Is faith beyond reason in Christianity?

Question

I'm focusing on Christianity mainly because it is my faith...

In my studying of the bible, prayer, and just experience in general I've come to the conclusion that without faith belief based on an old book with stories written over a period of a few thousand years just won't come.

There are no works by verifiable witnesses who saw Jesus with their own eyes. Jesus didn't write anything himself that is verifiable. Theology and doctrine are open to interpretation. Judaism rejects Jesus as the Messiah.

Paul never seen Jesus and was converted by a "vision."

The Torah is not without its problems.

Some scholars claim Yahweh was a Volcano god.

Some believe Judaism evolved from other, older, regional religions.

The events in the bible are not always scientific fact.

Any evidence is based on the belief of the faithful to view it as evidence such as answered prayers etc.

God is not visible. God is not audible. He cannot be sensed by our physical senses.

So without faith it is probably impossible to reasonably believe...

Agree or disagree?

AtC - It is understood by scholars that the synoptic gospels were written by scribes and not the direct disciples of Christ.

In either case it is debatable.

The point is faith cannot be tied with actual evidence, otherwise it becomes fact and it is no longer faith.

AtC - Also one other thing, by faith I believe the principles in the bible are true. I may not take the book as some scientific fact of anything, but spiritually I understand it.

Answer 1

Keep on questioning faith. You seem as if you're on the doorstep to enlightenment.

Answer 2

faith, necessarily, goes beyond reason, although reason is used as a tool to explain faith.
yes. faith is essential in accepting what the bible teaches because the bible is not only history, poetry or chronology. the bible is God's self revelation to a people he has chosen for himself. because of this, it would be nonsensical to put the bible under the scrutiny of human historical-critical methods.
yes, there were eyewitnesses who wrote about Jesus. matthew, john, paul (that was his vision -- he saw Jesus), peter.
the problems that seem to come from the torah may actually be the "emendations" of the jewish scholars.
yes, some scholars will say that. but then again, other scholars would not say that yahweh was a volcano god.
yes, all right, some believe there are religions older than judaism, and some believe that judaism is a derived religion. again, other scholars may not agree.
true. but the bible never claims to be scientific fact, or a source of scientific fact.
well, if the desire of faith is to obtain evidence, then it is not faith. faith, according to hebrews, is the exidence of things not seen, the assurance of things hoped for.
yes. that's what the romans thought too. they thought it strange that people would worship and bow down to a god which could not be seen, unlike their gods, which were visible (there were statues of the different roman gods and goddesses on virtually every corner of pagan rome). because of this, the romans considered the christians to be not only strange, but crazy as well. this is one of the reasons why christians during that particular period were persecuted. but i seem to remember someone saying: simply because the sun does not shine does not mean it is not there.
um, no, fatima. that is not what he is saying.

Answer 3

Dear Friend, Faith is a supernatural Gift from God which can take you beyond Reason;( a Human Faculty) into the area of appreciating Mysteries of Faith., Reason is related to Intelligence and Understanding.( just as Faith can be) Ftih does not need Human Reason but can be aided by It. However, both Reason and Faith can also work together. Reason can work alone-without- Faith and Faith can work alone without Reason. St. Augustine, once said; "Faith is always Reasonable.

Answer 4

Well, I have to say I pretty much disagree.

I entirely disagree with your statement that "there are no works by verifiable witnesses who saw Jesus with their own eyes." How about the Gospels? They were written by Jesus' own disciples, who indeed saw Him with their own eyes. And theology and doctrine aren't really open to interpretation - there are many, many things that God states to be black and white, and there are many other things in the Bible that reveal themselves to be black and white with further study. Also, Paul wasn't converted by a "vision" - Jesus Himself appeared to Paul and spoke with him, and Paul was saved by putting his faith in Jesus Christ same as we are. The Bible seems to indicate that Paul went out into Arabia and was taught by Christ Himself....Paul might just have met Jesus. The Jews rejected their Messiah, but that does not mean that Jesus wasn't really the Messiah - He just didn't live up to their extrabiblical expectations of what and who Messiah should be! But He was their Messiah, He said so Himself.The scholars who claim that Yahweh was a volcano god are full of crap, I'm afraid, as are those who think that Judaism evolved from other religions. Read your Bible - look at God's calling of Abraham. God called him out of the land of his fathers, to a new way of life. As for the events not being scientific fact - name a few! Many people like to say that the Bible says the earth is flat, etc etc blah blah blah. Not true. There were some things that were miraculous - like the day where they sun stood still. Did you know that there are other ancient cultures who recorded n extra-long day one time way back in the day? It happened.

I think the problem is that you seem to have many doubts about the Bible. Correct me if I'm wrong, please!! But this seems to come up in many of your posts. If you believe your Bible is full of errors, if you don't believe that God preserved it, and if you don't believe in it's authenticity, then of course you are going to have problems with your faith. How can you have faith when you don't really believe? It sounds like the skeptics have gotten to you, friend. Don't listen to that stuff - it is not true.

Answer 5

I believe in the spiritual because of my experiences - as to the existence of god, I am basically an agnostic, however, I do not believe the Creator, if there is one, would be anything like the Judeo-Christian tradition.

I don't feel I have faith in the sense of believing in something I have never experienced - I know there is something beyond the physical world, it's just the nature of that beyond that I can not at this point fully comprehend.

Answer 6

Faith is a belief in, and a surrender to the one who created all things. It is a belief that a sinless being was sacrificed for the sins of everyone for all time. All you have to do is to accept it.

You cover so many things it cannot be responded to without a book, but I will address one thing.

You say that Paul never saw (seen by your words) Jesus and was converted by a vision. I have never seen a vision that effected your eyesight until someone could lay hands on you and cause the sight to return. What happened to Paul was physical, and it blinded him, he fell to the ground, and had to be led to Damascus by the men that were accompanying him. He was going there to arrest those who believed in Jesus, and Jesus met him on the road there.

As to Judaism, I believe God appeared to Abraham, and spoke to him, and told him to leave the house of his father and go to a land he had never been to in his life. I believe he was told to leave his father's house because his father was an artisan, an idol maker.

You spoke of reason, that is man's reasoning, and when you speak of some scholars, that also is man's reasoning.

More and more of the events in the Bible have been proven by archeology to have happened.

grace2u

Answer 7

I think you nailed it. Faith is a grace from God that allows us to know and love Him. I see non-believers read the bible all the time from an academic stance and come away with nothing because they're treating it like a science book and not a book of faith.

It takes faith.

Answer 8

I have faith in God more than any book that was written over 1000 years ago. It is not mandatory to believe everything that is written. Faith doesn't make it a divine truth. Most religions have evolved from other ones to make them more "user friendly". All religions are open to interpretation and this makes some beyond reason. Agree, it is hard to believe in something unseen without faith.

Answer 9

Faith is because of reasoning, reasoning on the scriptures, Gaining accurate knowledge, acting on the knowledge gained.
For example reason on these words :Mathew 5:5 Ask yourself why Jesus said this? Then see if it was because that he knew his father promised this at Psalms37:9-11,29. Faith is only gained by taking in knowledge, Jesus had faith that his father would do what he promised. This promise will shortly take place so make sure that you are not one of the ones who gets cut off.

Answer 10

God is audible and He can be sensed by our physical senses.

The events in the Bible are fact.

There are twelve witnesses who walked and lived with Jesus.
Over 500 people saw Jesus after the crucifixion.
Matthew, Mark, Luke and John wrote the gospels of Jesus.

Answer 11

Faith and reason are conflicting. One cannot use reason to analyze faith because faith is incapable of standing up to reason. Once you look at what faith represents, either you realize faith doesn't work or you console yourself to believing in something because you want to, not because it makes any sense.

Most people simply do that without thinking, and in fact, probably don't even want to think about it.