thinking then nothing is going on, hence you would be nothing. space is needed to grow the nutrients that allow your brain to grow, and time is needed to make memories that allow you to think. i hope this makes sense.