Is Calvinist soteriology really what the Bible teaches?

Question

Here is what I think:

Truly the five points of Calvinism are the doctrines of men. To support these points Biblically one must use eisegesis, ignoring vast amounts of Scripture contrary to its teaching. TULIP destroys the consistency of Scripture and creates contradictions that the Scriptures do not indicate. For every point of Tulip there are Scriptures that contradict this teaching and it ..........http://blog.360.yahoo.com/blog-S6YMuFYyaa9ESBoW5DFwEjL_HhqA

St. Preachy,

Thanks, I guess it is time for a Bible check.....everybody check their Bibles to see if John 6 is there. Thanks for the heads up, I hate it when those chapters disappear but I still have mine. You might want to check and see if you have John Chapter three in your Bible where Jesus says we must continue to believe. Also check for the following:

Mat 24:13
Mat 24:48-51
1Cor 9:27
Luk 8:13
1Cor 15:2
Heb 9:28

Answer 1

Even though Calvinist theology valiantly tries to uphold the sovereignty of god,it does so by sacrificing the all-goodness,all-mercy ,all-wisdom,all-love and all-justice of God and that 5 Point Dortrecht view of divinity is impossible to make compatible with God as revealed in Christ Jesus ,especially as Jesus teaches in the 4 Gospels.

With limited atonement,
eternal double predestination/determinism,
lack of real free will in rational creatures and its irresitable 'grace'
and damnation to Heaven or Hell by the OSAS caprice of the Dort concept of the divine,
there really is no much of soter or savior to its soteriology

I have never found TULIP theology and anthropology Good News in any sense or a hopeful message to the "massa damnata" , the "damned mass" of almost all the human race according to their viewpoint.

Why would anyone love, trust or expect mercy from such a peevish,sadistic and ruthless concept of god? I could never fathom the attraction or the biblical or common sense logic of TULIP.

Many passages ,especially from the Old Testament ,are strung together by Calvinist preachers and apologists but they seem to miss the Universal Saving Call that shouts strongly throughout the New Testament especially.

Answer 2

Did someone take John chapter 6 out of your bible?

Edit: Hey wait a minute! Aren't the "bible fundies" the ones who are supposed to engage in the atrocious act we call verse slinging? Why don't you start by explaining to the world why John 6:37-46 doesn't teach effectual calling (that would be the same as I in T.U.L.I.P) and unconditional election. Then we can harmonize that with your verses. That is called systematic theology and it is how you arrive at a solid understanding of what the bible teaches, but I am sure you knew that. So why don't statements like"no one can come to me UNLESS the father DRAWS him",and "all that the father gives me WILL come to me" teach this doctrine? Read the whole thing in context and you will find that this conclusion is quite inescapable. I know, because I did not want to believe it, but I could not get around it so I submitted to God.

Answer 3

Let's see -- which of these is spelled out in the Bible?

Total depravity -- Not this one.
Unconditional election -- Nope.
Limited atonement -- Uh-uh.
Irresistable grace -- don't see it.
Perseverence of the saints/eternal security -- No, not there either.

So the above doctrines are matters of one individual's interpretation ratified by a Dutch Reformed synod. Which makes them -- man-made, does it not?

Interesting how "where is XYZ in the Bible?" is a legitimate question from the other side of the Tiber River ... and "man-made" often the accompanying accusation ... but a much different thing when coming from the other direction.

Answer 4

Like with any teacing man has came up with, It has points of truth, and points of untruth.
T= total depravity of man; this point is deffinitly true, for ALL have sinned and come short of the Glory of God.

U= Unconditional election; this is also of a truth. Jesus died for ALL men, whether they trust him is another matter.

L= Limited atonement; FALSE ALSE FALSE, this came about by thinking that in God's infinite wisdom he knew ahead of time who would come so those are the ones he died for and the rest were left with sins against them. However John 3:16 states that God SO LOVED(that so is VERY important)the world that he gave his only begotten son, that WHOSOEVER beliveth in him should not perish but have everlasting life. whosoever means just that, whosoever(any and all)

I= irresistable grace; Again false, There are people everyday who refuse grace, turn away from the Lord and KNOW they are lost.

P= perserverance of the saints; As I understand it, is eternal security, That is true! If a person has truely acceptd Jesus Christ as saviour, even though they backslide, thru God's guidence they will return to him. This I know from experience. For those who think you can loose your salvation, study out Heb 6:4-6 to its extent, you cant believe that passage and say you loose your salvation.

Answer 5

I agree , that Calvinistic Predestination is a man made doctrine. I try to keep my soteriology as totaly void of eisegesis as possible.

Answer 6

I disagree with Calvinism on the first 4 points. I think he's right on the 5th one. For a comparison of soteriology viewpoints see:

http://www.bcbsr.com/topics/fgospel.html

Answer 7

Depravity- Romans 3:10
As it is written: “ There is none righteous, no, not one;

Limited atonement-John 10:15
As the Father knows Me, even so I know the Father; and I lay down My life for the sheep.

Irresistible grace-John 6:39
This is the will of the Father who sent Me, that of all He has given Me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up at the last day.

perseverance- Philippians 1:6
being confident of this very thing, that He who has begun a good work in you will complete it until the day of Jesus Christ;

election
Eph 1: Blessed [is] the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who did bless us in every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places in Christ,

according as He did choose us in him before the foundation of the world, for our being holy and unblemished before Him, in love,

having foreordained us to the adoption of sons through Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will,

Answer 8

sorry for intruding cant answer this question...but wud really love your advice on my last question.....been waiting for you to reply to my email but i guess you havent spotted it yet....pls email or answer in public...thanx much