Like many young people, I had my crisis of faith and I fell from Christianity quite quickly. It is quite simple. If God has an overall plan for everyone, then this means that events have already been determined. For example, one person is already deemed to move on to heaven when another is tossed to hell and they have no actual choice in the matter because it has all be figured into God's plan.
I realize that this may seem like an atheist retort, but I am myself quite a spiritual person. This is something that reveals itself in a multitude of religions, a confrontation of free will and an overall plan. I know of many other conflictions in religion, but this one sits vividly in my mind. Do you agree that this is a true Christian Paradox?
2007-12-12 14:34:30 · 23 answers · asked by Anonymous in Society & Culture ➔ Religion & Spirituality
I have always vehemently disagreed with the idea that God has a 'plan' for everyone. It is described in Chapter 2 of 'The Purpose-Driven Life,' and that chapter made me so angry, for the exact reason you mentioned, that I haven't cared to continue reading that book.
If it was in God's Plan for one of my best friends to be raped twice, then I don't think much of his planning. Also, I don't think God micro-manages our lives. If he did micro-manage, then how would that be consistent with free will? If all of our future choices are known, then there seems to me to be little point in making choices; someone else could just puppet-master us.
So I don't think God has a 'plan;' at least as mankind tends to think of it. I think God is much simpler than that. For me, God is love and only love, with no sense of time. God cannot prevent bad things from happening; that is primarily our responsibility, as people with the free will to make loving choices instead of selfish ones. God cannot prevent natural disasters, but we can do our best to be alert for early signs of danger.
I don't think there is a need for a plan.
2007-12-13 00:24:37 · answer #1 · answered by Chantal G 6 · 0⤊ 0⤋
Well sounds like you are or were a hard core Calvinist. The Calvinistic predestination doctrine of arbitrary election is not an established fact among all Christians . Some of us Christians believe in free will. The predestination Paul talks about is through the foreknowledge of God. Because God knows who will come to him beforehand , weare predestined to be conformed to his image. The foreknowledge of God is the key to understanding predestination. So there is no paradox when a free will choice determines your eternal destination . Merry Christmas
Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
2007-12-12 22:49:07 · answer #2 · answered by Anonymous · 0⤊ 0⤋
"If God has an overall plan for everyone, then this means that events have already been determined."
You need to understand omnipotence. God created time in the first place. We are limited by time by being forced to "operate in chronological order" if you will... God, being an omnipotent deity that is not bound by the rules of time like having a beginning or an end, is able to understand "the future" because it is a part of the device He created.
As humans, we have trouble with "predictions" coming true, because it seems to point to a reason behind the truth. If something is accurately predicted, you would say that the "predictor" understands the mechanics of the situation in a way that allows him to foretell the outcome. This gets especially confusing to us when the predicted situations are supposedly based off of random things like personal decisions. This is why people come to the conclusion that because God is aware of what they are going to do, their fate is predetermined.
I would only ask you to consider watching a favorite movie of yours again. Your knowledge (could you even call it a prediction?) of the actions of the Characters has no effect on the decisions they make throughout the plot, yet you can accurately explain what they plan to do or say before the character in the movie is able to fulfill it's destiny. This is the closest we can come to experiencing what God calls predetermination.
2007-12-12 22:38:55 · answer #3 · answered by Anonymous · 2⤊ 2⤋
The stand that God has already decided/dictated every person's actions is flawed
Here it is in simple terms.
1. God has a plan for everyone, and that is that they should all obey.
2. Regarding God's plan, he does not know, from each human, who will comply with his plan.
3. He does not know the eternal outcome of each and every person's life because, that is determined by that peron's decisions.
4. There is no eternal hell, for why would a 'God of love" torment human souls forever for rejecting his plan for 50-80 years
I can see clearly that all of your confusion, and perception of 'contradictions' are squarely based upon inaccurate knowledge, and hope that you will do the wisest thing any on can ever do. That is, to (before tossing all religion aside as false-because of the perceived 'conflict') do your part to seek out truth, pray to God to know what it is HE wants you to know and do, and then test every claim of every person, to find out for yourself where the absolute truth is!
It may take months, it may take years, but, from what I can gather, you should at least try the journey, for, at the other end of the search, is the satisfaction that there is a reason for everything!
2007-12-12 22:38:01 · answer #4 · answered by Tim 47 7 · 4⤊ 1⤋
No, because true Christianity does not teach eternal torment,
& that is because the Bible actually does Not teach that there is any afterlife, or that God is hateful...
Neither does true Christianity teach fate,
because the Bible itself actually teaches free will, instead.
God does have a plan, but no one is forced to be a part of it. He only wants those who are happy to cooperate & make themselves a part of his plan. They are the only ones to fit into it, but it is their own choice, not his...
Love is voluntary, & the Creator is Loving.
“Test the inspired expressions to see whether they originate with God, because many false prophets have gone forth into the world." --1 John 4:1
2007-12-12 23:24:43 · answer #5 · answered by Anonymous · 0⤊ 0⤋
No, it's not.
God has a plan for us, that is true. We have the choice to reject that plan. That is free will.
God's primary plan is for all to come to Him, to know Him, and to accept His plan of salvation. Our free will, we can determine to either reject His plan, or to accept His plan. Predestination is a misapplied concept by misinterpreting the Holy Scriptures. He has not already deemed to send some to eternal life and others to eternal punishment. Our actions have already deemed that outcome.
2007-12-12 22:43:24 · answer #6 · answered by Acts 4:12 6 · 1⤊ 0⤋
i disagree, though God may see the outcome of many things he gives us the free wil to make a choice spinning it off one way or the other. God knows the outcome of both descisions but only you can descide what you are going to do.
2007-12-12 22:42:14 · answer #7 · answered by Thumbs down me now 6 · 0⤊ 0⤋
You're talking about that Augustinian puppet theology Calvinism - no it's not Biblical. God respects the free will which he had designed in human nature.
2007-12-12 22:55:05 · answer #8 · answered by Steve Amato 6 · 0⤊ 0⤋
my fiance is going through this and she is already 19 so fear not my friend, as far as i have come to believe it is the two pill notion. you have the red and the blue pill (yeah I know the matrix) because god exists out of time, God knows what would happen if you choose the blue as well as choose the red, your will and desire are still yours to make, but the consequences of either of these actions is known to God.
2007-12-12 22:50:00 · answer #9 · answered by Adam of the wired 7 · 0⤊ 0⤋
Zach, the Holy Spirit is our teacher. Pray and ask God to lead you to the belief he wants you to have. He will answer that prayer.
I do not believe in predestination only to the point that God has already determined that whoever repents of sin and believes in his Son will be saved.
God has given us free will, meaning to choose which direction we want to go. To him or away from him.
It is important to study the word and have knowledge. God has said my people parish for lack of knowledge.
2007-12-12 22:50:09 · answer #10 · answered by Anonymous · 0⤊ 1⤋