Do atheists throw the baby out with the bath water?

Question

suppose you go to see a Disney movie and yet the whole schtick is just too maudlin, too absurd to stomach and you go out to blow chunks. Do you then decide to NEVER SEE ANY MOVIES AGAIN because you think that's all there is to movies? Obviously the fundamentalists view of religion is naive at best, immature and dangerous at worst. But the universe ISN'T a dichotomy of fundamentalists on one side and absolute athiesm on the other. Why don't you keep exploring?

corrosion. you mean like The Tao of Physics?
bigirv. That was an ad hominem. You lose
lb_centaur very thoughtful answer
first person and wc fields. play on words, not very well thought out. Actually, no thinking at all. Sorry. You lose.
Others, so so. Some answers aren't bad, just non-responsive

and we have another well-thought out answer from Pedestal42

Answer 1

Bad analogy.

What more is there to explore? Read the bible, spent countless hours discussing Jesus and religion with Christians. They were unable to answer any of my questions. Their only proof was, "because the bible says so." Never had an original thought beyond parroting the bible.



I have always been an atheist. OK, that is not completely true. I am not an atheist. I am not a believer. I am not an agnostic. I am none of these because the answer to god's existence is unimportant.

People ask what would convince me that god truly exists. While I am not sure, I am certainly open to any tangible evidence. I do not know what evidence would convince me because I believe it is impossible to prove the existence of god. What evidence would convince you that god does not exist? See the conumdrum: it is difficult to answer their question! See falsifiability (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falsifiability ) for an explanation of theory and the rules of evidence.

Do not quote bible passages as evidence of god's existence. This is my standard of proof, not yours. However, if proof were proffered that convinced me god exists, I would change absolutely nothing in my life or my behavior. The existence or not of god does not matter. Like many humans I live a purposeful life and god does not add more purpose.

What if evidence were produced that convinced you god does not exist with certainty (evidence according to your standards of proof)? What would you change in your life?

- Would you stop evangelizing?
- Would you start sinning more?
- Would you stop helping those less fortunate than you?
- Would you feel that life is meaningless?

Let us examine one area Christians think about atheists. Christians seem to think non-believers hope that their good deeds will get them into heaven, should heaven really exist. The Torah (Old Testament) has a word for this: mitzvah (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitzvah ). Many atheists such as myself perform mitzvahs not for the sake of getting an admission ticket into heaven, but because performing good deeds and helping those in need is the right thing to do. In other words, these are selfless acts.

Christians sometimes proffer Pascal’s Wager (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascal%27s_wager ) suggesting to non-believers that they should accept Jesus (John 3:16) as some sort of insurance policy against hell, just in case it turns out god really exists. The fallacy with this line of reasoning is that faith in god for some reward or to avoid punishment is not faith at all. It is a selfish act to receive something in return for a belief. The point of religious belief so that one becomes a better person, not to receive a reward or please a spiritual being.

Even the Torah addresses sacrifices or any other act in an effort to please god as displeasing god.

So why do you believe in god? If it is to enter heaven, that is very selfish. If god, heaven, and hell do not exist, would you still perform mitzvahs and follow the Golden Rule or would you say what is the point? Mitzvahs are not meant to please god.

Many Christians also claim that only those who believe can live a moral life and those who do not believe in god have no moral compass. That implies that one lives a moral life, not because it is the right thing to do, but because god expects us to be moral. Again, the fallacy with this reasoning is that mitzvahs and morals should be followed because god or a holy book dictates rules to us and not for personal philosophical or spiritual reasons.

In summary, I have no stake in god's existence. I do not see existence of heaven or hell as a reward and punishment system. If the whole purpose of the Golden Rule preached by Jesus was to treat others and I would like to be treated, I can follow his philosophy without believing in god. What type of god would want me to pledge my fealty to him or her simply for the sake of believing or proving my allegiance? I would expect god is beyond pride and the need for some following.

For all those thumbs down votes, I ask you to examine your personal motivation for believing in god.

Why is the concept that one can perform selfless mitzvahs and possess moral values without belief in god so difficult for many Christians to comprehend?

Answer 2

The stance of fundamentalists wasn't my main reason, or even a significant datum, in my becoming an atheist.

If they are of use it's that, since they are associated with a range of different religions (and, to be fair, political organisations and other causes as well), they demonstrate that some human beings are capable of firmly believing *anything*, and that firmness and confidence of belief cannot be taken, alone, as pointing to truth.

I've spent many years exploring, thank you. My move from Christianity to atheism wasn't made lightly.

I must admit the most incomprehensible position I have encountered was probably advanced liberal Christianity.
(No resurrection, no miracles, no hell...)
There, they appear to have thown out the baby while insisting the bathwater is excellent.

Answer 3

This atheist could by no means waste such nutritious, scrumptious meals. Oh, I'm drooling once more. Stir a little bit flour into the drippings, thicken the stew with a satisfactory, flavorful roux.

Answer 4

why would I 'never see any movies again'?.... maybe I'd give up DISNEY movies, but I"m sure there'd be other movie makers that would be deserving of my notice occasionally... or maybe.... I would develope an adversion to the smell of popcorn and not go back because of that....or maybe they'd have found out that I robbed another movie theater and wouldn't let me come into theirs?.......... or maybe.... I'd find that those few minutes of living in a non-reality were just not worth it because real life was much more fun and interesting and challenging.....
repetitious dogma just never did float my boat............

Answer 5

Sir, there are differences between babies, movies, and religion and I quite assure you I've studied dozens in my spare time and each was just as much balogna as the last if not more.....though I will admit some of the fairy tales were amusing :)

Answer 6

which would you suggest- i have went through several different religions care of the foster system-and have studied even more-they all want you to believe in something that doesnt exist-got any that dont-then maybe i will consider-just my thoughts-smile and enjoy the day

Answer 7

I challenge you to come up with an even worse analogy.

See www.physics.org if you think we don't keep exploring.

Answer 8

I have explored Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, multiple paganistic paths, Buddhism, Taoism, and Deism.

I'll stick with atheism, thanks.

Answer 9

Guess what, you will find there was no baby in the bathwater.

Answer 10

That is the premise behind science...