Sola Scriptura or His Church, where is the true authority as given by Christ?

Question

By the end of the first century the Church was formed around the bishop who represented the Church in apostolic succession. The great commission was well underway and had extended to the Gentiles as well as the Jews. In scriptures we see St. Paul in his epistles telling the Church to respect the Sacred Traditions handed to them coming from both written sources and oral ones. Even the written sources were delivered orally as transcripts were very rare and few people were literate. There was not widespread distribution of what we consider today to be inspired Scripture as decided at the African Synods by the Church in the late fourth and early fifth centuries. Throughout the first sixteen centuries of the Church there was never any question that the authority of truth rested in.....
http://blog.360.yahoo.com/blog-S6YMuFYyaa9ESBoW5DFwEjL_HhqA?p=16

Budroscoe,

Thanks for asking, Jesus created only one Church which is the Catholic Church.

Father K,
You are a wise man.

Edge,

That is a very good question and I think that it would be a good topic for a blog since there is not enough room here to answer such a question adequately. Allow me to say this, If you only saw a farm pond and had no knowledge of any other body of water could you convince yourself that it is the largest and most magnificent body of water ever seen? Did Jesus command His followers to write Scriptures. No, but He did command His followers to spread the Gospel and to teach as He taught. One of the Gospel writers made a quite profound statement that should be a answer to your question, He said that all the books in the world could not contain all that our Saviors taught to the apostles. Based on that statement alone is it logical to assume that there is more and a fullness of truth not realized by Sola Scriptura alone. Of course, and it is contained in the Sacred Traditions of His Church. Preserved as He promised until the end of the age uncorrupted by error.

Answer 1

As has been amply demonstrated by the other answerers, this idea that the Bible contains the sum and total of everything we believe in as Christians is simply not substantiated anywhere in Scripture. Paul tells us in his second letter to the Thessalonians that we are to honor the traditions of the Church, whether they are found in written form or passed on by oral tradition. In John's second and third epistles, he addresses the recipient and tells them both times that there are other things he wishes them to learn, but he prefers to tell them face to face when he visits. In the Gospels, we are told that there are not enough books in all the world to contain all the teachings of Christ and all the accounts of his ministry. The Bible is very clear that there is more to Christian theology and spirituality than what the 72 books of the Bible contain.

Edge makes an interesting point which also deserves addressing, but I think there's a flaw in his argument. He says:

"Everything that we know that they specifically taught is in the Bible. Can you show me anything Paul taught that is not contained in the Bible? I seriously doubt if you can. This is why we believe Sola scriptura. Everything that is known for certain was taught by the apostles is in the Bible."

And the answer, of course, is yes, we can show you many things that were specifically taught or believed by the Apostles and the early Church that are not specifically in the Bible. However, since Protestants rely so heavily on Sola Scriptura, I highly doubt that they would accept as authentic anything that isn't in the Bible to begin with. We can even present the works of the Early Church Fathers in support of something that IS in the Bible (transubstantiation of the Eucharist, for example), and the argument is immediately dismissed because that level of detail is not specifically part of Scripture. Anything that Catholics could present even with ample evidence of its Apostolic origins would be dismissed as "man-made traditions".

So again, we are at an impasse. For Protestants to acknowledge that Catholics *can* produce examples of Apostolic Tradition that are not specifically covered in Scripture, they would have to become Catholic. For Catholics to believe that everything the Apostles taught is specifically contained in Scripture, they would have to become Protestant.

I still contend, however, that if our Protestant brothers and sisters know the Bible as well as they claim to, they should be very well aware of the fact that Sola Scriptura is not Scriptural in origin. In fact, Biblical canon is not Scriptural in origin, and is itself an Apostolic Tradition. Why they are willing to accept this one (very significant!) Tradition but reject all others out of hand is something I do not understand at all.

Answer 2

The idea that all revealed truth is to be found in scripture only is contradicted by Scripture (1 Corinthians 11:2, 2 Thessalonians 2:15, 2 Thessalonians 3:6, 1 Timothy 3:15, 2 Peter 1:20-21, 2 Peter 3:16)


The Church teaches by looking not only at Sacred Scripture, but into History and by reading what the earliest Christians have written, what those who've sat on the Chair of Peter have spoken consistently with Scripture and Tradition, and what they've solemnly defined. To believe that the Bible is our only source of Christian Truth is unbiblical and illogical.

Answer 3

By the Word of God alone,Who is Jesus Christ,true God and True Man, which is communicated by theOne Holy Catholic and Apostolic Bible in the One holy Catholic and Apostolic Tradition and the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church.

Sola Scriptura,like Sola Fide, is not in the Bible
nor is it historically correct
since the Noah and Abraham,Isaac and Jacob
did very well without any written Scripture
and the very canon of Scripture is dependent on the discernment of the Church
and the message of Apostolic Tradition(without which St Paul would have had nothing to preach and he did well enough without a written New Testament) nor is it logical or real since every interpretation of the Scripture has to reach out to reason and the discerment and traditions and authority of others.
The Early Church always appealed to the oral Tradition and not the Bible alone as we can see in the Arian/Orthodox arguments about the Lord and Trinity. Trinitarian Protestant churches appeal to the authority of the Councils of Nicea and Constantinople I and to Apostolic tradition and not just to the bible alone fro their understanding of doctrine and the bible and where they disagree with catholicism they appeal to protestant Church traditions.

Answer 4

There are over 50 different versions of the holy bible, just in english then you add in the various language translations and of those hundreds, maybe thousands, of "interpretations" and "translations" that were handed down by word-of-mouth AND various writings you might find an authentic collection of something. Remember the secret game? You sit a bunch of people in a circle and whisper a secret, by the time it gets to the last person it's completely different. The ten commandments were supposedly handed down from God himself and the rules are pretty simple. So why do people feel the need to attach themselves to a contradictory pack of stories written by God-knows-who that add to the confusion of what your God really wants? There is even controversy over the translation of the most widely accepted version of the bible, the king james version. Supposedly, Jesus never wrote a word. So if your Savior never wrote a book of your holy instruction manual and not even all of his disciples did, how can you participate in sola scriptura? It's logic like this that makes people question the entire purpose of religion. If the "church" is the pillar of truth...then I'm the next President of the United States. Let me say that I am in no way trying to change anyone's religion or lack of it, I'm a free thinker and this is just my opinion.

Answer 5

St Peter and Paul was led to Rome by the Spirit, after the authority given to them by JC, Mathew 16:18. Both sacred scripture and tradition are essential in understanding God, for without tradition we would not know anything about Jesus Christ except of the prophecies foretelling his Birth, death and Resurrection. The Gospels are really traditional, in a sense, since they are the visible actions remembered by the Apostles.

Answer 6

Protestants and Catholics will always fight over Sola scriptura. Neither side can give in on this issue. If the Catholics did then they would have to leave the Catholic church. If the protestants gave in they would have to become Catholics. I don't see either happening any time soon.

Let me ask you something. You speak of Paul and both written and oral traditions. Everything we know of what Paul taught or said is contained in the scripture. There is not one single bit of tradition or anything else that Paul taught that is not contained in scripture. The same is true of all the apostles and writers of the Bible. Everything that we know that they specifically taught is in the Bible. Can you show me anything Paul taught that is not contained in the Bible? I seriously doubt if you can. This is why we believe Sola scriptura. Everything that is known for certain was taught by the apostles is in the Bible.

Answer 7

The confidence that Paul had in the Scriptures, and which he taught Timothy, was clearly understood by the great church father, Augustine. In his treatise to prepare leaders of the church in an understanding of the Bible (0n Christian Doctrine), Augustine wrote: “Among those things which are said openly in Scripture are to be found all those teachings which involve faith, the mores of living, and that hope and charity which we have discussed.”

Answer 8

I like a lot of what you had to say in that the Scripture used as a weapon of exclusion and to make one person or group special over another is by far not what the intent of Christ was. I am curious which church today you would identify as His Church. Thank you I appreciate your post.

Answer 9

The most amusing thing, Father....nowhere IN Scripture does it say that Scripture alone is our only authority.

Amazingly contradictory.

Answer 10

Why should there be a contradiction between the two? Why does the Catholic church reject the teachings of the New Testament and put themselves in the place of the apostles?