Why can't atheists see that w/out God we wouldn't have a reference point to morality?

Question

Evolution didn't give us morality or ethics. If we keep evolving, wouldn't our current moral standards become something else? Is it too much to postulate that there might be something more to morality than merely a product of evolution through natural selection over millions of years?

Answer 1

Probably because we have already proven that false.

Our morality has been evolving anyway (but you don't understand evolution if you'd ask such a question) since whilst the Bible (which contains your alleged perfect moral code) approved of slavery we've stopped that, we've also come along way on equal rights too.

"Is it too much to postulate that there might be something more to morality than merely a product of evolution through natural selection over millions of years?"
Postulate it all you want but that won't make it true.

Natural selection states that we are descended from those who reproduced and that they did so because they were better adapted to the environment they were in. It just so happened that the environment our ancestors were in was conductive to groups of people working together but for groups to work together a moral code is needed.

Thus we evolved one.

Your moral relativism (and that is what Divine Command Theory is) just doesn't have a place in the modern world.

Answer 2

Morals are linked to society and societies are caused by groups of people. True societies often invent imaginary things to support their ideas, but now we are moving forward and beyond the need for such things.

Also, I'm sure you are aware of the good response argument to what you say - why are morals so great if they come from god? Surely it is better for people to have morals for their own sake and for the sake of others etc. instead of relying on an imaginary punishment/reward system.

And I don't know what you mean by "evolution didn't give us morality or ethics" - what did? We evolved. Thus that's where it all came from.

Answer 3

Morality stems from being social animals. If we evolve into a less social creature--or an entirely unsocial creature, our morals will probably not exist to the extent that they do now. If we become more interdependent, then our morals will improve with evolution. Just think of Kant's maxim. Yes do unto others what you would have others do unto you, but also bear in mind what the world would be like if everyone did that. If everyone stole, we would have no basis for economy or community. If everyone murdered, we'd all be in hiding--these axioms alone prove that morality exists apart, separate from God. In fact, I would argue that blind obedience to a God figure can create more immorality than morality. Blind obedience to a god creates a circumstance wherein people are no longer accountable for their actions, and thus capable of doing any number of terrible things as they are ordered by the medium between themselves, and God.

Answer 4

Technically speaking, I'm an Agnostic Evolutionist, and these are just MY OWN BELIEFS/THEORIES...

1) If by "morality", you're meaning the basics of "right" and "wrong", the Christian God has nothing to do with it.

2) Evolution -- and "Mother Nature" (whoever/whatever created the universe and everyone and everything in it) -- DID give us morality and ethics over time ("millions of years", as you put it).

3) Nature demands a balance to EVERYTHING. Where there is life, there is "death"; where there is light, there is darkness; where there is love, there is hatred; where there is peace, there is violence; where there is heat, there is cold; where there are predators, there is prey; where there is good, there is evil; and where there is right, there is wrong. That perpetual balance to all things is what holds the universe steady; keeps it on an "even keel", so to speak.

Over time, as we slowly evolved from simians to humanoids and to humans, we began learning for ourselves -- mostly through trial-and-error; but we learned and created. The ability to make a fire, the first weapon, the first bowl, etc. We likewise started gradually learning (and consciously recognizing) differences for ourselves: hot from cold, light from dark, peace from violence...and eventually, right from wrong. I don't think ANY deity had anything to do with it -- Christian or otherwise.

Answer 5

I guess you still want slavery huh cause the bible nor your god didn't seem to mind human owning another as privative property... There is this stoning one to death, hacking and pulling out eyes out of sockets when your body causes you to sin.

Yeah lets all get our morals from old and new testament and this deity that seems to do nothing and gets the glory.. Oh brother, I will defiantly have to pass on the offer. As I recall god couldn't careless if you we were kind to one another help out humanity we would still go to hell for not worshiping and believing in him... How come christians do not want slavery anymore? I mean "Live the life of christ" and "live a true christian life" is spewed.


The atheists and whole calling of crying of "oh god" oh god nooooooo" when under sickness and other unfortunate luck, is a first or second grade kind of thinking and no one is calling your god it is an expression (which should be noted not all atheists use) to many that does not mean the same as what christians are thinking and believe by any means calling upon any imaginary deity that seems to be good for nothing since he allows even his most die hard follower to die even though they give him so much praise and read the bible.

Answer 6

It is the functioning of our brain and its mechanics that give us the ability to determine right from wrong...not God, and it is through evolution that we have come to possess the brains we have. Not only that but it is our society and culture that determine what is considered to be ethical. 100 years ago it would be considered improper for a woman to be seen wearing pants but the passing of years and the development of society have changed that. This means that as our society continues to evolve as it inevitably will than yes, the moral standards that accompany human interactions will also change

Answer 7

Wouldn't our current moral standards become something else? that is a funny question..what has happened in the past 2000 years?... or even the past 200? Or morals and ethics constantly change and are evolving. If i have to give you examples..You are not worth speaking to.

Answer 8

You think that God gives you a reference point?

What the heck? Show me the group that really is God-guided, and perhaps I'll believe you.

Furthermore, Newton's laws of motion didn't give us morality or ethics. It does not affect the truth of them.

And yes, it is too much to postulate that there might be something more because you do not yet have evidence against the null hypothesis, which is the first step.

Answer 9

Can't Christians see that without God, we still have our own personal morality using the morality of others around us to form a frame of reference? I mean, we form societal standards for this sort of thing...

Also, morality is pretty much unrelated to evolution. In fact the most evolutionary traits are often immoral- if we only went by evolution, we'd kill every mentally retarded person and old person we saw for slowing down the pack.

Answer 10

You speak of morality like it's a good thing. Some might view morality as a disease, which interferes with nature. In the original sin story, I couldn't help but notice that is was the serpent who made adom feel ashamed of his penis, not god. If this was true, does that not mean that, morality is the work of the devil?