You don’t have to go home, but you can’t stay here ?

Question

The Associated Press recently reported on a growing problem facing the Department Homeland Security, i.e. where to send all those people who have been ordered removed from the United States:


“China is refusing to take back an estimated 39,000 citizens who have been denied immigration to the United States and have clogged detention centers at federal expense, Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff said yesterday…. Currently, 687 Chinese are being held in federal detention facilities, at a daily rate of $95 each, while some 38,000 have been released on bond or under a monitoring program, such as wearing an electronic surveillance bracelet, the Homeland Security Department said later yesterday. Illegal immigrants can be held for 180 days before they are released.
Chertoff also said Homeland Security would open detention facilities in the next few weeks to house entire families of illegal immigrants who hope to bring their children along in order to avoid jail time. “It’ll be humane, but we’re not going to let people get away with this,” he said.
Chertoff’s remarks come as the Homeland Security Department aims to end its “catch and release” immigration policy by Oct. 1. After that date, all illegal immigrants will be held in U.S. detention centers until they can be returned to their nation of citizenry.”

This is old news yet still going on --what do you think?

The Department of Homeland Security has taken the stance that it’s better to spend $95 per person per day ($34,675 per year) than to grant employment authorization to these people which would allow them to work and pay taxes, and that doesn’t even include the costs of building new facilities. So essentially, given the choice between making money, and loosing money, the government of the United States has decided to stand on principle and loose hundreds of millions of dollars a year.
To be fair though, the other side of this argument makes sense too: the people in detention have violated United States laws just as the people in regular jails have violated laws. Should all prisoners be released so that we don’t have to pay for them? Of course, it is not fair to compare immigration violators to rapists, murders and the sort, but the analogy still holds true for a lot of people.
Your turn

Answer 1

Yes, deporting people is more than having the US decide to send them home, the home country has to participate in taking them back. Since there are substantial numbers of ethnic Chinese living across the world, the PRC won't take someone merely because they are ethnic Chinese, we have to prove they are a citizen of the PRC first, which is hard to do if they are undocumented and unwilling to cooperate. Same thing with India, by the way.

Other countries put limitations on the numbers of deportees they are willing to take in any given month, like the countries in Latin America. That slows things down considerably for places like El Salvador, which has close to a third of its population in the US. For many countries, the money sent home to family by immigrants here, both legal and illegal is a large amount of its entire income. So, they aren't especially eager to see them all returned. We established temporary protected status, TPS, for El Salvador and other Central American countries during the various wars there in the 80s. Those ended long ago, but TPS lives on as those governments didn't know how they would take in so many citizens and how their economy would survive.

When you're talking about millions of illegal aliens in the US, the logistics of sending them back is extremely complicated, and expensive. DHS supposedly ended its "catch and release" program 2 summers ago, under the Secure Border Initiative, for everyone except Mexicans. The acronym they like to use is OTM, or other than Mexicans. In reality, everything you're talking about here is old news being recycled.

Answer 2

China has been agreeing to take more because the US has been making noise about restricting visas.

However, China is a bad situation, no question. We need to actually not give visas until they agree to take those who shouldn't be here back. It isn't that I don't think Chinese should get visas, generally, but China likes as many as possible here sending money and that is the only way I see to solve this.

I don't really think China cares if the people are in detention or not, since they know that situation can't go on indefinitely. At least here. (There, possibly it could go on indefinitely.)

Why, what are your thoughts?

Answer 3

This is a problem faced by so many countries, each deals with it differently.
In Germany illegal immigrants are first warned and told to leave the country on their own free will. If they don´t, after a while they are scooped up by the police (often at 3:00am, from their beds) and sent on the next plane back to their homelands. In some cases these people (esp. political refugees) are arrested immediately upon arrival, imprisoned and possibly executed (this being the threat to have made them leave their country in the first place).

It is easy to look at "illegal immigrants" and claim they are trying to milk the system. Indeed, there are an odd few who come over and have "nothing to lose", and try to cheat their way through. For the vast, vast majority however, this is not the case. It takes a great deal of hardship and determination for a family (or even the parents) to leave everything they know and start from fresh somewhere else. This is a difficult decision to make, and they are only doing it if they think they will really be able to improve the lives of their children. If they had been able to make ends meet at home, they would have done it already, so once they make it to the "new" country, they are anxious to stay there and make it work, even if the initial decision was a "no".
These are people like you and me, but have the disadvantage of being born in conditions which make their lives very hard. It is natural and fair for them to try to improve their lives, even if it means immigrating.

I can hardly call keeping these families in a jail humane, nor the ideal of giving them electronic bracelets (sounds like a science fiction film). Nor do I think it is right to "open the gates and let them all in". A solution? Anyone who has been denied due to criminal offenses (crime, NOT for political reasons/ demonstrations etc) can be flown back without a bad concience. The others might be given a year or two to get their lives "in order", meaning find jobs, learn language etc. They are given temporary work permits, and their children may attend schools. Yes, this requires providing housing for a while, but other social benefits could be limited. If after this period they aren´t settled, or if they commit crimes during this period, then they may be flown back as well. I´m not familiar with the US immigration process in these cases, but I find this to be at least fairer than what goes on in most European countries.
One should not forget that people who are willing to go through such a struggle to make it to the "host" country in the first place, are more determined to work hard and contribute to their community than the average "Joe" on the street. This benefits not only the economy but the culture around them.

Answer 4

Paying off our debt to China here we come!! If China refuses to take them back, then let's bill China all the money it costs to keep them in detention. When our debt is paid off to China, then keep billing China while these felons remain behind bars indefinitely. Perhaps we'll come out ahead in China's game after all.

America really needs to grow some, and bill every country that their illegals have come from to cover the costs. And I mean EVERY country those illegals come from.

Host country!! We're only the host country if they come legally. NOT illegally!!

Answer 5

Send them to China anyway. Drop em all off and let China deal with them. In addition, charge China for the costs of detaining them in the first place. Our goodwill should not result in our nation being the dumping ground for the worlds unwanted.

Answer 6

wow... quite a dilemma...
I guess we can't go around touting that we are the "leaders of the free world" without taking on some extra baggage.
Who knew?

Answer 7

Deport them back anyway. Their country will have to take them in.

Answer 8

i say hold them until they die. this way it will discourage people from coming here illegally. when this gets out, they (illegals) will eventually stop coming. if any children are born while they are detained do not give citizen ship to the baby's.

Answer 9

let em stay damn it america aint what its all cracked up to be