Environmentalists / Prius fans... please read this article and tell me what you think? It was very surprising

Question

http://clubs.ccsu.edu/recorder/editorial/print_item.asp?NewsID=188

It's an article from a university, so fear not - it's totally safe.

Don't get me wrong... I totally DESPISE hummers! To me, they look like 'redneck parade floats.' I was just surprised at the Prius information.

I'm also HIGHLY skeptical that a Hummer will go 300k miles. Maybe 150 if you're lucky.

btw - it's not me giving everyone thumbs down. I'm not even second level yet, so I can't rate answers anyway.

Answer 1

This is actually just a reprint of a very old article, based on a study done by a marketing company.

Not surprisingly, a marketing company failed miserably at its attempt at doing a scientific study. It made some absolutely ridiculous and wrong assumptions, and thus came up with the ridiculously wrong conclusion - not that the Prius does more environmental damage, as this article claims - but that it consumes more energy over its lifetime than a Hummer.

The best debunking I've seen of this study is here:

http://www.pacinst.org/topics/integrity_of_science/case_studies/hummer_vs_prius.pdf

Though you can find many others with an internet search.

In reality a real scientific study concluded that the Prius is the greenest car on the planet:

http://www.reuters.com/article/environmentNews/idUSL2733658020070727?feedType=RSS

In addition to the Dust to Dust study, the article raises 2 other myths. The first is the new mileage estimate.

"This has dropped the Prius’s EPA down by 25 percent to an average of 45mpg. This now puts the Toyota within spitting distance of cars like the Chevy Aveo"

First of all, a drop from 55 mpg to 45 mpg is not 25%, it's about 20%. Secondly, in reality a Prius gets about 50 mpg. If you're only getting 45 mpg in a Prius, you're driving it very aggressively (I know, I own one). Thirdly, all cars' mileage estimates drop under the '08 EPA system, not just hybrids.

A similar car to the Aveo is the Honda Fit. The '07 EPA estimates for the Aveo and Fit are 32 and 34 mpg, respectively. The '08 EPA estimate for the Fit is 30 mpg (no estimate for the Aveo is available yet).

http://autos.yahoo.com/newcars/comparison/results.html;_ylt=Atqnr8ASfwMF0T37cvxqXccOc78F;_ylv=3?pagetitle=overview&search_type=all&make=honda&model=4796%3Ahonda_fit_2007&trim=19021&carid0=21656&carid1=18981&carid2=22688

So not only will the Aveo's '08 mileage estimates drop by a similar amount to the Prius', but on what planet is 30 mpg (or in the case of the Aveo, probably 28 mpg) "within spitting distance" of 45-50 mpg? That's 33-44% lower!

On top of that, the Aveo is a compact car while the Prius is a mid-sized car. They're not even comparable!

The second myth is in regards to the Inco nickel plant in Sudbury, Canada

"Dubbed the Superstack, the plague-factory has spread sulfur dioxide across northern Ontario, becoming every environmentalist’s nightmare."

Here is the reality of this myth:

"In fact any damage occurred more than thirty years ago, long before the Prius was made. Since then, Inco has reduced sulphur dioxide emissions by more than 90 per cent and has helped to plant more than 11 million trees.

The company has won praise from the Ontario Ministry of Environment and environmental groups. Sudbury has won several conservation awards and is a centre for eco-tourism."

http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=417227&in_page_id=1770

Answer 2

I do not believe those claims.

1) Nickel mining was never mentioned as a major environmental problem before, and hybrid cars do not use enough nickel to make it any worse than it already is. Even without these nickel batteries, that metal is mined and used for many other purposes. And other battery technologies can and are being used in other cars. So the whole nickel mining complaint is a bunch of hogwash.

2) If the Prius took 50% more energy to build than the Hummer, then it would cost 50% more to buy. But it doesn't, so it doesn't. I simply do not believe these claims of how much energy to takes to build a Prius and how little it takes to build a Hummer. No proof is offered. It is just stated. Falsely. Gove me proof that I can verify and not a simple unsubstantiated statement and ask again.

Answer 3

The fact that they assumed that a Hummer would be on the road for 300,000 miles and the Prius only 100,000 miles makes me wonder what other ludicrous assumptions they made to come up with those figures.

Answer 4

Yeah that figures. That is why the first thing America needs to do, is demand that every vehicle has the highest fuel mileage standards. The US nation vehicle fleet if achieved an average of 40 miles per gallon we would not need foreign oil. Right now the US is just averaging around 12mpg (mostly due to all those dumb-asses in hummers).

Answer 5

Interesting.... just goes to show you that hype is nothing to base ones life on... newer, cleaner, energy sources will arrive... but not tomorrow.. or the next day... there aren't any mean old car manufactures or big oil buying up patents that will get that Hummer to 100 MPG of fuel costing 25 cents a gallon... But we will get there.

Answer 6

Your first clue should be that it is written in a student newspaper. It originated from a Hummer marketing company and has been proven wrong.

Use more sources.

Answer 7

here we go again... It's a poorly researched article in a college student newspaper, which used data from a flawed article written by a marketing company...

I suggest reading:
Battery Toxicity: http://www.hybridcars.com/battery-toxicity.html
Hummer versus Prius: “Dust to Dust” Report Misleads the Media and Public with Bad Science: http://www.pacinst.org/topics/integrity_of_science/case_studies/hummer_versus_prius.html
Prius Versus HUMMER: Exploding the Myth: http://www.thecarconnection.com/Auto_News/Green_Car_News/Prius_Versus_HUMMER_Exploding_the_Myth.S196.A12220.html
Giving Directions: http://www.betterworldclub.com/articles/hummer-not-more-efficient.htm
Heard the One About the Hummer?: http://www.toyota.com/html/dyncon/2007/september/hummervprius.html

Usually the mythic "article" from The Mail on the nickel in the hybrid cars' NiMH batteries is quoted from a now retracted article. The retraction that clears up this bit of misinformation is at:
http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=417227&in_page_id=1770

Hybrid battery replacements aren't all that common, and on some models very rare. (The hybrid battery is designed to last the life of the car.) In the US, the hybrid battery packs are usually warrantied for 8 years/80,000 miles or longer (depending on manufacturer and if an AT-PZEV model in a CA emission state (10 years/150,000 miles). Full warranty, NOT pro-rated.

Meanwhile, here's the 2004 Toyota Prius Green Report (life cycle assessment):
http://www.toyota.co.jp/en/k_forum/tenji/pdf/pgr_e.pdf
(you'll need to download the Japanese fonts for your PDF reader inorder to read it, but the entire document is written in English. note that this was published well before the Inco-Sudbury "article" and CNW "report.")

Over the lifespan of the Prius, when compared to a comparable mid-sized gasoline vehicle, the Prius comes out ahead in the lifecycle assessment (LCA) for airborne emissions for CO2, NOx, SOx, HC, but actually does worse for PM (thanks to the material and vehicle production stages). Lifespan is given as 10 years use/100,000km. The CO2 break-even point for the 2004 Prius compared to this unnamed gasoline vehicle is given at 20,000km. (more CO2 is emitted during Prius production, but the Prius makes up for it over it's driven lifetime.)

Another neat thing is that the Prius is one of the first uses of
Toyota's Eco-Plastic (plastic made from plants, as opposed to
petroleum products). The battery is recycleable (NiMH), as is much of
the car (steel and aluminum body, for example).

To quote Toyota's press release:
http://pressroom.toyota.com/photo_library/display_release.htmlid=20040623

How long does the Prius battery last and what is the replacement cost?

The Prius battery (and the battery-power management system) has been designed to maximize battery life. In part this is done by keeping the battery at an optimum charge level - never fully draining it and never fully recharging it. As a result, the Prius battery leads a pretty easy life. We have lab data showing the equivalent of 180,000 miles with no deterioration and expect it to last the life of the vehicle.
We also expect battery technology to continue to improve: the second-generation model battery is 15% smaller, 25% lighter, and has 35% more specific power than the first. This is true of price as well. Between the 2003 and 2004 models, service battery costs came down 36% and we expect them to continue to drop so that by the time replacements may be needed it won't be a much of an issue. Since the car went on sale in 2000, Toyota has not replaced a single battery for wear and tear.

Is there a recycling plan in place for nickel-metal hydride batteries?

Toyota has a comprehensive battery recycling program in place and has been recycling nickel-metal hydride batteries since the RAV4 Electric Vehicle was introduced in 1998. Every part of the battery, from the precious metals to the plastic, plates, steel case and the wiring, is recycled. To ensure that batteries come back to Toyota, each battery has a phone number on it to call for recycling information and dealers are paid a $200 "bounty" for each battery.


As for the batteries themselves:

The lead-acid (Pb-A) 12v accessory batteries in hybrids tend to be smaller than those found in every traditional gasoline vehicle. Recycling programs are in place for traditional lead-acid batteries.

All the hybrids on the market use NiMH (Nickel-Metal Hydride) batteries, which contain no heavy metals (so they're not hazardous waste, like the Pb-A batteries), and are easily recycled. Often they'll have labels on the packs themselves listing who to contact to recycle them, and often there's a nice cash bounty as well.


There are no commercially-available plug-in hybrids on the market so far. (You cannot plug-in any commercially available hybrid to your home electric source. They are all fueled by the same gasoline as a regular car. The gasoline engine can act as a generator to power the hybrid battery, and some otherwise lost kinetic energy is reclaimed through regenerative braking.)

Some hobbiests and aftermarket companies have been altering a few hybrids (Prius, Ford Escape Hybrid/Mercury Mariner Hybrid) to make them plug-in capable, though. Typically this requires adding additional hybrid batteries, besides the ability to charge off the mains.
For more information, check out
http://www.calcars.org/vehicles.html

For cost reasons, unless you are a fleet owner or other high-mileage driver it probably will not be worth the cost of the PHEV conversion for you. (Conversion pricing is high due to startup costs and low volumes, besides the pricing of the needed additional battery packs.)

To note, converting to a PHEV (plug-in hybrid electric vehicle) does not reduce the vehicle's range. It gives the owner the option to recharge the (newly added larger) hybrid battery pack at night (cheap electricity and off-peak electric load which would otherwise be lost). The vehicle would run for a certain distance (longer than stock) on the stored electric power alone, and when the battery pack is depleted to a certain point the vehicle reverts back to its original hybrid self and runs on a combination of the gasoline engine (which will also recharge the battery) and the electric motor. A PHEV would add a greater all-electric range to the existing hybrid, besides the ability (but not the requirement!) to plug it into an electric source.


Depending on the source for electricity in your area, a BEV (battery electric vehicle) may or may not put out more greenhouse gas emissions than a 55MPG HEV (hybrid electric vehicle). Mainly, if the primary source for electricity in your area is coal, your HEV is cleaner than a BEV running on coal-powered electricity. However, if your electricity source is natural gas, the BEV is usually cleaner than the HEV (depending on the method used for natural gas->electricity conversion), and it gets even better for the BEV if you are using a hydroelectric or other renewable electric source. In comparisons with a generic 17MPG SUV, an average 26MPG vehicle, and a high-efficiency 38MPG vehicle, the 38MPG vehicle still will beat the coal-powered BEV, but isn't as clean as the HEV (and gas and renewables powered BEVs are much better than the 38MPG vehicle).
see: "Battery-Powered Electric and Hybrid Electric Vehicle Projects to Reduce Greenhouse Gas Emissions: A Resource Guide for Project Development," July 2002
http://www.netl.doe.gov/products/ccps/pubs/resguide.pdf
http://www.eere.energy.gov/cleancities/international/pdfs/hev_ev_ghgreductions.pdf

mainly section 4.3

(and that's besides the arguements that it's easier to manage emissions from a handful of electric plants, as opposed to millions of independently-owned cars... typically, electric charging rates (especially the off-peak charging times which would use otherwise lost power and level the loads) are still cheaper than petroleum rates, too. Of course, there are still emissions to worry about other than just greenhouse gas emissions, too.)


You may also want to try out the HEV cost/benefit/emission calculator at: http://www.eere.energy.gov/afdc/vehicles/hybrid_electric_calculator.html

more info on US electric power generation (for your followup BEV question) can be found here: http://www.eia.doe.gov/fuelelectric.html

Answer 8

Solve one problem, create another.