Atheists: no hate please. Why?

Question

Every time I read an answer on here from an athiest, it always has this resonance of hatred or disdain behind it. It seems that athiests always have an agenda and that agenda always seems to be some form of depressing people or, as you call it, "bringing them to rational thought rather than an irrational belief in a supreme being." Here is my question: Why is it that athiests, who have no hope or reason for their unbelief (other than irrational ideas about a "god"), still feel the need to bring other people alongside them? Why is it that in an idea that has no hope behind it whatsoever (and is only based in "reality") is promoted just because the alternative is illogical? Why can't I EVER get a decent explanation for athiesm (even in a book), other than "God doesn't exist. It's just a fact. The Bible is full of lies, thousands-of-years-old lies"? The sad thing is, I already know the responses and "answers" I'll get to my "questions."

I wish I could have explained this better. There were words I used that were confusing, but I honestly couldn't come up with the words I wanted to use. And in response to an answerer, I only skimmed through most of Sam Harris' "Letter to a Christian Nation" and was troubled by pretty much every point he made and how he backed it up. The thing is, the Bible could pretty much be twisted in whatever way you want to say what you want it to say. Unfortunately, there are also parts that we just don't have the capacity to understand and that sucks. However, if the Bible is taken into context in terms of Jesus coming into the world and being the one sacrifice for all, it makes a lot more sense and most claims made by athiests become totally unreasonable in relation to the evidence they use to back them up.

Answer 1

What many believers discern as "anger" or "hatred", I consider "passion for truth". For centuries, Christians, in particular, have bullied their way around, particularly in the West, thinking they should have final say in everything from medical procedures to legislation affecting everyone, including non-Christians.

When the internet popularized in the 1990s, it quickly became an extremely powerful ally for atheists. Christians have always been able to congregate once a week (or more) to reinforce their own beliefs, and to commune. Atheists had no similar outlet -- until the internet. The internet made our world a significantly smaller place, and in communicating with others around the world, we have learned that we are not alone in how we feel about God. That fact has led to a significant shift upward in the volume of the atheist's voice, collectively.

Atheism is, to me, not depressing but is extremely positive in its liberation of the human mind. When I let go of God, so to speak, it was like a parole for my thoughts. No longer did I feel like there was a peeping tom, per se, watching and listening to my every move, thought, or idea. Embracing common sense and rational thought was one of the best things that ever happened to me.

I would ask what books regarding atheism you have read, because in my experience, atheism deconstructs religion rather easily, concisely, and accurately. I think that is one of the reason so many believers detest atheism : it's because it makes sense that anyone with any sliver of capability for rational thought can make sense of.

If you're willing, David Mills has made available for free a condensed version of his book 'Atheist Universe'. This clip is about 73 minutes long, and can be burned onto one CD-R(W), and listened to in your car. I think his is a great introduction to anyone genuinely curious about how atheists think.

Answer 2

Every time I read an answer on here from a theist, it always has this resonance of hatred or disdain behind it. It seems that theists always have an agenda and that agenda always seems to be some form of depressing people or, as you call it, "bringing them to irrational thought rather than a rational disbelief in a supreme being." Here is my question: Why is it that theists, who have no hope or reason for their belief (other than irrational ideas about a "god"), still feel the need to bring other people alongside them? Why is it that in an idea that has no hope behind it whatsoever (and is only based in "fantasy") is promoted just because the alternative is logical? Why can't I EVER get a decent explanation for theism (even in a book), other than "God exists. It's just a fact. The Bible is full of facts, thousands-of-year-old facts"? The sad thing is, I already know the responses and "answers" I'll get to my "questions."

Hmm, works this way just as well.

Answer 3

"Why is it that athiests, who have no hope or reason for their unbelief (other than irrational ideas about a "god"), still feel the need to bring other people alongside them?"


I do have reason for my lack of belief. There is no evidence for gods. Does that mean a god does not exist? No, I just find the circumstance incredibly unlikely. Especially when there is no evidence of supernatural intervention into natural processes, and most world religions are focused on a personal god that influences the human species. I only feel the need to explain my views because religion is enforcing its policies onto other people in groups known as the religious right and Islamic fundamentalism. Creationism and Shariah law still encourage scientific illiteracy and the later destroys human rights. I want to debate fundamentalism before it hurts society. If I have sounded angry in a post, then it could be because atheists are not allowed to run for political office in seven states, though our Constitution allows for religious freedom (or lack thereof).

Why is it that in an idea that has no hope behind it whatsoever (and is only based in "reality") is promoted just because the alternative is illogical?

There is hope (also known as optimistic desire) for a lot of things, even if you do not believe in a god. I hope for the human species and this planet. The alternative, theism, is illogical because it asks for belief in different religious ideas, but without evidence. Agnosticism and atheism are more logical by default because they must work on mechanisms other than "faith."

"Why can't I EVER get a decent explanation for athiesm (even in a book), other than "God doesn't exist. It's just a fact. The Bible is full of lies, thousands-of-years-old lies"?"

I'm not trying to tick you off, mate. But in a universe that is fourteen billion years old and contains a trillion galaxies (earth is a mote of dust), the idea that a few men in the Middle East answered the god question a mere heart beat ago (2,000 years is nothing) feels ludicrous.

If you need an example of one falsehood, Genesis says that the earth was created in six days and that plants came before stars-- obviously untrue. A woman came from the rib of a man. Some people will try to use this metaphorically, but the men who wrote the bible thought it was literal fact.

Have you ever read the bible, and some of the murderous behavior it espouses? I have. I'm actually tackling the Koran at the moment, and believe it or not, is less violent than the Old Testament.

Also, do you think that in a huge universe where people are more precious and less numerous than, a real, benevolent god would demand this?

Psalm 136 How blessed will be the one who seizes and dashes your little ones Against the rock.

If you are interested in a rational criticism of biblical passages from a moral standpoint, here is a website to get you started:

http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/

Notice that in order to support the bible in the modern world Christians must sugarcoat these passages with rationalization, or take them metaphorically. The point is that the bible never laid out any support for democracy or human rights. Those ideas did not exist in the society that influenced the bible. Later humans were smart enough not to limit themselves to a fallacious belief system. We've passed Bronze age faith systems. What we understand about the universe, in all of its vastness and beauty, is that existence doesn't conform to human expectations or our desire to believe. Why would it conform to a religion?


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Answer 4

First of all, I think you might be applying the principles of selective attention here. I have read other questions from religious people here who actually take time to compliment us on our candor and politeness. Sometimes we can be less polite but I try to answer politely phrased questions politely and nastily-phrased questions with a little more sting.

I'm not out to depress anyone. Nor do I find my outlook on life depressing. It seems more often that it's Christians and other religious people who post questions about say a crisis of faith that's eating them alive. And sometimes, yes I do tell them that their crisis is based on something I consider a fairy tale, not to depress them but to give them a way to think that might take some weight off their shoulders.

O.K. how's this for a reason for atheism. I've often heard the argument that the spontaneous arising of life on this planet is so statistically improbable that we need a creator to have it happen at all. But if the odds of life spontaneously showing up are long, what are the odds that a perfect, complex being just happened to exist? The odds that life could arise spontaneously are shortened considerably by scientific experiments. I was watching The History Channel last night. There was a show called "The Universe" in which there was featured an experiment where scientists found that lightning in a vacuum can create organic life. Admittedly we still are left with a need to explain how the lightning arose spontaneously. But further study into that sounds more interesting than stopping, positing a grand creator and letting the matter rest.

And I don't think it's unreasonable to not believe in God based on distrust of the Bible. The Bible is the book that tells us God exists. It also tells us a lot of things we know can't be true today. The things we know aren't true the believers call "metaphor" but how do they know what is metaphor and what isn't? If we try to weed out truth and metaphor from the Bible, then the Bible is not the source of truth.

Answer 5

It's always interesting to me how much time is wasted on religion when no one will ever know the truth. Here's how I see it: You are born without any knowledge of God. At some point some regular human being says "I want you to believe what I believe" and they hand you a religious book and take you to a building where others believe the same thing. Remember It is not in your DNA to worship God, some regular person just told you to do it so you did it. Now for the truth, stop what you are doing and go ahead and ask God if he is real. Don't do anything more until you hear back from God. When God answers you, you can then do what you need to do. Until God answers you personally, the Bible should be nothing more than stories written from people you don't know. When people say "God spoke to them and changed their lives", you can say you are happy for them, but you are waiting for confirmation from God before doing anything more. It's all really simple if you just think about it for a minute or so.

Answer 6

Firstly let me explain something. Hopefully I can make it very clear. Atheism is a lack of belief. That is it. It has NO religious biases. It is NOT a religion. We think freely. We take responsibility for what we say and what we do. We don't tithe, pray, and feel that there is either heaven or hell. We live our lives appreciating everyone that surrounds us. We respect the earth and the universe as a whole, not a part. We understand that clouds and the like hide nothing. We enjoy science as well as science fiction. When the science fiction becomes overwhelming then we start saying STOP. Our lives are free from hells and heavens, we don't adore idols and pretend to drink someone blood. We soar free. Some of us have taken the time to research the bible and its stories and found out there is more to the book then what is read into it. Freedom of mind and relief from the social need to be loved or watched or damned by something unknowable [some argue that, of course] is simply living life to its fullest.

If that is offensive, well I for one - do not care.

Answer 7

First, Athiests do not believe in any form of god or supreme being that brought about or controls life. This is based on the concepts on which religions are based - superstition, fantasy, contradiction and so on. Most of the concepts are so far fetched as to be incredible. OK, that being established - Athiests find it difficult to understand why people who are supposedly otherwise logical, calculating reasonable people seem attracted to these theologies. It is not right but it is a facct that this tends to bring out ridicule, scorn and other negative comments - which do not help their position, we can understand.
the athiests who pile such comments on believers possibly are doing so out of defense. Remember that the believers make some really nasty comments, hateful, threatening, condemnation - about athirsts. The desire to retaliate is just human nature.
If people would just exchange ideas in a rational discourse, the feellings you are getting would not obtain. And perhaps the Athiests might just increase their numbers by presenting a more reasonable point of view.

Answer 8

Well, I'm an atheist by happenstance. I'm a Taoist. I believe in the Tao, but it's not a god. Since I came to this belief, or in fact on my way to it, I came to view deities as being archetypes and metaphors for aspects of the Tao.

The tao that can be told
is not the eternal Tao
The name that can be named
is not the eternal Name.

The unnamable is the eternally real.
Naming is the origin
of all particular things.
--Tao Te Ching

This includes deities. To even call something a 'god' is to separate an idea from the whole of the Tao, which is all things and all not-things.

I guess this is a sort of 'positive' atheism, because my nonbelief in deities is due to belief in something else, not simple denial of an idea.

I know this isn't true for 'logical' atheists, but that's my story :)

Answer 9

While many religious people regard atheism as another sort of religion, it's actually something of a misconception. That's like saying that all Protestants are the same simply because they're not Catholic and lumping together Lutherans and Southern Baptists and Unitarian Universalists.

It sounds like you're failing to understand atheism because you're sailing right past the explanation and expecting something like a religion. Atheism is the disbelief in anything like God or religion. That's it. End of story. What they *do* believe can encompass all kinds of things. However they came to that belief is up to them. Some find religious theologies illogical and unsatisfying, some dislike the pitfalls of human religious institutions. Your asking for a "decent explanation" for atheism sounds a bit like you're asking for a theology out of something which doesn't have one. Ironically, your quote starting with "God doesn't..." is actually a pretty good capsule description of what a lot of atheists seem to think.

It sounds like you're expecting atheism to do something spiritually or psychologically for atheists what religion does for its believers and it just doesn't work that way. It's a bit like asking a man what they do when they get their period, or what kind of bicycle a fish likes to ride. The questions don't really apply.

So atheists get their view of the origin of the world from wherever they get it. Maybe they get it from science, maybe not. Maybe they just don't care.

And moral atheists have morality they just don't see it as founded in religious tenets. Maybe they see it as a form of social contract, maybe they have some other notion.

However they do it, they manage to do it.

Perhaps this in itself is what so many religious individuals find so baffling about it. Religion often forms a central pillar of one's identity and one's worldview, so much so that it becomes hard to grasp even the notion of the complete absence of such a support.

Answer 10

Im not trying to be rude here, but I have read a lot of answers from so called christians and they sometimes get very rude as well. Lets not generalize, or name call or stereo-type. We all can be rude at times and hate. Jesus taught us to love one another as far as Im concerned. And I am a christian. And I believe that by telling an atheist that he has no hope just incites them more.