Is there self-contradiction within the ten commandments?

Question

Earlier today I was presented with a rather unusual question: Is it ever o.k. to lie? According to the 9th commandment it is NEVER an acceptable practice. Consider for a moment the following example:

In WWII you have taken it upon yourself to assist and abet a gathering of jews in your attic, you supply them with all the necessary resources for survival. One day some members of the gestopo come to your door and ask you whether or not you had been assisting jews.

In this situation a certain contridiction is developed because of 6th commandment: "thou shall not kill." One is essentially left with two choices which both violate a commandment.

1. Lie, resulting in the violation of the 9th commandment.
2. Tell the truth, resulting in the violation of the 6th commandment.

Is this abnormal? Does this phenomenon ensure damnation for some individuals due to the fact that they violate a commandment for every possible choice presented to them?

Answer 1

There are no contradictions, only deficiencies in understanding.

Please understand that the whole basis of the Law was to show love towards neighbor and love towards God. Yeshua said that those were the greatest of the commandments,Leviticus 19:18, Deuteronomy 6:5. These are COMMANDMENTS! Proof from the Messiah's own mouth: Matthew 22:35 Then one of them, which was a lawyer, asked him a question, tempting him, and saying, 36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law? 37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 38 This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

As these two Commandments are the greatest, and the basis for the Law, it would not have been showing love to the authorities to turn the Jews over to be murdered (enabling them to break a commandment) nor to the Jews (allowing them to be murdered).

This is all a bit more simple and a bit more complex than Hogie wants to admit.

Answer 2

Patrick if you notice there is an order to the Commandments and an organization. The very first commandment has a lot more weight than the second one right after. As you go down the commandments, although all of them are extremely important for you to have a good, just and merciful life, if forced to choose between two commandments, which can happen occasionally, you would give preference to the earlier commandment over the subsequent commandment.

Thus if my choice is between honoring my parents or keeping the Sabbath, I will keep my Sabbath, although I am being forced to choose to dishonor my parents which I do not wish to do.

All of the first five Commandments pertain to the Lord Almighty, except the last one, which obliquely connects us to the Creator, by talking about our creators on this Earth, our parents. Then the next five commandments that pertain to society begin, again in proportion to importance. It is all so beautiful!! May the Almighty increase the levels of His Servant Moses!! Amen.

In the case of the Gestapo coming for the Jewish folks hiding with you, I want to save their lives and it is the Gestapo who is forcing me to put one Commandment over the other.

Thus if I have a clear understanding of the Commandments, I will save their lives even at the expense of lying to Gestapo. In fact lying to the Gestapo helps the Gestapo by not letting them commit a crime, plus it saves the innocent lives of people who have not done any wrong.

Also remember, that the Almighty wants goodness to be established on Earth. If there are evil people such as the Nazis (or the modern day violent ones among the Zionists, sorry to say), who want to violate the rights of fellow human beings, when they were created just as anyone else, hungry and naked, it is okay to lie to them to save lives. It is also okay to kill them if they would not desist and insist on murdering the innocent. King David killed evil people.

By the way the Commandment says YOU Shall Not Murder!! And, it says YOU Shall Not Bear False Witness. In every aspect of the Ten Commandments it is clear to me that they are meant to bring about justice in human affairs.

Gestapo were spreading injustice. Fight injustice in all its forms is the underlying message of the Commandments. .. AND... I am not even a Jewish person... but a Muslim!!

That is the truth!!

Answer 3

A violation of the law done for a greater cause is permitted.

Matthew 12:11-12
Then He said to them, "What man is there among you who has one sheep, and if it falls into a pit on the Sabbath, will not lay hold of it and lift it out? "Of how much more value then is a man than a sheep? Therefore it is permitted to do good on the Sabbath."

In this example the act of saving the sheep is clearly unlawful and all the penalties of sabbath-breaking apply. However, it is permitted (not lawful - check the greek) to do this act. Why - because the greater good is served.

Matthew 23:23
"Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have neglected the weightier matters of the law: justice and mercy and faith. These you ought to have done, without leaving the others undone.

It seems like there is automatic forgiveness for small offenses when trying to do a greater act of kindness or mercy.

Answer 4

The concept of damnation is nonsense. The statement to the Gestapo is in fact a lie; it is a known falsehood, intended to deceive to the listener's disadvantage. But nobody in his right mind would condemn such a lie. This is not a self-contradiction within the commandments (although there are others, elsewhere); it is simply a more complex situation than the commandments were intended to deal with.

Answer 5

Actually, as someone pointed out, the commandment is to not bear false witness, which is somewhat different than lying.

And, the issue is far more general than you point out.

Is someone allowed to violate any commandment of the Torah (there are more than 10 of them) to save someone's life including one's own?
And the answer is Yes, except in three cases. A Jew has to give his life up rather than: murder, commit a sexual crime, or worship idols.
This is not a contradiction in any sense. G-d gave the commandments to the Jewish people to live by, not to die by them. Thus, G-d's will is "obey My commandments but in these circumstances, you they HAVE to be overridden".

Answer 6

You are just beginning to comprehend the problem in the old covenant-- the spirit of the law gets buried by the letter.

The midwives of Israel while in Egypt lied to Pharaoh who commanded them to kill the sons born to Israel. The result? God commended them for what they did.

Lying under the conditions you describe is a case of fulfilling the law, where the letter of the law is set aside. You would be demonstrating love for those whose lives you were preserving.

Maybe you will begin now to perceived some of why the old covenant law has passed; replaced by the spirit of the law.

.

Answer 7

I think people will do just about anything to try to prove that God in unjust. It is never ok to lie In your scenario would would not be killing someone. So your question is flawed. However the scriptures also say that if we sin we have an advocate, Jesus.
Then again you have to remember that no greater love is there than to lay down your life for your friends.

Answer 8

read it again? does it say "never ever ever lie no matter what" or does it say "not bear false witness"

one could argue that "bear false witness" means only specifically a false testimony, such as in a court or other sort of "testimony" type thing, such as accusing

additionally, it does not say "not kill" it says "not murder" big difference.

on top of that, at least in Judaism, preservation of life is above pretty much all other laws. thusly even if it WAS a direct and utter contradiction *which its not) saving a life comes first.

well, theres also no "damnation" in Judaism either....

Answer 9

The Gestapo would not be an authority of God, so you have to percieve what the question is really asking. Basically they are asking you whether you believe in their activity and if there is anyone who they should take away at your house. Words refer to meaning's, but things cannot be taken literally otherwise you will be taken advantage of.

Answer 10

>> Is there self-contradiction within the ten commandments?

        There is no contradiction. Ultimately, it is God's Law. If man is violating God's Law, God does not expect us to adhere to the letter of His Law in order to satisfy the depravity of the man whom is violating God's Law. Example:

        If one or both parents were molesting their child, do you think God expects that child to still honor their parent in keeping with the 5th Commandment? Yes and No. God would expect you to honor your parents by lovingly turning them in to the authorities so that your parent might get the help they need.

God bless.