Dionysus was crucified? Where?

Question

Note: Do not bring up connections other than those mentioned. Most of them have similiar flaws but they aren't the point here. Sorry for spelling mistakes. I'm not doing a spell chack.

I often here it said that there are parallels between Christianity and other deities, the main one being Jesus and Dionysus. They make these main comparisons:
Dionysus was crucified
Dionysus was resurrected
Dionysus was born of a virgin mortal woman
Dionysus was called 'liberator'.
Dionysus turned water into wine.

I used to think these were very convincing and believed them for a time, when in actuality, after I studied a little more I found that these parallels were extraordinarily more complicated than this, suffice to say, they are vague superficial lies.

I'm going to present these in the manner Atheists usually do, with no historical or textual evidence delving further into the generalizations.

Let's look:

(remember, these are presented as a 'so called' scholar would present them.)

Dionysus was crucified -
This immediately brings up images of a crucifixion scene involving a cross. But note they always say 'crucified' and leave it at that. This is because Dionysus was never put on a cross, it's even a stretch to say he was crucified. Scholars tie the crucifiction stories to two events from the Dionysus myth, the first being a reference which says 'Dyonisus was put up in a tree', which was interpreted as crucificion, another version implies 'he was hung from a tree', while most likely it was, 'he sat up in a tree'. Dionysus was an agricultural deity, and like many other agricultural deities of the time it would not be at all unusual to find them sitting up in trees looking over the land.

The second story they use to back up the crucifiction claim is much more vague - if you thought the above was a stretch, prepare to let your jaw drop to the floor. The story goes, "Hera had the titans lure the infant Dionysus into a trap

where they ripped the child to shreds leaving only his heart. Zeus, Dionysus' father, then finds the body parts...
In one account Zeus takes the heart and ties it to his testicles, he then has physical sex with a mortal virgin which places the seed in her womb."
In another account Zeus gathers all the body parts and ties them to his inner thigh or testicles. He then has sex with the virgin and transmits Dionysus, giving him a 'second birth', for this he is called 'the twice born'.

They equate Dionysus' body parts being tied to Zeus thigh or testicles to be sort of crucification.

These claims were popularized when an amulet was found depicting Dionysus hanging on a cross, which they said indicated Christianity borrowed the image. Scholars then started looking for 'crucification' signs in the Dionysus' myth. They came up with the above two scenarios. As it turned out the amulet was from 200ad, and the pagans borrowed it from Christianity.

Dionysus was resurrected -

Not exactly. Firstly, this comes from the above story about Dionysus being ripped apart and implanted in the mortal woman's womb, thus giving birth to Dionysus for a second time. He wasn't so much as resurrected, as he was remade - he was, as I said, 'twice born'. Once again these people will slam out the word 'resurrected' and paint images similar to that of Jesus, but as we see this story is nothing like that of Jesus beyond the use of that word, which isn't present in the myth itself.
Which leads us to the second connection.

Once again we find these scholars reaching for a second theory should their other fall. This element of renewal formed an important part of his image, as Dionysus was an agricultural deity who dies in winter and is renewed in spring, returning each time. They claim this yearly death and rebirth cycle proves a connection to Christianity, but Jesus died once to be the final sacrifice on this earth.

Dionysus was born of a virgin mortal woman -

Of course, now we can see from the above that the woman was in fact not a virgin. Well, she was a virgin until she had physical sex with Zeus, and received his seed. There's even little evidence to suggest the woman was a virgin in the first place, if she was, she certainly wasn't after. God didn't have sex with Mary.

Another version states he was born of Persephone, queen of the underworld, then inserted into the mortal woman.

Dionysus and Jesus were both called 'liberator' -

Jesus was called liberator because he came with a message of freedom from Satan's lies.

Dionysus was known as the Liberator for freeing one from one's normal self, by madness, sloth, ecstasy, or wine. The divine mission of Dionysus was to mingle the music of the aulos and to bring an end to care and worry. It's often said Dionysus is the god of wine, but he was not the god of wine. Wine was merely a primary means of creating all of the above.

Dionysus turned water into wine -

Jesus turned water to wine to show his power over other pagan gods who claimed the same.

Dionysus didn't turn water into wine, he created wine through various other means, usually people would leave empty basins out and hope they'd fill themselves over night. The wedding connection is pretty abstract too. Jesus was a guest at a wedding. Dionysus wasn't at a wedding, he was lavishing on his private island when he was visited by a wedding couple who ran out of wine.

"Quote: "I'm going to present these in the manner Atheists usually do, with no historical or textual evidence delving further into the generalizations."

More than even, actually."

I was referring to the way Atheist slap out the three word lines (Jesus was this - Dionysus was this) without referencing the Dionysus story or the bible. I gave reference to both sides, and summarized the stories as accurately as I could.

"I'm just curious, though. What are your sources?"

just go onto Wikipedia or any source for Dionysus info, most of them will summaries the story. Some sites will do so using those keywords we discussed and leave it at that, while others will go into the actual stories of the rebirth, the virgin mother, and wine. The only places which draw the connections are the ones making the claims. It's near impossible to make a link if you don't already know the claims.

"Quote: Virgin birth, for instance, is very popular with all religions, both BC and AD, and can be found in the stories of the following mythological deities:"

But as said, Semele (the virgin) had physical sex with Zeus in order to conceive. She wasn't a virgin anymore

Please don't go throwing in the other myth connections. I spent ages typing this up, give me a break.

And I'm aware of most of those already - used to be atheist.

Answer 1

Thanks for the info, it's what I've been screaming all along. I'm SO TIRED of these Jesus=Horus/Dionysus/Mithra/Krishna/Buddha theories.

I'm just curious, though. What are your sources?

Most of the comparisons drawn between Horus and Jesus come from the later writings on Egyptian mythology, namely writings from the 1st and 2nd century...A.D. So who copied whom?

The earliest writings of Mithra, also, do not include any comparison to the stories of Jesus. However, writings from the late 1st century and early 2nd century A.D. DO. Again, who copied whom?

Above is a clear example of misinformation. Horus was not born of a virgin, there is no indication in the earliest myths that he was teaching ANYWHERE at the age of 12, he did NOT have twelve disciples (according to most myths he was accompanied by sixteen mortals and four gods). In some myths, he didn't even die. In others, he did, but was "resurrected" each day with the rising of the sun, or every spring.

Most of the "dying/rising" gods that precede Jesus were based on agriculture, and none of them had a specific timeline. All of the events in mythology occurred in some unknown, distant past.

Answer 2

Dionysus Crucified

Answer 3

Dionysus was not crucified. He was slashed by a sword by Zeus for Hera (attempting to prove no love for Dionysus mother, in the mythology that holds Zeus was his father Hera was always after him from birth) and thus given immortal status after Zeus repaired his wounds. he was also given a drink with which he passed out and was summoned to Mt. Olympus, where he became one of the Twelve Olympians. Dionysus was never considered crucified until the fourth or fifth century Christian era. No original mythology holds that he was actually crucified and killed..

Two myths of Birth: Dionysus had two mortal parents and was not born a god. Dionsys was the product of one of Zeus dalliances here on earth.

Dionysus was not resurrected because he was not crucified. He did return to earth for a short period (descending from Olympus) where he enchanted women to rip Pentheus limb to limb and and his mother to rip his head off.

Dionysus never turned water into wine, he was the god of wine (not a birth-death-rebirth savior god) , the marriage of Canan turning water into wine is a allegory to show Jesus as more powerful the Dionysus being able to create the god of wine.


No one has still hit on the right pagan god used for filling in the gaps and what we do not know about the historical Jesus' life (he is out there, because religion like all of history is a developmental process humans can only understand the new in context of the old. Taking what they already know and applying it to what they are learning. one would have to be a fool to deny this so I don;t know why people think it would be such a shock to most people that parts of Jesus' life were borrowed) But you won't find this god readily on google or the internet. It's not Mithra, Horus, Sol Viticus, Dionysus or any of the others I have ever seen named on Yahoo Answers.

Answer 4

Ultimately, it doesn't matter if there are other myths that are similar to Jesus as long as we have good reason to believe Jesus was an actual person. There was a book written about a ship called the Titan in about 1898. The Titan shares many of the same characteristics as the Titanic. So much so that anyone piecing what bits remain of the 2 stories together a 1000 years from now would likely declare them to be about the same ship, or 2 versions of the same myth. But, if there is good evidence to suggest the Titanic actually existed, then the fact that there was a similar story that predated it (though interesting) is irrelevant.

Answer 5

I don't think that people are trying to say that Dionysus and Jesus are identical, but that they share common traits and similarities. You yourself have just proven this.

Atheists bring up Dionysus in an attempt to demonstrate that the Jesus mythology isn't unusual.

Virgin birth, for instance, is very popular with all religions, both BC and AD, and can be found in the stories of the following mythological deities:


Deganawidah
Huitzilopochtli
Hunahpu
Xbalanque
Laozi
Montezuma
The Iranian version of Mithra

And so on..

Answer 6

Dionysian religion and Christianity are significantly parallel; according to Martin Hengel, "Dionysus had been at home in Palestine for a long time".[cite this quote] Some of the parallels between the Dionysus and Jesus myths are narrative: both were fathered by a god (though in very different ways), Dionysus travelled into the underworld and returned; both are put on trial by skeptical lawmakers for agitating the populace.[original research?]

The modern scholar Barry Powell also notes that Christian notions of eating and drinking the "flesh" and "blood" of Jesus were influenced by the cult of Dionysus. Dionysus was also distinct among Greek gods, as a deity commonly felt within individual followers. Another example of possible influence on Christianity, Dionysus' followers, as well as another god, Pan, are said to have had the most influence on the modern view of Satan as animal-like and horned.[22]

Peter Wick argues that the use of wine symbolism in the Gospel of John, including the story of the Marriage at Cana at which Jesus turns water into wine, is intended to show Jesus as superior to Dionysus.[23]

Answer 7

Actually, Dionysus isn't the main one that's compared to Jesus. Horus is. Horus is much closer to Jesus then Dionysus is. From Virgin Birth, Child Prodigy at 12, Baptized at 30, performing miracles, traveling with 12 disciples, etc etc. But again, that's not unique. Many many Pagan Gods before Jesus share the same story

Answer 8

You can't be bothered to post your sources, I can't be bothered to give you a serious answer. We're even.

"I'm going to present these in the manner Atheists usually do, with no historical or textual evidence delving further into the generalizations."

More than even, actually. Personally, I see no particular difference between all of the birth-death-rebirth savior gods. Christians are still harping on about theirs is the only significant difference.

Answer 9

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He was torn to pieces by enraged women. Suffragettes?

Answer 10

Thank you. I have seen so many bits of history being twisted or just lied about on some "sites" . I wish people would get some of there facts backed up by mainstream history and archaeology.