Very simple rules of thumb are nice, and some insist on them, but real spoken language may refuse to follow them!
Originally it was a simple matter of "use 'who' when the word is the subject of the sentence (or clause), 'whom' when the word is an object". That all originated at a time when (Old) English made heavy use of "case", that is, different forms of nouns and pronouns (usually marked by different endings) to indicate the grammatical function of the word as subject, object, possessive...
But that's not quite the case anymore [pun intended]. In REAL spoken English the basic rule is now "Use 'who', EXCEPT right after a preposition ("for whom...?" but "who is it for?")"
A little explanation:
Notice that according to the original rule you SHOULD say both "Whom is this for?" But almost noone would say that! On the other hand, people often DO follow the rule when they say "To whom should I address the letter?"
To clairify -- the problem is that Modern English, unlike Old English and many other languages (including Latin) makes VERY little use of case endings to distinguish the role a noun or pronoun plays in a sentence (word order is far more critical). The only instance where we change the form according to case is several of the personal pronouns ("I/he/she/we/they" for subject, "me/him/her/us/them" for object). As for relative pronouns, "which" uses the same form for subject or object. That leaves "who-m" as the ONE that stands somewhere in the middle. Hence the confusion.
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You can skip this part if you like, but you may find it useful for understanding other questions (like why we say "It's ME" not "It's I").
The other side of this great limitation in the use of CASE is that syntax, especially WORD ORDER, becomes critical Latin might change the order of words all around, yet say exactly the same thing.. and you are not confused because the CASE endings tell you the role of the words. But you cannot do that in English --changing the order of words makes a big diference!
Simple example: "The dog bit the man" is NOT the same as "The man bit the dog" --and the difference is effected ONLY by changing the word order
Notice that in "The dog bit the man" the order is Subject-Veb-Object ("SVO"). This is the basic order for English sentences and clauses, and what we usually expect to see. So we apply it to many simple constructions. We are following this ORDER in the simple setences:
"Who did you speak to?" [formal usage: "Whom did you speak to?" or better "To whom did you speak?"]
"It was me." [formal demands: "It was I."]
"Who" in "Who is this?" falls in the "subject slot" (according to the common "SVO" pattern), and so ends up using the "subject form" that is 'who' rather than 'whom'. And the "me" of "It's me" falls in the "object slot", so uses the "object form". Grammarians trying to make English follow LATIN rules of case may object, but English is NOT Latin, and refuses to be pushed into the Latin model.
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So, how do we decide when to use "who" and "whom"?
Again. I do NOT agree on the simple "substitution" rule. It is useful for distinguishing "you and I" (subject) from "you and me" (object), and it may be "formally" correct for who/whom, but thanks to the minimizing of case forms in English, scarcely anyone actually SPEAKS that way (and if they do, they get odd looks!) In fact, I sincerely doubt that those who have given you this sort of answer even try to follow it consistently.
Incidentally, note here that I'm focusing mainly on IN-formal use, that is, everyday speech. And we must remember that when informal differs from formal that does NOT mean the informal use is "wrong"! (Nor is it "uneducated" or "slang".) It's simply different! (And, as I noted above, it is based on a basic feature of English, viz., the importance of word order.)
So here is my basic rule of thumb, which is based on normal English WORD ORDER. For normal, informal use, that is, outside of formal writing (where someone demands it of you!):
Feel free to use "who" in ALL instances --whether as subject or object-- EXCEPT when you the word falls IMMEDIATELY after a preposition (where by definition it cannot be the subject). In that instance use "whom". Thus we say "TO whoM it may concern", "WITH whoM are you speaking?", "FOR whoM the bell tolls". But when the preposition is moved we say things like "who are you speaking with?". Of course, most English speakers simply avoid the preceding preposition as much as possible, since it too sounds "stuffy".
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SO. . . for the sentence you gave us. . . In informal spoken English it is perfectly fine to say "I wonder who he is with." It's hard even to imagine a natural sentence, informal or formal, to express this idea using whom (that is, in the expression "WITH WHOM").
Incidentally, the bit about not ending a sentence with a preposition is silliness. There is no reason for that artificial "rule". It serves no purpose in English, and makes for some ugly sentences.
2007-12-04 11:03:32
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answer #1
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answered by bruhaha 7
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Don't trust me apparently because although I'm a native English speaker I always seem to get the thumbs down to grammar questions, I only try to present English as it is most usually spoken, to my ear. In this case, although the pedants may tell you otherwise, (i.e. that there is a grammar rule not to end a sentence with a preposition), 'I wonder who he is with?' is totally acceptable spoken English to about 99% of the population. Whom is pretty much only used in more formal speech now, we have a covering legal letter 'to whom it may concern', or when someone hasn't introduced themself you say something sarcastic like 'to whom do I have the pleasure of speaking?' Without being rude to anyone, your answer 1 is frankly absurd, no one speaks English like that.
2007-12-04 06:03:43
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answer #2
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answered by Anonymous
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Who and whom are tough. Most people just use "who" to avoid the whole sordid mess.
"Who" refers to subjects while "whom" refers to objects.
"He is with whom?" is correct as "He" is the subject and "whom" is the object.
This does seem overly formal in most situations, in which case "who is he with" is easily understood.
Don't be too discouraged. Even grammar experts have a hard time annoucing their presence with "It is I!" when entering a room rather than the common, though technically incorrect, "It's me."
2007-12-04 06:56:40
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answer #3
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answered by theacrob 6
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Simply put, "who" is the subjective case and "whom" is the objective case.
ie.
"Who" is used with a verb.
And
"Whom" is used with a preposition.
Who is he with, I wonder. (Is the grammatically correct.)
"Who" is the subject of the verb "is".
Of whom are you speaking.
In this sentence 'whom" is objective of the preposition "of".
2007-12-04 05:46:15
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answer #5
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answered by Anonymous
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