Catholics - Baptism saves you?

Question

I think we need to be honest, and look at these scriptures in the context they were meant to be in, and not taking them to fit within our own teachings.

First, baptism is a work, is it not?

Catholics proudly Claim, Acts 8:37 as evidence of their claim. HOWEVER, Acts 8 (and the early part of Acts) is directed the JEWS. REPENT AND BE BAPTIZED, this is talking about the JEWS.

Now, note that it says REPENT, and THEN be baptized. Not "baptism saved you", do you see how they look at the bible to suit their own meanings?

Paul shows us how to be saved, and he simply says BELIEVE, this is for the Non-Jews to be saved. So simple, why must you corrupt the word of God?

Now, they give many other scriptures to try to back their claim that "Saved By Baptism" However, we must look closely at the scriptures and see, is this WATER Baptism, or are they talking about the Holy Spirit coming to us? When the Bible says "Baptism" it does not always equate to "Water Baptism".

furthermore, there are no instances of Infants being baptized EVER in the Bible. Not even one! How can they call themselves Christians, yet teach something totally the opposite of God's word?

Also, the word Baptism means to fully Immerge under water, not sprinking.

We are saved by God's grace alone. Give Jesus Christ the Credit, and not your religous organization, priest or pope.

Man, they don't even READ, copy and PASTE!!!! You are so BLIND!

Answer 1

good job.... i agree


most that say that will point to 1 or 2 scriptures and misinterpret them

Lets take Acts 2:38 their favorite.

38Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

see the comma after repent? Means pause and start a different or new thought.

There are many scriptures that leave baptism out

John 3:16
1 Jn 5:12
Rom 10:13 to name 3

if baptism is important where is it in these verses?

The thief on the cross asked Jesus to save him and Jesus save. OK get down and jump in the lake.

NO he said

Luke 23:43
And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, Today shalt thou be with me in paradise.

the catholics will claim it is purgatory. there is no purgatory in the bible.

If i come upon a car wreck and the man in the car is dying i can lead him to Christ. I dont have to drag him to a puddle and dunk him.

Jesus is the way.

Answer 2

The Bible was written by men and isn't "A how to get into heaven" manual. Why would an omnipotent being care about the silly human ceremonies we do or don't perform? Someone can dunk themselves in water a thousand times- what matters is whats in your heart.

I was raised Catholic and I think that the baptism is just done for the family as a show of their faith and because they believe that were born with original sin and that some how magically makes the original sin wash off. Then when the child is older they take the sacrament of Confirmation done at 13 or 14.

In the time the Bible was written ceremonies were important but they were more for the people than for the omnipotent. Like animal sacrifice, because people were naive and ignorant of nature and science, and didn't understand why crops failed or the earth shook, so the priests (or scribes?) said make offerings. Like God really came down and ate the animals and the freshest or first of the crops, You know they left that stuff at the alters and the priests just took everything!

Ceremonies are just a way for people to reaffirm their faith. People should just focus on being the best people they can be morally and ethically.

Answer 3

Brian, Brian, Brian.

Since when does the word "and" mean "then" -- ?

The text says, "repent and be baptized," just as you say.

The text does NOT say, "repent, then be baptized." You are adding your interpretation to the text to twist it into what you want it to say.

Observe.

Supposing I tell my son, "Pick up your toys and make your bed." If he makes his bed first and then picks up his toys, is he being disobedient?

NO!

Any parent would be insane to punish their child for making the bed first and then picking up the toys.

Now, suppose I said, "Your bath is ready. Take off your clothes, then get into the bathtub."

If he got into the bath first and then took off his clothes, he'd be in trouble, because I told him to do things in a certain order, and he did them out of order.

We Catholics do NOT believe that the work of baptism saves us. We believe that Christ saves us. We believe that receiving the Sacrament of water baptism is a good way to receive saving grace from Christ because the Bible says so. Please refer to 2 Corinthians 5:17, Titus 3:5 and Ephesians 5:8. But the Church recognizes the fact that one can also receive Baptism by "blood" (martyrdom) or by "desire" (wanting to receive baptism but being unable to before death). Refer to the Catholic Catechism, 1258-1261 and 1281-1283 for details.

You seem to have skipped over Mark 16:16 when you read your Bible. Here, I have it:

"Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned."

That's Christ speaking. Are you going to argue with Him and say that baptism isn't necessary for people who have it available to them? (Not all do, hence baptism by blood or desire.)

Now then, you say there are "no instances of infants being baptized ever in the Bible." You are incorrect.

Acts 16:31-33 describes Paul and Silas's counsel to their jailer.

"They replied, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved—you and your household." Then they spoke the word of the Lord to him and to all the others in his house. At that hour of the night the jailer took them and washed their wounds; then immediately he and all his family were baptized.

Wow, Brian! Look at that! The jailers HOUSEHOLD was saved! He and ALL his family were baptized.

Think about that carefully, now. There was no birth control back then. People had baby after baby. There was always a baby in the house. And they lived three or four generations together, the grandparents and even a great-grandparent under their roof. It was part of their culture. If the jailers' whole household and ALL his family were baptized, there was at least one baby or toddler in that mix.

I know it's hard to figure out for people in the U.S. culture, which is so anti-child. Lots of households around here in these modern times don't have babies. But back then, they did.

Same chapter, a wee bit earlier. Lydia and her WHOLE household also were baptized.

Verse 15: "When she and the members of her household were baptized, she invited us to her home. "If you consider me a believer in the Lord," she said, "come and stay at my house." And she persuaded us."

So there's two.

Acts 18:8 "Crispus, the synagogue ruler, and his entire household believed in the Lord; and many of the Corinthians who heard him believed and were baptized." There's another entire household. Three.

1 Corinthians 1:16 - Paul writing, here: "Yes, I also baptized the household of Stephanas; beyond that, I don't remember if I baptized anyone else." That's four.

So much for your "NOT ONE." Once again, you're the one in total opposition to the Bible, not Catholics.

As your complaint about immersion verses sprinkling is unfounded. Catholics do have full-immersion baptisms, quite often. Sprinkling is allowed because the Catholic faith is an old faith. A vat of water big enough to immerse even a child was not always practical before the ages of modern pumps and piping. We don't all live near rivers, lakes and ponds, you know. So being able to baptize somebody without immersion is a mercy.

Catholics know that we are all saved by God's grace alone. You post a falsehood when you say we believe otherwise. We give Jesus ALL the credit -- always have. And if you had REALLY ever been to a Catholic Mass, you'd know it.

This makes me think that your claim to be an ex-Catholic is really just a bald-faced lie. If you were Catholic, you would know we believe Christ is the only source for Salvation. Either that or you flat-out didn't pay attention and ignored everything that was happening around you.

What a pity.

Answer 4

First Baptism does not save you just like simply believing does not save you.

The Grace of God saves us.

The question is how do we gain access to this grace?

The Bible is very clear.

Hear
Believe
Confess
Repent
Baptism (yes water)

It is not a work because it does not earn your salvation. No one can earn salvation. If I were to give you $1,000 for walking through my door, would walking through my door earn that salvation? No, you would still consider that $1,000 a free gift!

You receive the gift of the Holy Spirit when you are water baptized. (Acts 2:38)

Jesus himself when telling the Jewish disciples to go and share the gospel with the ENTIRE world said that whoever believes and is baptized will be saved. (Mk. 16:16)

Answer 5

at the same time as being Baptized interior the Catholic Church is critical to residing out the Catholic faith, it maximum actual does no longer propose you get a loose fee tag to Heaven. It frees you and cleanses you of unique sin (Adam and Eve delivered that into the international by making use of eating of the forbidden fruit, study in Genesis). you will commit very serious sins after your Baptism at any think approximately your life which will very heavily disconnect you from God and, in case you do no longer say sorry of those sins, advantage your damnation into Hell. Now, i'm no longer suggesting a thank you to or a thank you to no longer get to Hell, regardless of the undeniable fact that it relatively is maximum actual available to get there even after being baptized (or after receiving any of the Sacraments for that remember).

Answer 6

Wait a minute! Hey, there are those of us out here who aren't Roman Catholic who believe that according to *Scripture alone*, Holy Baptism does indeed save (Titus 3:4-8a; 1 Peter 3:21)! Perhaps I, as one of those can help to clarify things.

This war between Baptist theology & Roman Catholic theology. I'm not quite understanding it, because in the end you both believe that faith + works save you, it's just that the Roman Catholic is actually honest about that part of his/her theology & the works look different.

You say you want to get honest? You would probably cite: Romans 10:9-10 as your proof text for decision theology (a false & unbiblical theology by the way). You say, "by grace alone", but then you turn around in the next breath & say that you must "believe in your heart" (as if believing is an active verb, not a passive one & as if faith isn't a gift granted by the Holy Spirit--I've actually heard Baptists deny the plain truth of Eph. 2:8-9) or you must "confess with your mouth". How then are you not trusting in your sinful heart & your sinful mouth?! So the R.C.s believe in their Pope/priest, but you take the error even one step further, you believe in your own self. Now, that would be honest.

The truth about Holy Baptism is beautiful. It is quite certainly *not* man's work! It quite simply is an extension of the Cross of Christ--God's work for us, God's *means* of grace for the individual! Christ did indeed die for the forgiveness of sins of everyone, & He graciously distributes that grace alone through His work of Holy Baptism. The reason that this is so beautiful is that we are then truly dependent on Christ alone to save us...save us individually through Holy Baptism. I don't have to on one hand become Pharisaic because "I did the believing, I did the confessing, etc." in order to be saved, or on the other hand fret that "I didn't believe or confess boldly or sincerely enough" in order to be saved. Our salvation truly becomes 100% God's work through Jesus on the Cross *for us* through Holy Baptism. How beautiful objective, unchanging truth from God is (as opposed to the subjective man-made "truths" we create for ourselves)!

You want Scriptural proof, look at what the Lutheran Confessions say about it. It is God's sweet Gospel, that should never be polluted by making it into a work. You say, "well it sure looks like man's work to me." You fail to understand, if God's Word is still God's Word even though He used human hands, etc. to record it for us, He is able & does do the same thing in His Sacraments (Holy Baptism & Holy Communion) through the human hands of the pastor. It is not the person who's hands administer the water or the water itself, but water *connected with God's own Word* that does the work in Baptism (Ephesians 5:26; Galations 3:26-27; Romans 6:3-4). Therefore it is a work of God for a person, not a person's work.

Furthermore, if you believe in Scripture alone, Christ's own Word in Scripture make the Sacraments into merely an extension of God's Word. How can you then say, "Scripture alone" & then deny Christ's own words of institution (Matt. 28:18-20; John 3; Mark 16:16)?

Answer 7

Matt. 28:19-20 - Jesus commands the apostles to baptize all people "in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit." Many Protestant churches are now teaching that baptism is only a symbolic ritual, and not what actually cleanses us from original sin. This belief contradicts Scripture and the 2,000 year-old teaching of the Church.

Acts 2:38 - Peter commands them to repent and be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ in order to be actually forgiven of sin, not just to partake of a symbolic ritual.

Matt. 28:19-20; Acts 2:38 - there is nothing in these passages or elsewhere in the Bible about baptism being symbolic. There is also nothing about just accepting Jesus as personal Lord and Savior in order to be saved.

Mark 16:16 - Jesus said "He who believes AND is baptized will be saved." Jesus says believing is not enough. Baptism is also required. This is because baptism is salvific, not just symbolic. The Greek text also does not mandate any specific order for belief and baptism, so the verse proves nothing about a “believer’s baptism.”

John 3:3,5 - unless we are "born again" of water and Spirit in baptism, we cannot enter into the kingdom of God. The Greek word for the phrase "born again" is "anothen" which literally means “begotten from above.” See, for example, John 3:31 where "anothen" is so used. Baptism brings about salvation, not just a symbolism of our salvation.

Acts 8:12-13; 36; 10:47 - if belief is all one needs to be saved, why is everyone instantly baptized after learning of Jesus?

Acts 16:15; 31-33; 18:8; 19:2,5 - these texts present more examples of people learning of Jesus, and then immediately being baptized. If accepting Jesus as personal Lord and Savior is all one needs to do to be saved, then why does everyone in the early Church immediately seek baptism?

Acts 9:18 - Paul, even though he was directly chosen by Christ and immediately converted to Christianity, still had to be baptized to be forgiven his sin. This is a powerful text which demonstrates the salvific efficacy of water baptism, even for those who decide to give their lives to Christ.

Acts 22:16 - Ananias tells Paul, "arise and be baptized, and wash away your sins," even though Paul was converted directly by Jesus Christ. This proves that Paul's acceptance of Jesus as personal Lord and Savior was not enough to be forgiven of his sin and saved. The sacrament of baptism is required.

Acts 22:16 - further, Ananias' phrase "wash away" comes from the Greek word "apolouo." "Apolouo" means an actual cleansing which removes sin. It is not a symbolic covering up of sin. Even though Jesus chose Paul directly in a heavenly revelation, Paul had to be baptized to have his sins washed away.

Rom. 6:4 - in baptism, we actually die with Christ so that we, like Him, might be raised to newness of life. This means that, by virtue of our baptism, our sufferings are not in vain. They are joined to Christ and become efficacious for our salvation.

1 Cor. 6:11 - Paul says they were washed, sanctified, and justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, in reference to baptism. The “washing” of baptism gives birth to sanctification and justification, which proves baptism is not just symbolic.

Gal. 3:27 - whoever is baptized in Christ puts on Christ. Putting on Christ is not just symbolic. Christ actually dwells within our soul.

Col. 2:12 - in baptism, we literally die with Christ and are raised with Christ. It is a supernatural reality, not just a symbolic ritual. The Scriptures never refer to baptism as symbolic.