Why do non-Catholic Christians deny God's salvific grace to some through Baptism?

Question

Those that believe in believers baptism believe that one must intellectually assent to faith to be "born again". But the Bible teaches quite differently. The Bible teaches that Christ died for everyone regardless of age or mental ability. Christ said "(Luk 18:16 DRB) But Jesus, calling them together, said: Suffer children to come to me and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God." Are these children not entitled to God's salvific grace? What about those who are mentally incapable of intellectual assent to faith. Are they to be condemned as well? Surely believers baptism must be a heresy if we serve a just God.

Christian,

That is what Matt Slick says but it is not what the Word says. Read the book of Acts and you will see where whole families were Baptized which meant children and perhaps the mentally deficient. No where in Scriptures or in history is there evidence that only believers are to be baptized. The bible teaches that Baptism replaces circumcision. when were people circumcised? It was at eight days old by their faithful parents. Baptizing infants brings them into the family of God as well as washing away the stain of original sin.

Chelle (Nigel),

How is the Catholic belief a distortion since we believe that both faith and works are a result of God's grace.

Answer 1

Excellent points.

1. Denying baptism, when "no one can enter the kingdom of God unless he is born of water and the Spirit," clearly denies salvific grace. For it is in baptism that our sins are forgiven {"He saved us through the washing of rebirth and renewal by the Holy Spirit," Titus 3:5) and that we are born again into the family of God ("We were therefore buried with him through baptism into death in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, we too may live a new life," Rom 3:4).

2. Requiring intellectual consent does indeed deny salvation to infants and to intellectual little ones. For Jesus did not pose an intellectual test for receiving him:

Matthew 11:25: At that time Jesus said, "I praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and revealed them to little children."

The atheists have taken the Protestants one step further and have denied the right to life to infants and intellectual little ones. They demand the right to put to death prenatal children with impunity and to starve or dehydrate those who suffer brain damage.

The consolation is that God, in his justice, will make a way for those denied life and liberty in God.

Cheers,
Bruce

Answer 2

Christians always interpreted the Bible literally when it declares, "Baptism . . . now saves you, not as a removal of dirt from the body, but as an appeal to God for a clear conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ" (1 Pet. 3:21; cf. Acts 2:38, 22:16, Rom. 6:3–4, Col. 2:11–12), and they have always interpreted that as WATER BAPTISM. Thus the early Church Fathers wrote in the Nicene Creed (A.D. 381), "We believe in one baptism for the forgiveness of sins."

And the Catechism of the Catholic Church states: "The Lord himself affirms that baptism is necessary for salvation [John 3:5]. . . . Baptism is necessary for salvation for those to whom the Gospel has been proclaimed and who have had the possibility of asking for this sacrament [Mark 16:16]" (CCC 1257).

The Christian belief that water baptism is necessary for salvation is so unshakable that even the Protestant Martin Luther affirmed the necessity of baptism. He wrote: "Baptism is no human plaything but is instituted by God himself. Moreover, it is solemnly and strictly commanded that we must be baptized or we shall not be saved. We are not to regard it as an indifferent matter, then, like putting on a new red coat. It is of the greatest importance that we regard baptism as excellent, glorious, and exalted" (Large Catechism 4:6).

I suggest people read the first seven links on this page:
http://www.catholic.com/library/sacraments.asp

Answer 3

There are Christian denominations that believe baptism is necessary for salvation. The arguments used, on the surface, seem to be powerful. However, upon examination, baptism is found to occur after conversion, and is not in any way a cause or part of it. Take, for example, Acts 10:44-47. While Peter was witnessing, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who were listening to the message...and they were hearing them speaking in tongues and exalting God. Then Peter answered, "Surely no one can refuse the water for these to be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we did, can he?"
This passage shows that baptism happens after salvation. How do we know they were saved? They were speaking in tongues -- which is a gift from God to believers (1 Cor. 14)and they were exalting God. Non-believers do not exalt God. Also, Peter said they had received the Holy Spirit. That is only for Christians, and it happened before baptism. (Note: speaking in tongues is simply a sign of salvation. It is not necessary that a Christian speak in tongues as a proof of salvation. Not all speak in tongues (1 Cor. 12:30).
Another set of verses applicable to this issue is 1 Cor. 1:17. Paul says, "For Christ did not send me to baptize, but to preach the gospel..." The gospel is what saves, and it is explained in 1 Cor. 15:1-4. Baptism is not part of the gospel; it is something that the believer does after salvation.
Baptism is only a symbol of that which saves, and symbols don't save.

Answer 4

There are a lot of aspects to answer here!

Re Luke 18:16, notice the "of such". That means "of people like this" (The Greek is toihoutoun - like these, also used in Galatians 5:23 & Eph 5:27). It therefore speaks of a type - that is, of being childlike. This is usually understood to mean having a simple, unsceptical faith.

Secondly, Scriptures clearly teach elsewhere that salvation is by faith in Christ. It is a particular kind of faith, though - not merely intellectual agreement with ideas but trust or reliance upon Him alone. This kind of faith makes a difference in how you live, to such an extent that James can say 'faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead' (James 2:17) and 'a person is justified by what he does and not by faith alone' (Remember, though, to be careful to consider this later verse in context - James is arguing that faith which is alone is not saving faith, as I said above).

Third, we do believe in a just God. What He requires of us varies according to the amount of revelation we've received - we're told, for example, that those who teach will be judged more harshly, and we see stricter expectations at some times than at others (think of Ananias & Sapphira in Acts 5). We should apply this to infants who die, those who never get the chance to hear the gospel and those who suffer from intellectual disabilities just as much as to those who teach (although in the reverse direction).

Above all else, though, we need to remember that we believe in a gracious God. He doesn't delight in sending people to hell, and He isn't unwilling to let people have relationships with Him. He is good, and we need to remember that, too.

One more point, if I may. We also need to remember that, by nature, we are dead in our sins, even from the time of conception (Psalm 51, Ephesians 2, eg) and objects of His perfectly justified anger at our rebellion. God would be just in sending us to hell. That anyone gets saved is itself a result of God's goodness and grace, not a matter of entitlement. In this regard, I should remind you that the word 'grace' really means 'gift' (this is what the Greek word xaris, translated grace, means) - the Roman Catholic use is (to my mind at least) a distortion.

Nigel (Chelle's hubby)

Answer 5

Baptisim does not save any one, and nowhere in the bible does it show or say that it does The thief on the cross was told he would be in paradise. Was he baptised ?? Was Christ baptised as a child were any of the apostles . It is an out ward sign of an inward feeling . The word of God Says "repent and be baptised" Dont go twisting things around .The Eunic on the chariot was led to Christ and then he said there is water can I be baptised and this was after repentance or being saved or born again but it was after not before .Jesus stated even" those who belive in just My name will be Saved We are to have the faith like little children

Answer 6

I'm a non-catholic. I attend a non-denominational church. We are taught all one must do is accept Jesus as your savior, ask forgiveness of sin, and repent of sin.

They do not believe children or mentally disabled people will go to hell. Because your right, we serve a just God. They consider baptism symbolic of your sins being washed away.

I'm unsure about other denominations though.

Answer 7

It's not the Protestants that condemn unbaptized children to Hell.

Any denomination that believes in the necessity of reasoned assent prior to baptism, also believes that children before the age of reason are innocent.





Gee, they both sound kind of ridiculous when you lay it out like that, don't they?

Answer 8

Jesus was not saying to baptize babies but to allow them to come to him. Not one time was a baby baptized in the New Testiment but the adults were baptized. A baby can not make a decision, that is the parent making the decision for them.

Answer 9

Because Protestants see things one way and we Catholics see them another. Bottom line, end of subject, no further questions, your Honor.

In honor of our mutual Lord and Savior, Whose birth we commemorate here in a few days, do you think we could drop the confrontational questions and simply agree to love Jesus for a little while? It's His "birthday party" pretty soon, and I suspect He'd love a little less arguing and fighting as a gift -- even if it's just for a few minutes here.

God bless you, bro, and grant you a wonderful Christmas season.

Answer 10

F.Y.I There is no rosary mentioned in the bible. Even the " Popes " are not mentioned. The Catholic Bible is a man made doctrine where they have every words of God twisted by their own human knowledge!.