A jehovah boffin answered a Q about a new change in JW doctrine with 'For the last 25 years virtually no teach

Question

ing has changed to any real significance... There is not a single society document that says all the anointed were selected by 1935.' I note this self-imposed time span avoids the dropped/denied 1975 debacle!

I think, however, there HAVE been subtle changes to JW doctrine in the last 25 years, eg the separating of the sheep from the goats now being future, the generation of 1914 no longer being alive to see Armageddon - it will be a future generation, a generation is no longer 70-80 years but 36 or so years, and now there seems to be something afoot with the decree that the 'calling' for the 144,000 was closing around 1935 as the 'calling' for the earthly hope was beginning.

I want to ask, are JWs telling the public one thing whilst knowing more than they're prepared to admit to, or are these changes so subtly phrased in Watchtower literature that they don't realise the significance/extent of these changes and how serious they are?

No, I wasn't cursing (as one JW answerer thought). It was a punter using the pseudonym 'jehovah boffin' whose statements I quoted in my question. Hope that clears the point up!

Answer 1

The sealing of the anointed - let's get this straight. The sealing of the anointed has to take place BEFORE Armageddon. Armageddon is predicted to arrive SHORTLY AFTER the end of 6,000 years of human existence.

This is what Jehovah's Witnesses believed about the end of 6,000 years of human existence and Armageddon way back in 1881: "Well, 1873 came, the end of 6,000 years, and yet no burning of the world" (Zions Watch Tower, February 1881, page 188). The article then went on to claim that prophecies had been found that pointed positively to 1874 as the time when Jesus was due to be present. THAT MEANS THE SEALING OF THE ANOINTED MUST HAVE HAPPENED AROUND 1873 BECAUSE THEY WERE EXPECTING ARMAGEDDON THEN.

In 1971 (that's 26 years ago) the Watch Tower Society made the following statement in their book 'The Nations Shall Know That I am Jehovah': "Within our 20th century the battle in the day of Jehovah will begin." They are talking about Armageddon. This is because they had recalculated the 6,000 years of human existence to 1975. Therefore the sealing of the anointed HAD TO HAVE HAPPENED BEFORE THE START OF THE 21st CENTURY.

As usual, the goalposts keep on being moved because of all their failed predictions about the 6,000 years of human existence. How else are they to hang onto their members?

One JW answer said 'some enlightening new details have emerged in 130 years'. Details that mean the date of the end of 6,000 years of human existence were out by 130 years? I'd hardly refer to such significant errors in calculations as being put down to mere details.

Then we have the excuse that 'ongoing Bible research, occasional advances in archeology and etymology would result in refinements of ones understanding'. Refinements? I might have been born at night, but it certainly wasn't last night.

The passage from 1 Corinthians 13:12 was taken out of context. It does not refer to a knowledge of end-time matters. "Now we see but a poor reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known." Christians will come to know the Lord to the fullest extent possible but this will not be true until the Lord returns - and that hasn't happened yet, regardless of JW claims of an INVISIBLE second coming in 1914.

However, I absolutely agree with the Bible quotation that was given from Daniel 12:9 - "Go your way, Daniel, because the words are closed up and sealed until the time of the end." In other words, leave God to mind his own business about end-time matters and stop trying to predict the end of 6,000 years of human existence, Armageddon and Christ's visible second coming.

Having been brought up as a Jehovah's Witness (till I left after 1975) it is my considered opinion that the Governing Body absolutely understand the significance of the changes that are being made. That is why they are so defensive when proof is presented to show them up for the false prophets they are.

Answer 2

Of course we realise if we make a change.

Meanwhile, to prove we are bad people or worse than you, you felt the need to curse?

Answer 3

i think they will know, to my understanding they do things very much with debate and contemplation when it comes to the doctorin but i am not a JW so i am only going with what i have read in their literature

Answer 4

well, I think a generation is only 20 years, but I may be misinformed.

Answer 5

At the risk of another violation notice, I will say it. JW is a cult.

Answer 6

Andre Agassi said AFTER Having a "Full HEAD" of Hair; & then Losing IT and going Bald; the Following :

CHANGE IS GOOD ! ! !

As Always; RESPECTFULL CHRISTIAN

Answer 7

No

More than a century ago, Jehovah's Witnesses recognized the bible truths that hell is not hot, that the soul is not immortal, that God has a personal name, that Jesus is not Jehovah, that most humans will be resurrected as humans, and that God's Messianic Kingdom will restore paradise to earth and end the suffering of humankind.
http://watchtower.org/e/jt/index.htm?article=article_03.htm

Amazingly, those ideas remain tightly and uniquely identified with Jehovah's Witnesses. Some enlightening regarding details has emerged in 130 years, but it is a silly exaggeration to pretend that significant teachings (such as those mentioned above) have been "changed".


It is refreshing and unique that a religion the size and scope of Jehovah's Witnesses continues to embrace the teaching that seems best supported by Scripture. Would the questioner recommend otherwise?

In any event, it seems rather obvious that ongoing bible research, as well as occasional advances in archeology and etymology, would result in refinements of one's understanding. That was true for Jesus' apostles and other early Christians, and it is true today.

In the first century CE, certain ideas took DECADES to resolve, even among men and women who walked with Christ Jesus. Even in the presence of Jesus, the idea of 'eating flesh and blood' stumbled some disciples (not outsiders, but disciples) who were unwilling to wait for the now-obvious answer (Jesus was simply speaking metaphorically).

After Jesus' impalement, sincere disciples were confused about whether Christianity should involve only Jews, or maybe only Jews and Samaritans, or maybe only these and circumcised Gentiles. There was confusion about using tongues within the congregation, about tolerating sin and "Jezebel", about when Jesus would "return", and about when Armageddon would arrive. Much of this confusion was quite public; even though the apostle Peter enjoyed tremendous privileges and direct communication from heaven, Peter seems to have been the source of an incorrect teaching "out among the brothers" that was perhaps not resolved until the apostle John wrote his Gospel more than 60 years later!

(John 6:61-68) Jesus, knowing in himself that his disciples were murmuring about this, said to them: “Does this stumble you? ...he went on to say: “This is why I have said to you, No one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father.” Owing to this many of his disciples went off to the things behind and would no longer walk with [Jesus].

(Acts 18:25-26) [Apollos] had been orally instructed in the way of Jehovah and, as he was aglow with the spirit, he went speaking and teaching with correctness the things about Jesus... When Priscilla and Aquila heard him, they took him into their company and expounded the way of God more correctly to him.

(John 21:21-23) Peter said to Jesus: “Lord, what will this man do [that is, the apostle John]?” Jesus said to him: “If it is my will for him to remain until I come, of what concern is that to you? You continue following me.” In consequence, this saying went out among the brothers, that [the apostle John] would not die. However, Jesus did not say to him that he would not die, but: “If it is my will for him to remain until I come, of what concern is that to you?”


Does the bible support the idea that full knowledge would be instantly understood by everyone? No. Instead, the bible contains such reasonable ideas as these:

(1 Corinthians 13:12) For at present we see in hazy outline by means of a metal mirror, but then it will be face to face. At present I know partially, but then I shall know accurately even as I am accurately known.

(Daniel 8:16,17;12:4,9) [The voice] proceeded to call out and say: “Gabriel, make that one there understand the thing seen.” ..And he proceeded to say to me: “Understand, O son of man, that the vision is for the time of the end.” ...“And as for you, O Daniel, make secret the words and seal up the book, until the time of the end. Many will rove about, and the true knowledge will become abundant.” ...And he went on to say: “Go, Daniel, because the words are made secret and sealed up until the time of the end.

Learn more:
http://watchtower.org/e/jt/index.htm?article=article_02.htm
http://jw-media.org/beliefs/beliefsfaq.htm

Answer 8

Looks like your eyes are starting to open.
http://towerwatch.com

In answer to the second half of your question, only god can know the answer to that. It has to be answered by each individual.