Christians, what would you do? Forewarning, long question..?

Question

Let's go back to the mid 1980's, to a church youth group in Canton, Ohio. In this group was a thin, awkward boy whose face was marred with acne.The ten whose name was Brian had trouble fitting in at school and at church. Some of the jocks in school liked to call him names and shove him into the lockers. They would beat him up for no reason at all just cruelty. Even at church the Christian kids didn't want to hang around him. They had cliques and groups of friends, but Brian was friendless. The youth pastor tried to befriend him but Brian was quiet and socially awkward, so he naturally gravitated toward the other kids. So even at church, Brian had to fend for himself.One day the group went to an amusement park.The pastor had the kids get in pairs of 2 but no one wanted to pair with Brian. So he spent the day alone. Brian went to church for 3 or 4 months, then disappeared.No one missed him, not even the youth pastor. A few years later this youth pastor got a phone call from young man wh

who was in that group who asked" Do you remember that kid, Brian Warner?"The youth pastor drew a blank. "He came for 3 or 4 months then dropped out. A real loner. He went around by himself at the amusement park by himself." "Oh Yeah." said the youth pastor. " I remember now,Brian Warner, what ever happened to him? "He goes by a different name now, you've probably heard of him. Calls himself Marilyn Manson."

who was in that group who asked" Do you remember that kid, Brian Warner?"The youth pastor drew a blank. "He came for 3 or 4 months then dropped out. A real loner. He went around by himself at the amusement park by himself." "Oh Yeah." said the youth pastor. " I remember now,Brian Warner, what ever happened to him? "He goes by a different name now, you've probably heard of him. Calls himself Marilyn Manson."

That's right . That skinny teen who was the outcast of his churches youth group is now the shock jock teen icon Marilyn Manson. He belongs to the church of Satan, and he blasphemes and commits obscene acts onstage while he sings dongs like " Antichrist Superstar." He was once in the walls of a church within easy reach of the Gospel. Today he is on a search and destroy mission, targeting our kids with such lyrics as"I'm the ism, my hates a prism / Let'sjust kill everyone and let your God sort them out."

This story was taken from Led By The Carpenter by D. James Kennedy. The church failed when it came to Brian Warner. As James Kennedy said "It's not too late to pray for Brian Warner. How many of you will pray for him. Let's be sure we don't let another kid slip through our fingers this way. It's easy to love the loveable but it's the unloveable that need love the most. God bless!!

People, It only allows 1000 characters so you have to post and then finish in the edit boxes. Have a little patience.

I believe Manson is not a phoney. He is somewhat like Alice Cooper (who is a Christian, now btw) but I wholly believe that all that poison he spews comes from deep seeded anger and resentment toward the church. And my point is for us to go an extra mile with those who are hardest to love. The fact that he was even at church means something to me and it's sad to me that no one took note of his situation and took him under their wings.

Nic, Did you ever wonder how many of those kids who are shooting up schools or attempting to or actually committing suicide have been led down those paths from the message in manson's music. I know for a fact that there have been many. Our lives are not islands. He has had a traumatic effect on the youth of this nation. If only he had let Jesus Christ into his heart only God knows what good his life could have done, but instead his life has produced nothing but evil. I know it didn't have to be that way.

me aka, My "stary" is just the story I read. I try not to criticize other denominations but an Episcopalian, Catholic background could have been a problem right there and I'll say no more. I just made a lot of folks mad. I still say that it was an opportunity lost when that child was under the roof of a church. An opportunity to show him the love of God and to guide him into the truths of the Bible and the Gospel in particular. I have an Episcopalian couple who I am friends with and they do not believe in the Bible as the Word of God. Without belief in the scriptures your just making it up as you go, to suit yourself.My point of posting this story is to remind fellow Christians not to overlook an opportunity to make a difference in someone like Brians life and thereby make a difference in the worl. That's our job... to change the world one heart at a time. God bless!!

Just want to clarify before I wrap up this question that I am truly not judging this pastor or group.I also don't think that even the treatment received from others will hold up as an excuse when he stands before his creator. Anyone who knows me or has read my answers knows that that is something I preach against. However I want to call our attention to the fact that we DO have a responsibility not to be that stumbling block that some poor Brian Warner stumbles over. Watch for those occasions and opportunities to sit with the one that is being outcast. Be his partner at the Amusement Park. Be a friend to someone who needs one. And yes I understand that some may really not want your friendship, like the boy who shot up the college in Va. He wouldn't allow others to befriend him. I somehow don't think that was the case here or else he wouldn't have been at this youth group. I just feel it was an opportunity missed and I hope you all will pray for him. God bless!!

Answer 1

These sorts of stories break my heart. A middle aged man in our town was stabbed two years ago.....died.......and at the funeral the preacher preached on 'am I my brother's keeper'? He made the congregation squirm, as that man had come to church at various times, and they knew he had many needs......but those needs were not met by the church. The man was a loser, had been for many years, but the fact is, even tho that congregation knew he had needs, they did NOT provide them. The Pastor hoped to wake up the folks in the church.....and many of us need to be awakened,

Answer 2

If your intent was to leave us hanging to see what we would say, interesting.

To respond to as much of the situation as you have provided, I would say that Brian was in a tough spot and he should realize that life is tough. The youth pastor tried to reach out to Brian but the youth pastor has to divide his time among all the children. If Brian didn't respond and join the group fairly quickly, he would have to be left behind so that the youth pastor could deal with the rest of the children. It would have been great if another child had taken on the role to bring Brian into the group. But, that is not likely in this world. While those children that treated Brian badly where wrong, they were only children. It sounds like everyone else acted properly under the conditions.

Answer 3

Well, on the one hand, the pastor should work with ALL the kids to make sure they are being radical about offering hospitality to every kid who comes, not just those in the cliques. This takes a lot of effort and there will be resistance at first, but it is worth it, when shy kids or kids who are kind of backward feel like they belong too.

Church is supposed to be a place of safety, welcome and love.

But on the other hand, every so often you DO get a kid that is either hard to like (as much as you try), is weird, doesn't have social intelligences (like the ability to read body language or other non-verbal cues) and doesn't want to make any effort on their own behalf.

I have to admit, I once had such a kid in a youth group, a girl. I worked with the other youth as much as I could to foster a welcoming and inclusive youth group, but this particular girl was a pain in the neck. She thought she had to be the enforcer of rules and was intolerant of kids just being kids, she didn't know when to keep her mouth shut (always had to offer her opinion like it was God's), and also was a habitual liar. I realized that even though God no doubt loved this kid, where I was spiritually at that time, I was not able to, so I distanced myself from her. When she made outrageous comments, I simply held her accountable to the facts, and told her she was overstating things. I also realized that I could not MAKE the other kids like her. Although they were being pretty good about trying to be nice anyway.

If you haven't worked as a youth pastor, then don't judge the one in this story. They are over worked, underpaid and under-appreciated. You can't sacrifice the youth group experience of 100 kids who need attention for the sake of the one kid that needs *psychological* help.

That's just reality. As for "following up--" most pastors don't follow up with people who leave their churches.

(btw, 7 of 9: thanks for sharing your story - how amazing! Blessings on you for a happier and healthier future!)

Answer 4

Come , finish it, I am waiting for the rest., what happened when the Youth pastor got a phone call.
Listen...I am or was like that individule you are talking about, I want to know how his testamony differs from mine if at all.

Ohh Obviously very different than mine, you see Manson never understood and became bitter, and was never saved to begin with.
As for the Church and youth Pastor and those involved with Mansons decision, these people will be dealt with by God for their actions or lack thereof.

As for me, I realized that If I was of the world the world would love it's own, but because I was chosen out of the world the world would hate me.
Manson never could understand this, because he was never saved.

Answer 5

It is sad that he ended up doing what he does for a living. But sometimes there is just so much you can do to help someone...if they won't meet you halfway, you have no choice but to move on to others who need you too.

I don't think the kids or the church group did anything wrong here. Some people have victim written all over them and just won't accept help that is offered. Calling him names and shoving him into lockers is what bullies do...many were bullied by these types growing up and turned out fine...

There are a lot of loners in school....they don't grow up and get into devil worship or become serial killers.. There is are some people born into this world, that no amount of love and kindness will help...it is almost like they have no concern or care for anything or anyone. They are missing soemthing the rest of us have....

Answer 6

Where is the rest of the story????
Okay, you wrong and you need to get your stary right, here are some facts. Marilyn Manson - What's His Religious Background?
Marilyn Manson was raised in the Episcopal Church. His father was Catholic and his mother was Episcopalian. He attended a nondenominational Christian school. Yet his behavior seems to be at odds with his upbringing. He blames this on the narrow interpretation Christians have of truth. Manson says, "So at an early age, Christians already started to appear to me as people who believed that their interpretation of God was the only one that was right" (beliefnet.com).

Yet Jesus Himself said, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me" (John 14:6, NASB). Over 200 times in the Bible, God says that He is the only God. For example, Isaiah 46:9 says, And do not forget the things I have done throughout history. For I am God--i alone! I am God, and there is no one else like me (NLT). Christians are simply following what the Bible has told them God has said about Himself.

Marilyn Manson - One Conclusion
Marilyn Manson is no different than many of us. He experienced a side of organized religion during his youth that turned him off to any notion of God, love or truth in his later years. He saw money, greed, power and hypocrisy. He saw rules, rituals, ceremonies and buildings. What he missed was the core of Christ's message. It's not about religion - It's about a relationship! It's about knowing God our Father through His Son, Jesus Christ. That's it! The rest is of man, and as we just read, man has a tendency to get in the way!

http://www.allaboutpopularissues.org/marilyn-manson-3.htm

Answer 7

I wish I could have read the conclusion of your story but it cut off at wh.

It is not unusual for kids to be cruel to others kids, kids who are "different"- in fact it is quite common. If Brian was self confident it may not have bothered him at all to be alone in fact he may have preferred that. Teens are so obsessed with fitting in that they will join together to humiliate and degrade others , usually as a result of their own in-securities. Most often the acne goes away the outsider "grows up" and once the realities of life hit, the person who made fun of the outsider realizes that they are no better than him/her. Cut to the class reunion....15 years later. The Jocks are out of shape and bald and the prettiest girls are on their third husband and overweight with a ton of makeup just to "look Good". Life has a funny way of paying back the cruelty I just wish you could convince kids of that.

Answer 8

The church failed him. As a youth pastor, it's his duty to follow up on that kid, love the ones who are unloved. That's what Jesus would want.

Upon reading the rest of it, I don't believe that story. Marilyn Manson isn't evil, he's a phony. He is selling you a product, ripping off Alice Cooper with less taste, humor and class.

Answer 9

No one has an excuse. Life is harder for many who love God anyway. Read the book of Job!

The only person you can change is YOU!!! If you do not feel guilty, don't try blaming others. It takes a whole village to raise a Brian.

Answer 10

I am saved by grace, I was a mormon, beatin down by demons that showed up in my bedroom every night, astral projecting by an angel that was really a demon adn almost dying because satan was after me, but then there was my pior group, the guys called me names like "Dog face" and "fang face" and the girls ignored me like I didn't exist except to stare at me in church. I wondered if they were gay. I had a crush on some guy who had his own problems at home, but took that out on me and would only say hi to me when he needed to be cheered up and walk me home when he was feeling blue, only to realize the next day I didn't exist for about another month until he was feeling blue again. My parents were dysfunctional, when I did become popular my mom flirted with my boyfriends and my dad would come into the bathroom and watch me take a bath from the mirror while picking nose hairs out of his nose, mom didn't care if he was in the bathroom. I was cinderella most of my chirldhood, my mom called she was too depressed to handel my violent brother and so I played her mother and took care of the housework and the kids. My dad was a screaming raging person, that had probably sexually abused me when I was between the age of three and four. After all this, you would expect me to become some criminal and I expected myself to go out and urt or kill every male I could get my hands on or steal every women's man, but God finally got a hold of me and I got saved, so explain that? I came out of a totally dysfunctional home and a cult religion, how did that happen that I got saved???