Dragonfly spys...what do you think of these and what about government use against protesters?

Question

and what are their purpose?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/10/08/AR2007100801434.html

http://www.thetartan.org/2007/10/15/forum/dragonfly_spy

http://freepress.org/columns/display/3/2005/1221

someone told me tonight she thinks maybe the purpose is to drop toxic chemicals on the protesters...or do you think it is to spy and identify who is protesting.

Do you feel this is OK?

Answer 1

first of all, I feel it is wrong to generalize and classify protesters as dirty, dope smoking hippies. These spying events took place during antiwar protests.

If one goes to one of these large antiwar protests in Washington and New York as I have (which is where these dragonfly devices were spotted), then one is first struck by the very wide diversity of people protesting..one sees young people, children, middle aged couples and old people of all races and appearances. From wild to very conservatively dressed, one is struck by the many different types of people all united for a common cause..protesting a war they think is ill advised, immoral, and or illegal. If 70% of Americans are against the war, these are not outside the mainstream.

When people answer as some of those above did, they use the tool of stereotyping to discredit or ignore civil rights violations which is the same thing people have done with movements like the black civil rights movements and others.

First of all, it should not matter what the protesters look like..they are Americans exercising a long tradition and history of patriots into an honorable and indeed, vital obligations of citizens of a democracy and country. Speaking up about things they see as being wrong or needing to be addressed in a nonviolent way or through civil disobedience. Also who determines what is "safe and non-safe" freedom of speech and what is "acceptable and unacceptable" speech. In this country, we are supposed to be guaranteed freedom of speech by our constitution regardless of if others disagree with us..trying to say what is OK and what is not is a slippery slope.

It is those who sit silently at home, too apathetic to get involved, who are the non-patriots but they are allowed to be apathetic if they chose..just as protesters have the right to assemble in peaceable protest to get their grievances noticed and heard.

In a true democracy that pulled together, who citizens respected the rights of others, people would care if another citizen's rights are being violated even if they disagree with them. A famous person once said "I may disagree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it. (paraphrased)

In this age of secret spying and loss of civil rights, one should be VERY concerned with the increased spying on our own citizens by the government. The government is supposed to be of, for, and by the people..and the government should be afraid of the people not the other way around. More and more people are beginning to distrust and fear their government.

Here are a few articles on the spying and infiltration of various groups like peace groups some consisting of senior citizens etc http://www.bordc.org/threats/spying-protesters.php This is unacceptable.

I find it alarming when I look at the article such as the dropping of government grade rabbit virus on protesters. I noticed at one I went to near the while house by the Washington monument, a helicopter repeatedly circling the crowd and later saw this very article about the virus being apparently dropped on the protesters below as I was at that rally.

When I later attended another huge antiwar protest with between 30,000 and 50,000 Americans and saw a helicopter repeatedly circling us again, I can guarantee you, my first thoughts were "are they dropping something dangerous on us again?"

The danger is when the country is so wrong and off track that multitudes take to the streets, this is something they may have to fear in the future as more people wake up and so, when they use tactics like these, they can diminish the crowd size.

This is why microwave weapons were developed due to and to be used on US protesters (and others)..they are anticipating huge crowds protesting here as things continue to go wrong and they need a way to protect themselves from hundreds of thousands if not millions of angry people,.

One way they diminish crowd size is by the most common which is totally ignoring the protest and underestimating the crowd size when it is reported by huge numbers. Number two is calling people unpatriotic, un-American, conspiracy theorists and saying they should leave the country.

This type of peer pressure and the embarrassment/shame factor works on some and weeds out those afraid of such things or bothered by them...they do not want to be thought of as hating troops, the country, or as nuts even if it is not true
so they stay home..mission accomplished.

Then there is the fear of knowing you may be put on lists, spied on, phone tapped, and infiltrated..this causes people to be silent in many cases. Knowing about the possibility of them using mace, tear gas, clubs, tasers, and microwave weapons on peaceful protesters and hearing of sick grandmothers beat up by several policeman on for hanging anti-Bush signs about upcoming rallies as happened in Cleveland not long ago also scares people from speaking up..fear is used very effectively in this country.

Also the ruling about anyone declared an enemy noncombatants having no rights of habeas corpus and potentially being taken away with no one knowing where worries some people even if they are quite non threatening.

Yet despite all this, those who see wrong all around and the intense corruption everywhere in politics and do nothing to try to stop it or rectify it or address it, must not only answer to God but to their children, countryman, future generations, other countries looking to us to stand up, and to our own conscience. If we let ourselves be silenced, we may find we lose our freedom and democracy like so many other countries and citizens have witnessed take place.. even onto death for some.. through ignoring signs until it is too late often paying them with their lives and/or loss of liberty..

This surveillance has greatly increased since Bush came into power and it is a dangerous sign of worst to come. One day we will look back and say..why did we do nothing..now it is too late. Those speaking out through grassroots activism including protests are heroes in my book.

One must question the purpose of these dragonfly things..is it to gather intelligence, photograph and record, identify protesters, spread harmful chemicals or intimidate those speaking out and stop these movements..the people in charge fear we will mess up their plan..luckily apathy and unconcern by most people is one their side and us letting them get away with everything from stealing elections to torture to robbing our treasury without a whimper from us..this will cause them to fear nothing...those who are unafraid of TPTB are dangerous and they will be intimidated and used as examples likely. Since they have captured the mainstream media, often people are unaware of some of these things.

Remember the insightful words of Gandhi.."first they ignore you..then we laugh at you, then they fight you and then you win." we are now between being laughed at and fought and the fighting will get worst before it gets better but if we persevere despite risks, we shall overcome." History shows us that but those who say nothing, history shows wind up with true horror happening in many, many cases.

Thank you for letting us know about this and giving me the opportunity to say what I did. I had an activist friend..a women in her 40's---peaceful and kind to all but a leader in the protest movements. I was with her when the crowd left and we went back to protest when police approached her (they did not dare approach when the hundreds were there earlier but waited till there were two middle aged women alone and ..showed her multiple pictures of herself at protests and told her she was on lists like police and highway patrol lists as a "troublemaker"..seeking to scare and intimidate her.

She was not a danger to anyone whatsoever being very peace-loving but a brave and vocal organizer. This made me take note and wonder if I, too, am on some lists for all the political activism I have taken on in the last three years..I applaud those who speak out be they elderly or young, male or female, black, white, yellow, or brown..even if they are from the opposing political side for I recognize if someone else's rights are violated, mine is also in jeopardy.

Answer 2

I don't know but you know anything is possible when it comes to the security of the people. It would all be in the name of security which is fine by me because I want to be protected.It all depends on what someone might be protesting and then I might believe that they can make and have made Dragonfly spys.If their protesting something for a good cause then why not let the people protest in a fair calm way. But if it's for a bad cause then who knows what they might do? I think they might even fly Dragonfly spys around our heads to record what is being said and done.Or better yet implant something in our brains so they can watch our brain activity and learn something new and better. Gosh I just don't buy it. Sorry. God Bless You Janie.

Answer 3

It's already been de-bunked.

Even if the government had that technology (which they are trying to get), they would use it for more useful purposes than spying on a bunch of dope smokin' protestors.

Answer 4

I think its a bunch of hooey. You get a large group of people together that in most cases have only a passing friendship with soap and water. Then wonder why bugs show up. They have to make up some reason other than the clear one that they are funky.