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I would think that the smallest sin after I accept Christ, would be grounds for casting me into hell, because every time I sin, I'm basically "opting out" of my salvation, especially if I don't repent until later. So unless every sin is accounted for in repentance, is salvation an on and off thing throughout my life?

2007-11-30 00:50:07 · 19 answers · asked by ccrider 7 in Society & Culture Religion & Spirituality

19 answers

“That ye may know
That ye have eternal life.”

“Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God, of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment. And this will we do, if God permit. For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, and have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, if they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God: But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.” (Heb 6:1-8).
It would appear from the above verse that salvation is dependent upon ‘keeping in God’s good books’, that salvation is conditional, that it can be lost. Yet the Bible states that we (believers) ‘…HAVE eternal life’ (1Jn 5:13). It would be a strange kind of eternal life if we have it now, yet don’t next year, or next season, or next month, or next week, or tomorrow, or in five minutes’ time, or in one second’s time. ‘Aha!’ cries the sceptic, in triumph: ‘a contradiction, a mistake in the word of God! This proves the Bible was just a collection of thoughts from philosophical men!’ They would be correct, if the idea that the saved could depart from the faith is true; yet that is not what is in view here. I shall explain later. There is another passage many quote to show we can lose our salvation:

“Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;” (1Ti 4:1 AV).

Again there seems here to be a teaching that the saved can lose their salvation. Reading it in that way, however, hinges on the meaning of the word ‘depart’. The word translated ‘depart’, ‘aphistemi’ (pronounced ‘aff-ist’ay’me’), means 1) ‘to make stand off, cause to withdraw, to remove; to excite to revolt: 2) to STAND OFF, to STAND ALOOF; TO GO AWAY, to DEPART FROM ANYONE; to DESERT, WITHDRAW from one; to fall away, become faithless; to shun, flee from; to cease to vex one; to withdraw one’s self from, to fall away; to keep one’s self from, to absent one’s self from. (Strong’s Concordance).
If read in context, we see that the CAPITALISED definitions sum up the meaning of 1Tim. 4:1. Verses 2-10 read:

“Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron; forbidding to marry, [and commanding] to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth. For every creature of God [is] good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving: for it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer. If thou put the brethren in remembrance of these things, thou shalt be a good minister of Jesus Christ, nourished up in the words of faith and of good doctrine, whereunto thou hast attained. But refuse profane and old wives’ fables, and exercise thyself [rather] unto godliness.
For bodily exercise profiteth little: but godliness is profitable unto all things, having promise of the life that now is, and of that which is to come. This [is] a faithful saying and worthy of all acceptation. For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is THE SAVIOUR OF ALL MEN, SPECIALLY [i.e. SPECIFICALLY] THOSE THAT BELIEVE.” (1Tim. 4:2-10 AV).
Notice the emphasised point in v. 10: I shall return to this later. I now return to Hebrews Chapter 6:

“But, beloved, we are persuaded better things of you, and things that accompany salvation, though we thus speak. For God is not unrighteous to forget your work and labour of love, which ye have shewed toward his name, in that ye have ministered to the saints, and do minister. And we desire that every one of you do shew the same diligence to the full assurance of hope unto the end: That ye be not slothful, but followers of them who through faith and patience inherit the promises. For when God made promise to Abraham, because he could swear by no greater, he sware by himself, saying, Surely blessing I will bless thee, and multiplying I will multiply thee. And so, after he [Abraham] had patiently endured, he obtained the promise. For men verily swear by the greater: and an oath for confirmation is to them an end of all strife. Wherein God, willing more abundantly to shew unto the heirs of promise the immutability of his counsel, confirmed it by an oath: that by two immutable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us: Which hope we have as an anchor of the soul, both sure and stedfast, and which entereth into that within the veil; Whither the forerunner is for us entered, even Jesus, made an high priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.” (Heb 6:9-20 AV).

Note in the first part of Heb. 6 (quoted in two separate sections above), the writer of Hebrews says it would be impossible, IF they shall fall away, to be saved. He gives examples of the things they would have tasted, and of the fact that they were ‘partakers of the Holy Ghost’, and ‘the powers of the world to come’; but he then says in verse 9 that ‘we are persuaded [of] better things of you’. Now we come to the crunch. Several verses in the Bible tell us, in various ways, that God will never leave us, nor forsake us, and that we are saved by what He did, not what we do (Rom. 3:24; 5:20; 6:14,15; 11:6; 1Cor. 3:11-20; Gal. 2:20, 21; Eph. 1:3; 1:7; 2:4-10; Tit. 3:7; 2Tim. 2:8-13; Heb. 13:5, etc.).
We now look again at 1 Tim. 4:10, and see that Jesus ‘is the Saviour of all men, specially [i.e. effectively] of those that believe.’ Perhaps now we can see what is being talked about when it talks of those who will lose their salvation: it is those who know, see, and understand the Gospel, even to the extent of seeing the work of the Holy Spirit and realising He is the one speaking into their hearts (thus making them partakers of the Holy Ghost), and who then wilfully disbelieve and reject what the Lord Jesus Christ did for them! Here too we see the efficacy of the shed blood of Jesus, which is sufficient to purchase the soul of every single human being ever to be conceived! Herein also we see that Jesus judges righteously, and saves ‘whosoever believeth on Him’ (Jn 3:16). It should be clear that, despite knowing what Jesus did, those who wilfully rejected it, never coming to the point of genuine acceptance of Christ’s forgiveness, and never being born again (Jn 3:3; 3:7; 1 Pet. 1:23), are those who ‘depart from the faith’.

THE SAVED ARE NEVER LOST

“And being made perfect, he [Jesus] became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;” (Heb 5:9 AV). (What do we do to obey Him?) “Then said they unto him, ‘What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?’ Jesus answered and said unto them, ‘This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.’” (Jn. 6:28-29 AV).

“Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.” (Jn. 14:27 AV).

“Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God. And we have known and believed the love that God hath to us. God is love; and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him. Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world. There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love.” (1Jn. 4:15-18 AV).

“Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:” (Php 1:6 AV).

“Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth WITH you, and shall be IN you.” (Jn. 14:17 AV)

“Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?” (Ro 8:35 AV)

“For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, nor height, nor depth, NOR ANY OTER CREATURE, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.” (Ro 8:38-39 AV)

“My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: And I give unto them eternal life; and THEY SHALL NEVER PERISH, NEITHER SHALL ANY MAN pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father’s hand. I and my Father are one.” (Jn. 10:27-30 AV)

“It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him: If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us: If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself. Of these things put them in remembrance, charging them before the Lord that they strive not about words to no profit, but to the subverting of the hearers.” (2Ti 2:11-14 AV).

In other words, the unsaved are dead IN sins (Eph. 2:5), whereas the saved are dead UNTO sin (‘dead with Him’ in the above quote: see also Rom. 6:2). Denying Him means to see, hear and experience the things of the Holy Spirit, but never accept Jesus as one’s personal Saviour.

THE LOST WERE NEVER SAVED
(i.e. never in a salvation relationship with Jesus)

“And then will I profess unto them, I NEVER KNEW YOU: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.” (Mt 7:23 AV)

“But he answered and said, Verily I say unto you, I KNOW you not.” (Mt 25:12 AV)

“When once the master of the house is risen up, and hath shut to the door, and ye begin to stand without, and to knock at the door, saying, Lord, Lord, open unto us; and he shall answer and say unto you, I KNOW you not whence ye are:” (Lu 13:25 AV)

“But he shall say, I tell you, I KNOW you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity.” (Lu 13:27 AV)

In the last three quotes, in English it can appear that Jesus does not recognize them, but possibly used to know them; in Greek, however, the tense of the word is ‘perfect’, which means unchanged and unchanging. It is therefore another way of saying, like Mt. 7:23, that Jesus had never had an intimate, personal relationship with them. He was a spurned suitor. They refused to be the bride of Christ (Rev. 21:9). Note that EVERY TIME Jesus rejected someone, He never said, “I USED to know you, but not anymore”: He ALWAYS said, in effect, “I NEVER knew you”.

2007-12-03 08:42:04 · answer #1 · answered by Already Saved 4 · 0 0

Christ died once and for all for all sins--once you accept and believe all the sins you have ever committed or ever will commit are coverd by His Blood. To think that you can lose your salvation limits His power to save you. It isn't possible for the power of your sin to be greater than His power to redeem. (And by the way, it's really a sin for you to even think so, because you are denying His power!)

You are saved FROM sin, not TO sin, so you are not to use this grace as an excuse to live however you want. You should feel guilty when you sin and be drawn again to repentance. You should be growing in Christ and striving not to fall back into the same sins over and over, yet you will struggle with sin as long as you are in your human corruptible body in this fallen sinful world. You will separate yourself from FELLOWSHIP with the Lord when you sin, and you may suffer the consequences or even judgment for sin in your life, but you cannot lose your salvation.

What Christians will be held accountable for at the bema seat are their actions and works after they were saved--these will be tested by fire to see what things were done with pure motives for the Lord and not for the praise of men or their own profit. Read this passage in Corinthians and see that even those who have no good works but only wood hay and stubble will still be saved "as if from fire". Though it would be a shame and a bitter disappointment to face Christ with no good works to show for your life, once you are truly saved you are sealed with the Spirit for eternity and nothing can pluck you from the Lord's hand.

Do a topical search for phrases like "eternal security of the believer" or "assurance of salvation" using a site such as biblegateway or crosswalk and see what other Scriptures and commentaries you can find to help you understand this doctrine. If your church teaches something different, I strongly encourage you to question it or find a church that is teaching the truth.

You will get different answers on this, so DON'T rely on what people on here tell you.

2007-11-30 01:01:44 · answer #2 · answered by arklatexrat 6 · 1 2

Is there a difference between stumbling into sin and diving into it? Yes.

There obviously is. The false convert doesn't care. The true convert ALWAYS EXAMINES HIMSELF!

For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast. Eph. 2:8-9

For God's gifts and his call are irrevocable. Rom. 11:29

Examine yourselves to see whether you are in the faith; test yourselves. Do you not realize that Christ Jesus is in you—unless, of course, you fail the test? 2 Cor. 13:5

False converts face this.

If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left, but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God. Heb. 10:26-27

2007-12-01 09:38:24 · answer #3 · answered by Anonymous · 1 1

Go to Romans 3:26-29. The Bible takes about you becoming child of God after salvation. Once you have salvation your are God's child. You will sin but sinning does not take away your salvation. If sin took away your salvation then salvation would impossible for people to have. I am a saved Child of God and he will never forsake me. When you sin ask for forgiveness and attempt to do better the next time.

2007-11-30 01:01:44 · answer #4 · answered by Tessa 5 · 3 2

No, what would be the reason of Jesus dieing for our sins? Once you accept the gift of salvation you do not lose it for a mere sin. What would be the point? If that was the case then there would be a 50/50 chance of going to hell. For example, the preacher at your church goes home one night after preaching. He has recently prayed to God and repented for his sins of that very day. Then a car hits him, as he is being hit, his mind fills with hate. He ends up dieing mere moments later. You cannot tell me God would be so incosiderate and send that man to hell for that sin. As long as you recieve Christ with the intention to do your very best to be a new person, you are saved for eternity.
______________________________________________

God knows what sins you have committed and what sins you will commit in the future. Therefore when you recieve christ for salvation, he is forgiving you of your sins of the past and sins to come.

2007-11-30 00:56:03 · answer #5 · answered by Jesse S 2 · 2 3

In many places in Scripture, it is plain that, while salvation cannot be forcibly taken from us, we can toss it aside. Christ's parable of the various seeds sown in different environments is a symbolic representation of this. More to the point, St. Paul would never have told us that we need to work out our salvation if it did not require *ongoing* active participation on our part.

That being said, do not despair. God is not some insane accountant. He is merciful. As St. Paul says, we will be judged according to our ability, not according to an absolute legalistic (Pharisaic) standard.

2007-11-30 00:54:21 · answer #6 · answered by Hoosier Daddy 5 · 0 3

I have heard that repeating sin is the same thing as putting Christ back o the cross.
And yet, it was he who told us that if someone wrongs us and repents repeatedly...........we must except his request for forgiveness each time asked.
God knows how weak we are, and look at how often his people while traveling through 40 years of travels sinned repeatedly and he took them back.

2007-11-30 01:05:35 · answer #7 · answered by Wisdom 6 · 0 2

Christ died once those who accept the atonement are by faith made new.
It is by faith we claim this promise we have not died and literally been made new.
We are still in this sinful world in our flesh.
Those who are changed are changed in their hearts.
We are not yet literally perfected but we will not serve sin.

I recommend Romans 6.

2007-11-30 00:59:14 · answer #8 · answered by djmantx 7 · 1 1

It is impossible to lose salvation (1 John 5).

2007-11-30 00:55:40 · answer #9 · answered by Anonymous · 4 2

You do not understand Grace then. you are still thinking in terms of works. Once you ae a chold of God, you can not be taken away. the question is whether you ever were saved.

2007-11-30 13:57:54 · answer #10 · answered by Anonymous · 2 0

According to Arminianism, the term "Eternal Security" is nowhere to found in Scripture. The word "eternal" and the word "security" both occur in Scripture, but never together. Therefore, the term "Eternal Security" is clearly unbiblical. Also, "Once Saved Always Saved" is not found in the Bible.

A quote from a Arminian; “The doctrine of eternal security completely destroys the distinction between right and wrong, and removes all motives to abstain from sin. It boasts in the perseverance of the saints, while it believes in no saint but one, that is, Jesus, and neglects to persevere.”

“Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession." Hebrews 4:14.

The warnings in Hebrews were written to encourage Christians to stay faithful under intense persecution. They were in imminent danger of apostasy from the faith. If a believer has nothing else to do about his salvation once it has been given to him, why then, does the writer of Hebrews continually stress holding on if there is no danger?

Here is Arminian website that claims to destroy the Eight Pillars of Eternal Security:
http://www.eternalsecurity.us/eight_pillars_of_eternal_securit.htm

2007-11-30 14:36:59 · answer #11 · answered by Steve 4 · 0 1

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