How can one possibly have free will....?

Question

if their God knows everything that will ever happen.

How can one change their destiny? If your God knows exactly what you will do your entire life is not your destiny preset?

Gumby first off thank you for your answer. I do not believe that your analogy quite fits this question. You may know what your Child is likely to do but you do not KNOW what they will do. This is not the case with the Christian/Jewish/Islamic God. He is supposed to know exactly what you will do even before you are born. He is supposed to be the Alpha and the Omega. He is also supposed to be the Creator of mankind. So if he knew before he ever created any person exactly what each person would do their entire life. That pretty much makes what we do his decision and not ours. Do you understand what I am saying?

Socks i think that R&S is a perfect place for such a question. Please read my addendum above for a more in depth explanation of my question. If you had created this fellow that you antagonize and knew before he was ever even born what would set him off then i would say yes.

Tuberoot i am truly sorry that you feel this way. I enjoy your answers on a lot of questions i see on here. Even if i do not agree with a lot of them.

Tuberoot, I also appreciate your honesty. I try not to let hatred be a part of my life. Once again i am sorry you chose to block me. Have a wonderful day/evening.

Answer 1

How ironic that you'd ask that question Phil. I just spent the last hour debating with someone on IM about the very same thing. I tried to lay out this hypothetical situation that God already knows I will reject him and asked if I had a hope to get into heaven. He couldn't grasp the concept of a hypothetical situation. He just kept saying "how do we know what god knows" and "it's a fools game" but wouldn't accept the fact that his reasoning was flawed. It was pretty frustrating.

Unbelievable! He used the same cookie analogy! Are these people subscribing to the same news letter or what?

By the way, do you get emails when I ask a question? None of mine have been posting so I get like one crappy answer to each. Check out my profile. I think I still have an open one if you want to take a stab at it. There'll be 10 points in it for you.... lol

Answer 2

It's funny how a difficult question like this evokes so many completely unrelated answers. 8^) It's as if you asked 'Tell me some random religious thought'.

It's a hard question to answer. Free will often seems to be only an illusion. I've always thought God -expected- Adam and Eve to eat the fruit. How could they do otherwise? How could all the rest of the stuff in the Bible have happened if A&E hadn't eaten the fruit? There would have been no more story to tell!

Christians believe that God lives in 'eternity'. Eternity doesn't just mean he lasts forever, it means he's not stuck in time like we are. We have to live one minute at a time and then go on to the next one. God can see all times at once. He can see your whole life in one view, or for that matter the whole history of mankind. If its all there, is it not all predetermined? Some theologians say yes, some say no, but none of them can explain their answers to my satisfaction.

Some Christians (like Calvinists) actually have a church doctrine about it, the doctrine of predestination. They believe that before God made the universe he picked who would be saved and who not. Does that mean that our lives are completely predestined, pre-planned? Well . . . . not exactly. It's complicated. 8^)

I think it's enough to realize that people are unpredictable. That we do have choices. If not we couldn't be held responsible for our actions! I'm not sure what-all goes into the choices I make in life, but I feel they are my choices.

Answer 3

Knowing what will happen does not mean I could be controlling a person. Like with Chavez in Venezuela, a fit to be tied Despot, developing as time goes into the typical despots desires. It's like he is learning how to be a despot as he goes. I don't control him. I haven't ever been to Venezuela. But I see what's going on there, it seems rather fitting for that person to gain more and more control over a country in despicable ways. He cannot be approving of freedom, it's against his nature and the way his brain works to allow people to say what they want about him. So the slaughter is in front of us, unless someone shoots him dead.

People are a kind of despot. They want everything their way, and will not follow after God, it's against their nature to give their will over to God. Even though God made us for His purposes, we reject the notion of His right on anything in our lives.

But God knows all of this, and makes it possible for SOME of us to go His way. We still have a choice, but He has a way of convincing us. He isn't after EVERYBODY, but only those who He wants. I could quote you scripture to show this, but you are not asking for it.

Also, I noticed that you are applying the AM title to your name. Even the Hit man part.

So that's why I will block you now, as I do with all Atheist Mafia. I figure it's a matter of time that those with the AM title to begin to exercise hatred. I didn't find your question so offensive, so I answered it.

See ya. I really don't want any points, I just don't want anything to do with the AM, and I thought I would tell you.

Answer 4

The larger problem with the typical apology (like that of Gumby, but originally attributed to Augustine) is that she did not create the child ANd know what it would do. If I create a robot knowing it will kill you, I am responsible for murder. An omniscient creator cannot avoid this charge, unless we remove all moral talk from applying to this creator, which would mean to me this being, even if it does exist, is not worthy of worship.

Answer 5

Each person has free will and may exercise it at every decision in his/her life. God knows everything that will happen, that is true. But everything he knows is based on the decisions each person makes. God is not forcing you to make any decision or setting your life in stone based on His decisions. He already knows every single decision you will make in your life and just because He knows that in advance does not mean He interferes with it.

Answer 6

If God knows what I will do before I do it and then allows me to make my choice....that is free will.

God doesn't see my choices and then manipulate things so it works out His way. He isn't like that. If He says you have a choice, you HAVE a choice!

I just wish you could meet my Jesus. He is so good, kind and strong. There is so much misunderstanding. God never wanted puppets, only people who could choose to love Him or choose something else.

Answer 7

Ooooh somebody's an athiest :P

I hypothetically know this guy at school who is so predictably reactionary. I can call him a name and without fail he will ALWAYS get mad and blow up at me. Does my knowledge of his response remove his choice from it?

Let's say he's seeing a shrink and has been taking anger management classes and actually took his prozac today, so he doesn't blow up. Does my knowledge of these additional facts influence his choice?

Seriously the free will topic's been beaten to death by philosophers and theists everywhere. Next time just do a web search. If you want an actualy discussion use a forum.

Answer 8

Although God knows everything, you still have a free will. By this i, you are the architect of your future ie the will to create ur own future. Look God Knows everything but put us in this world to contrl it and he gives us "free will" to do anything we want with it;begining of Genesis to the end. u should also remember he made us in his image and likeness in other words we are like God our knowledge is also high it our sins do not permits us to use to our fullest ability.

Answer 9

Since he decides what he will not control, why do you count it against him?

Reply: If he knows what will occur because he knows who will choose him, there still exists a choice by those that do choose. His knowledge doesn't change that, so I fail to see your point. You seem to to be confusing omnipotence with omniscience. In addition, God is the beginning and the end, meaning his knowledge is based off of the whole timeline.

Answer 10

Doesn't make much sense does it!? For example,if God knew,already what was to become of the fallen angels,than why did he make them in the first place!God sounds like just a man!...