Why do some pagans say a prayer is like a spell?

Question

A prayer is asking Gods to intervene in your life, personally communicating with Gods regarding things you cannot achieve yourself. A prayer can be for help, guidance, protection, intercession, thanks etc. However the point is that a prayer is relying on the power of Gods to affect and make changes in your life.

A spell is a set of words, incantation or formula with magical potency. A spell is using the magical power possessed within the wizard or witch to bring about the change or desired effect. Magic comes from within so there is no need to appeal to Gods in order to practice magic; cast spells.

I myself am religious, I know that there is not a spell for everything and sometimes must rely on The Gods to provide, however that does not mean that all wizards are religious. Prayers are religious and spells are magical. The only similarity I see is that prayers & spells can be used for varying reasons.

Why then are they seen as being similar when there are clear differences?

Sometimes spells are not appropriate as the object is too indistinct or unspecific and a spell would be ineffective. Also, being specific and knowing when a spell is appropriate is key. If your wish is not clear or specific enough then your spell may not work properly or may not work at all. It is in cases such as these that I would pray or use other magical means. However prayers are separate to spells they do not work in the same way.

Jolly Roger; when casting a spell one is using the power within them it is not supernatural. As people are born magical so it is natural to them though not to all. Also when using magic you do not "invoke." Invoking is calling upon praying to a Deity, that is not what I do in magic.

kat; I am not referring to pagans when I say wizards. Wizard is the generally term for magical people as well as referring to male magicians specifically. Your connotations of the word aside. I addressed the question to pagans however magic is practiced by wizards and witches who can be pagan, heathen etc. It is clear that I was not saying that all pagans are wizards. I am aware that magic and religion do not go hand in hand.

Elliot; supernatural is not a magical term and do not consider the "results" of either spells or prayers as such. However, magic is not supernatural to wizards & witches it is natural.

kat; I would not disrespect The Gods & pray to Them whilst doing those activities, also the point is that one would not pray when one is distracted in such ways. The intention of the spell is my point. Sometimes intentions are simply not specific or distinct enough for them to work. However "focusing and channeling your soul is not necessary in magic. Of course one must conentrate in order to perform a spell effectively but it is not the same as the way you focus for a prayer. You honour The Gods in prayers it is not the same for spells. As there is no need for interaction with Gods in spells. Also, a spell is not invoking, as invoking is calling upon or praying to Deities. One uses their power when casting a spell they do not invoke it. They are different practices for different purposes.

Inviting a God to be present does not make it a prayer. It just clearly shows that people do not know the difference and this where the misinformation comes from because people believe that you invoke powers when casting a spell. This is not the case. Invoking is calling upon Deities or spirits for help or inspiration, this is NOT a necessity in magic. Magic is not invoked it comes from within the wizard or witch. The practices of a few religious wizards or witches does not change the nature of a spell. What some do not realise is that they know not what a spell is and when in truth they are praying they think it is a spell.

Answer 1

It's an attempt to say that "hey, we're not so different! We're just like you, only with different window dressing." Which is sad on a number of levels. One, we shouldn't need to prove such a thing.

Two, Pagans also generally pray, so why not just point out that both groups pray? That seems a more obvious similarity, if you're needing one.

And three, regardless of the differences or similarities between religions, spells and prayers are NOT one of the similarities. You're absolutely right on the differences. Prayers are requests. Spells are commands. And if you confuse the two please don't ask why your spells aren't working! You don't request the universe to do your will, and I wouldn't recommend commanding a god to do something!

Answer 2

could you say a prayer is for a positive results and a spell is for a negative?
would a curse be considered a spell?
If a pagan can cast a spell, can a Christian put a curse on something?
If a person didn't have a language would spells and curses and prayers still work?
If the eyes were blindfolded would a wegee board still work?
If a person doesn't believe in spells and curses will they still work?
Which is best an illusion or magic?

The only place I know that spells really work would be on the games like Dungeons and Dragons that people play

You obviously feel you know a great deal about this subject, which is created by words. Religion is created by words. Mormons, Christians, Muslims, various Eastern Religions are all created by words. The impact it has on a person is the personal belief of the consequences of the words,chants , songs, and incantations on and on ad nauseum

Answer 3

Well, speaking as someone who was raised Christian but has been studying and practicing an eclectic pagan path for over a decade...

Although some pagans will only acknowledge internal power that is used to work spells, or natural non-deistic energies of the earth used to augment that internal power, most pagans acknowledge a God-form. And, to add to that point, most pagans I know believe in ONE unified divine being that has MANY different faces. (We know that the real "face" of the divine would be inconceivable by the human mind, so for our brains to comprehend it and work with it, the various "faces" and names used are only different facets of the infinite.)

Anyway... most pagans, when invoking a spell, KNOW that their internal power is a gift from the divine, and that there is nothing that can be accomplished without that blessing. Many pagans also acknowledge that the ability to work a spell is dependent on how much authority they have been granted over the natural forces of the world. They can gain authority and influence over those forces by careful practice, devotion, good deeds, and prayer.

Many spells are literally nothing more than ritualized prayer. Is prayer in other religions a simple recitation of a poem or a chant, or do you have to put EFFORT and MEANING into it? Don't you have to really have intent for it to work? Light a candle to send positive energy and a wish for a speedy recovery for a loved one who is ill, and ask the divine forces to grant your request... it's just like saying a prayer and lighting a candle in church or at a vigil.

So, yes, while some pagans rely completely on "internal power" for their spells, most do not. Most pagans that I've ever met invoke external energies through the blessings of the divine.

Take me, for example...

I took some dirt from the sacred grounds of Fenway Park. (I picked it up from the warning track a couple of years ago when fans were allowed onto the actual playing field one day.) I placed it in an inverted seashell in the center of my altar, and placed a small diamond in the middle of it, and sent out my own energies and my request for a little bit of "luck". I believe we won the World Series this year.

Now, did my spell make that happen? Probably not... but I'm sure a lot of support from a LOT of fans all added up to make some very positive vibes.

Blessed Be, and Play Ball!

Answer 4

Some Pagans worship other deities. When they do their spells, some do pray to whatever god they choose.

Please stop calling pagans wizards. I expect an old guy with a big magical hat shooting lightning bolts from his eyes and hands when I hear wizards. Thought it would be cool, pagans can't do that.

"Sometimes spells are not appropriate as the object is too indistinct or unspecific and a spell would be ineffective."
Now if you prayed to God while chatting on the phone or hitting on a guy, would God listen? You must focus and channel your soul to him.

I agree with everyone else. With prayer you are invoking an exterior power to help you. With spells, you are invoking exterior and interior powers to help you. They are different bu similar paths to accomplish the same thing!

Answer 5

I'm non-thesitic.

I never compare magic to prayer. I find them to be irreconcilable. Prayer is asking an external force to intervene. (Which I find to be pointless.) Magic is looking internally and seeking what you need to change; it is self-empowering and not at all supernatural.

However, some Pagans see magic as a connection with the gods and nothing more than formalized prayer. Obviously this doesn't work for me, as I see the gods as archetypal.

Answer 6

I am with yu part of the way.

Spells are different from prayers.

By my estimation, they are both 'magic'. The difference is one of responsibility.

In a prayer, you are asking for divine help and it is up to them (therefore, divinity's responsibility) to control the outcome.

In a spell, it is YOU that are responsible for the outcome.

One is passive, the other active.

Answer 7

Great ! ur visualisation , your observations are great !

I agree with u in a lot of aspects.

Spell is usaually used for EVIL intentions
Blessing is DIVINE

Pls see
http://audio-albums-to-solve-all-problems.blogspot.com/

Here Power of words and prayers are used for healing various problems
if u or any of ur friends have any problems
u can get them solved
by divine interventions as wel as by POWER OF WORD ...

Hypnotheraphy ...
bestwishes

Answer 8

You can come up with all the semantic differences you like, but they both involve using words to achieve supernatural effects. Obviously there's a similarity.

It's supernatural because it involves (supposedly) doing things that are impossible according to physical laws.

Answer 9

Many invoke/invite the gods into thier magic work for help and inspiration. Sounds like a prayer to me.

Answer 10

Regardless of the "format" i.e. asking for intervention or doing a ritual, you are still invoking a supernatural, metaphysical, or magical source. The only major difference if in one case the power is sentient and can decide to act and the other the power is manipulated. Either way, there is no evidence that any such "powers" exist.