A question for atheists?

Question

I know this may sound like a truly stupid question, and for that I apologize in advance, but I'd appreciate it if you'd indulge me.

I'm an agnostic theist. I know there is no evidence for God, etc., but I do have that sense that so many theists refer to that there is something greater. Christians call it "knowing in their heart," or the Holy Spirit entering them of having Jesus in their hearts. I just call it a sense that there *is* something more. It may not be "supernatural" or anything... it could just be a collective consciousness... but whatever it is, I call it God and believe in it despite the lack of evidence.

Many atheists point out that such feelings could very easily be the result of brain chemistry or such things or even mental illness.

I was just asking myself why I believe in God even though I agree with you guys on evidence requirements, etc. and the answer I came up with is this sense that God exists.

So my question to you is this: do you just not have that feeling, or do you have it but attribute it to brain chemistry or some other cause and ignore it?

I know this sounds a bit like the "You know there is a God and are just ignoring Him" crap, and I do apologize for that... I'm just really trying to understand... more myself than you, but you can help. Thanks

Magley, it is a question. Sorry... I did warn you that it would sound pretty stupid!

Jack, maybe you just deperately need to think more! :-)

resigned... you're right - these answers are wonderful. I hope they keep coming!

Rev. Soleil & Nea, that book is on my hit list... I've been meaning to read it for some time now. I'll get to it soon!

Answer 1

I think this is a really great question. I haven't read any of the answers yet, but I'm looking forward to it. I'm sure it will get interesting.

Anywho...
Someone once said that any technology, sufficiently advanced, is indistinguishable from magic.

That said, is God simply a higher power? And how high must that power be to be considered God-like? A definition for higher power should be sufficiently restrictive. Otherwise, o0ne could call my parents, the law, or the government a "higher power."

Some scientists (few, that is) consider the possibility that life was "seeded" on earth by alien beings. Such a technology would certainly seem God-like to many people and would qualify as a "higher power." However, I wouldn't consider it any such thing. The American Indians thought that the Spanish Conquistadors were Gods. Imagine if even those Conquistadors were removed from the 18th century and dropped into a busy airport. None of them would have ever suspected that someday, men would build machines that fly, and I bet it would seem God-like to even them. But it wouldn't be. It is simple technology and scientific advancement.

Right now, our computer technology doubles about every 18 months. Computers that now fit in the palm of our hands used to require an entire room to perform the same functions 40 years ago, and the smaller computers are even more powerful than those room sized ones. It took us humans 10,000 years to go from the wheel to the airplane. However, it only took about 60 years to go from the Wright Brothers' 20 foot flight over the ground to get to the moon and back.

Now, imagine an alien civilization that has only 1,000 years more time than we had. There are solar systems that are older than earth by millions of years. If life evolved on those planets at the same rate as ours, one could imagine that their technologies would blow our minds.

But would they be a "higher power?" Not to me. Because they would still be just as restricted by the laws of physics as we are. They would simply have technologies that are beyond us, like the European firearms over bows and arrows. Also, if such alien civilizations existed, there should be proof. They should pay us a visit and actually leave a card once. I know many claim to have seen flying saucers and spacemen, but there is absolutely no empirical evidence of the encounters left behind.

I can't imagine why an alien civilization who would be interested enough in us humans to come from millions of light years away to see us would interact with us in a way that proves they were here.

I think the same way about God. Whether discussing God or aliens, Bigfoot or the Loch Ness Monster, until I have empirical proof of existance, I can't be convinced. It's not a decision. I simply don't believe. I'd like to. But alas, I don't.

Add to that the fact that recent advances of human technologies have revealed several frauds and honest mistakes about things that were once considered evidence of Bigfoot, Nessie, and UFO's, I feel more and more comfortable with considering those things I can't explain as a simply gap in my ability to figure things out, rather than proof of the supernatural.

I view 99.9% of all the arguments for God's existance to be simple Arguments from Incredulity. I sometimes find myself thinking it to be overwhelming that we exist only to live and die with no real lasting purpose to our existance. I am even appalled by the thought. However, I don't consider that to be a valid reason to believe anything.

That's just me though.

El Chistoso

Answer 2

No, I do not have that feeling.

Therefore, I suppose the possible truth is either

*We were not born with it, you are the one that's right, and therefor theists are wrong for hating us for it as if it's a color or handicap they don't like.

or

*It's simply a trick of the mind that some humans are born with, should not be hated for, and some atheists already understand that.


I have always been a very feeling/sensing/gut feeling/intuitive type. If the feeling was there, I would know, but I can honestly tell you that it's not.

Edit: I suppose I should also add that unlike many people who were raised with a religion and were once believers, I was not and have never believed.

Answer 3

I am an atheist, I have never really entertained the idea of there being a god or gods.
I did try when I was younger to get proof, screaming skyward for some sign, something to show me I wasn't alone. And nothing. Nothing came to me, no feeling, no light, no "cosmic understanding". Nothing but me by myself, feeling desperately alone.
I witness things and hear things everyday, which are totally screwed up and I do not feel that if there were a god, that he/she would let his/her children suffer like this.
I know the Christians say that it is because of Eve and the apple. But I find it hard to understand why I would be punished for the sins of another.
I am a good person, as are my children and my partner. We do our best to help others when we can and make this world a bit better. I don't believe in god and I don't believe that being religious would be me a better person.
There are evil religious people as well as evil atheists.

Answer 4

I don't believe in god or gods. I studied the subject and came to my own conclusions. Proving that there is or is not a god is simple enough. There is none. Faith allows you to have a belief. Nothing is wrong with a belief, but it is personal and should be kept that way. Stay away from the dogma of the church and you will be fine. Dogma usually doesn't allow thinking, they tell you what to think. That is dangerous, you need to tap into who you are and appreciate every moment. Religion does not allow the freedom of pleasure on this beautiful earth. They fill the mind with outrages issues and beliefs they make up along the way. Churches need followers - the only way that is accomplished is through believing what they tell you. Believe if you will - just keep the freedom to believe - as you choose, it doesn't make any difference.

Treat you fellow man the way you want to be treated, take complete responsibilitly for your actions, take the time to appreciate who you are and enjoy the freedom to make choices. That is an atheist conclusion.

Answer 5

I think that is a great question.

I believe that we all have similar feelings. Just like we all have an emotional need for community and friendship. We also have an emotional need for structure and safety. I think that leads to the impression that there is something bigger, out there controlling things for us.

Thats not a 'stupid' thing, it is a natural response to life.

Another way to look at it is considering we are all made from the same matter. At one point in time everything that we know of in the universe was compressed into a singular point. We have no evidense that Matter is Finite. Meaning matter changes form, but there is no evidense that it turns into nothing.. Burn a piece of paper and you have gasses, fire, and carbon ashes. The matter is still there, it is just in a different form. So that being said, we are all made from stardust, and at one point billions of years ago were all together in a singularity smaller than the size of an atom.

That may have something to do with the emotional need for community, or God, or Vishnu, or Science. That seems important to us.

Answer 6

I'm an atheist, but I know what you're talking about. Actually, ALL modifications of consciousness arise from (or with) chemical changes in the brain. So I don't think it's any real objection to "spiritual experience" that it may have a physiological basis.

I've practiced the Buddhist and Hindu meditation techniques, and I've experienced the "trances" in which "the seer unites with the thing seen, the knower with the thing known." This is (what we have to call) a "mystic" experience of inexpressible intensity. It wouldn't make any difference to this experience if it could be demonstrated that there were corresponding changes in my brain chemistry when it occurred. It's par for the course! I mean, we can "explain" regular human emotions in terms of chemical changes in the brain; but you're still happy when you're happy.

Again, anybody can take certain drugs and experience counterfeits of the mystic trances. In that case, it's obviously purely a question of altering the brain chemistry; but the experience is what it is for the person undergoing it.

Answer 7

The topic is about GOD ! Atheis BELIEVE there's no GOD, Theis BELIEVE there's GOD - but both about BELIEF and GOD !

In making conclusion, people "feel" easier to be assured by "reason" ! But reasoning is not yet "fact" as fact is something that left no room for any "reasonable doubt"

No matter how strong is the Darwin theory or Alien theory - or no matter how true or how wrong it is ( the fact they're remained as hypothesis or theory anyway) - they're still not a "direct fact" of non or existance of GOD !

Even some "fact" - are actually not yet a fact ! If 1+1=2 is a fact, then it's broken already in IT world with 1+1=0 ! Only by seeing this as true - we can arrive at this IT - and we are using it at this very moment !

Not that I'm keen to deny 1+1=2 - but there are too many - at least -"unexplainable things yet" - where if we force it to become "hard fact" - we will lost the sight to see the imperfectness of our way to see /analyze /conclude things ! The incomplete truth is not the truth !

Another imperfectness of logical method is the analogy. if a=b and b=c then a=c. If monkey =2 leg , human=2 leg , human=monkey ? Not that I disagree with analogy - indeed it have element of truth in it but not yet the Truth !

It goes the same with empirical method ! How to draw a 100% perfect conclusion when human history is too short compared let say with the age of this universe - not yet with eternity ?

The conclusion of experiment of whether life form came from life form have been change at least 3 times ! Before scientist claimed - living form is from a unliving form, then changes into from a living form - now tend to change from a protein - who knows 100 years later it changes again due to new experiment/finding ! Human age is not that long to credibly produce a 100% accurate statistic !

Or how can we blame those ancient people for their argument that the sun circling the earth - it was their "premis" - they "saw" it: everyday - what could be more convincing that it - only then we know that it is the earth that circling the sun !

But from ancient time - the debate is less when they are arguing about ghost, satan, and mystical phenomenon. In this area, many people feel easier to put it as "unexplainable yet" - if not they believe it ! Those who dare not to draw the conclusion that there's no such a phenomenon are suppose to be the same people that dare not to say there's no GOD !

Hence I think we are constantly in the state of "believing" in something ! There those who believe in the method, the experiences, the math ,the reason - but as a base, always in something !

Even even there those who believing on nothing - they are believing on something - which the nothing ! And believing include the feeling - not only the mind ! eg I believe the math is correct so 1+1=2 is true ! Not that I don't believe it - but problem is we cannot understand the whole math yet !

So it is about belief and about GOD ! It's a sign - can you "feel" it ?

Answer 8

I am not an atheist, I would consider myself an agnostic theist as well. However, I think being an agnostic theist is a perfectly normal way to go. It is a very smart, open-minded opinion. It shows you can think for yourself, and not be influenced by others' beliefs.

I wouldn't attribute the feeling to brain chemistry. I do think that God exists, but I know there is no proof, so I wouldn't state it as a fact. I think attributing this to brain chemistry basically completely diminishes the idea that God exists, which is not right to do, because atheists don't have evidence to support their beliefs either.

The truth is, no one knows for a fact whether or not God exists. Therefore, it is impossible to know if this feeling is a result of God's work, or brain chemistry.

Answer 9

Yes, we atheists sometimes have emotional feelings about our being part of the universe as a whole, feelings of trancendence and awe.

But isn't that just what happens when one recognizes that the universe is a huge, wonderful, interesting place? Why does one have to assign either standard supernatural or "collective consciousness"-type supernatural characteristics to this feeling?

No spooky stuff. No "god." No non-physical "collective consciousness." Just that existence is interesting. There are lots of pretty things. Humans are a part of it. We don't ignore the world around us -therefore we see that.

That's all.

Answer 10

I have that same feeling. What I reject is the god of the bible and the monotheistic concept of god...that someone is up in heaven or somewhere creating and ruling over us. Basically, the god that you see in the old paintings in the vatican.

I like the concept of a collective consciousness that you mention and i believe something along those lines. But to me, that isn't what most people call god.

I'm not big on labels, so I don't know if that makes me atheist or agnostic or whatever. I just believe what I want and respect "most" others beliefs so long as they don't impact me or try to force their beliefs on me.