Would Thomas Jefferson agree with the myth that America was founded as "Christian Nation"? Was he unpatriotic?

Question

Thomas Jefferson, author of the Declaration of Independence, and third president of the United States, once wrote

"Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between man and his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legislative powers of government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof," thus building a wall of separation between church and State."

Answer 1

How sad that you write his words and like so many who have taken them out of context and not looked at his life as a whole, misunderstand them.

official actions of Jefferson -
legislative and military chaplains
establishing a national seal using a religious symbol
including the word" God " in our national motto
official days of fasting and prayer at the state level
punishing sabbath breakers
punishing marriages contrary to biblical law punishing irreverent soldiers
protecting the property of churches
requiring oaths saying "so help me God taken on the Bible
granting land to Christian churches to reach the Indians
granting land to Christian schools
Allowing government property and facilities to be used for worship
using the Bible and non denominational religious publications to be used in public schools(He was involved in three different school districts and the plan in each one of these required that the Bible be taught in each our public schools
Allowing clergymen to hold pubic office, and encouraging them to do so
Purchasing religious books to stock public libraries
funding clergy salaries in Indian mission schools
Funding construction of church building for Indians
Exempting churches from taxation
Establishing professional schools of theology( He wanted to bring over from Geneva, Switzerland the entire faculty of Calvin's theological seminary and establish it at the University of Virginia)
Treaties requiring other nations to guarantee religious freedom
including religious speeches and prayers in ceremonies
Doesn't sound like the actions of one who would remove the freedom of worship or "separate church and state." The separation of church and state IS NOT in our Constitution.Thomas Jefferson was not even in the Constitutional convention !

The precepts of philosophy, and of the Hebrew code, laid hold of actions only. He (Jesus) pushed His scrutiniesinto the heart of man; erected His tribunal in the region of his thoughts, and purified the waters at the fountainhead. - Jefferson memoir, vol.!!! page 509 from his "Syllabus of an Estimate of the Merits of the doctrines of Jesus, Compared With Those of Others" sent to Benjamin Rush on April 21st, 1803.

No power over the freedom of religion..is delegated to the United States by the Constitution.Thomas Jefferson; KENTUCKY RESOLUTION, 1798

In matters of religion I have considered that its free exercise is placed by the Constitution independent of the powersof the general [Federal} government. Thomas Jefferson; SECOND INAUGURAL ADDRESS, 1805

Our excellent Constitution...has not placed our religious rightsunder the power of and public functionary. Thomas Jefferson; LETTER TO THE METHODIST EPISCOPAL CHURCH, 1808

I consider the government of the United States as interdicted (prohibited)by the Constitution from intermeddling with religious institutions... or exercises. Thomas Jefferson. LETTER TO SAMUEL MILLER, 1808.

I think its pretty clear, as I once heard it said, "the real Thomas Jefferson is the ACLU's biggest nightmare."

Doesn't it tell you something, that the first Congress of the United States, the very day after they approved the First Amendment, passed an act establishing Chaplains for the Army, Navy , the Senate and the House. Do you think that they didn't understand the Constitution they had just written and approved?The only way that one can come to the conclusion that the Founders of this country intended a purely secular state, where the state is
" neutral" (translate "hostile") to religion is by selective History They base their decisions on a FEW selective passages from our history and ignore the mountain of evidence to the contrary.

James Madison's first draft of the religion clause of the First Amendment is as stated:
" The civil rights of none shall be abridged on account of religious belief of worship, nor shall any national religion be established, nor shall the full and equal rights of Conscience be in any manner, or on any pretext, infringed."
That should make it clear to anyone who want to know the real truth that the Anti Christian society we have in force today is as far from originally intended as possible.It was VERY SIMPLY written because there were numerous Christian denominations and the Founding Fathers wisely built in safeguards so that no one sect could lord over others as the Catholics had in England from which they came.

For example in his Commentaries on the Constitution, Justice Joseph Story explained that because of the First Amendment...
The whole power over the subject of religion is left exclusively to the state governments to be acted upon according to their own sense of justice and State constitutions.
Justice Story also said...
"We are not to attribute this [First Ammendment ]prohibition of a national religious establishment to an indifference to religion in general, and especially to Christianity (which none could hold in more reverance, than the framers of the Constitution)...Probably at the time of the adoption of the Constitution, and of the Amendment to it now under consideration, the general, if not the universal, sentiment in America was that Christianity ought to receive encouragment from the state..."

The words "separation of church and state" are not in our constitution. What gets me is that a phrase (taken completly out of context, by the way, ) from a private letter written by Thomas Jefferson, who WAS NOT EVEN A MEMBER OF THE CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION, has been used to attack Christianity in America for decades.

I recommend the writing of George Bancroft (1800-1891) a historian who's writings precede the edited versions we get today with our Christian history erased and distorted. If you dare look into it you will find that for every quote that says otherwise there are thousands that prove that our nation was founded as a Christian nation. Not a theocracy.

Amongst other strange things said of me, I hear it is said by the Deists that I am one of their number: and. indeed that some good people think I am no Christian. Yhis thought gives me much more painthan the appellation of Troy; because I think religion of infinitely more importance than politics; and I find much cause to reproach myself that I have lived so long and have given no decided and public proofs of my being a Christian. But, indeed, my dear child, this is the character which I prize far above all this world has, or can boast."
PATRICK HENRY, in a letter to his daughter 1796

"America seeks no earthly empire built on blood and force.No ambition, no temptation, lures her to thought of foreign dominions. The legions which she sends forth are armed, not with the sword, but with the cross. The higher state to which she seeks the allegiance of all mankind is not of human, but of divine origin. She cherishes no purpose save to merit the favor of Almighty God."~ Calvin Coolidge, 30th American President

My hope in the One who created us all sustains me: He is a ever present help in trouble...CHRISTOPHER COLUMBUS Book of Prophesies

"Therefore let the king and queen, the princes and their most fortunate kingdoms, and all other countries of Christendom give thanks to our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, who has bestowed upon us so great a victory and gift. Let religious processions be solemnized: let sacred festivals be given: let the churches be covered with festive garlands. Let Christ rejoice on earth, as He rejoices in heaven, when he forsees coming to salvation so many souls of people hitherto lost. "CHRISTOPHER COLUMBUS 1942 Library of Classics

Columbus believed he was living in the last days. He wrote in his Book Of Prophesies: "the Holy Scriptures testify in the Old Testament, by the mouth of the prophets, and in the New Testament, by our Savior Jesus Christ, that this world will come to an end: Matthew, mark, and Luke have recorded the signs of the end of the age... And I say that the sign that convinces me that our Lord is hastening the end of the world is the preaching of the Gospel recently in so many lands.".... ..He not only wanted to open a new trde route, but wanted to bring the Gospel to the ends of the earth. In the words of the WORLD BOOK ENCYCLOPEDIA he wanted to " recapture Jerusalem from the Muslims. There he said he would rebuild the Jews' holy Temple and bring on a new 'Age of the Holy Spirit." He wanted to liberate Christ's holy sepulcher from Muslim ownership back to Christian control. Because of all this, George Grant calls him"tThe last crusader" (One Nation Under God)

"Columbus' use of the Bible is one of the best documented facts of his remarkable career, but it is one of the least known to the general public." August J. King- Moody Monthly- October 1972

" To Columbus, the voyage westward was a way of reaching the Orient, and after Christianizing the Orient, joining forces with Asia to turn back the threat of Islam" JOHN EIDSMORE Columbus & Cortez

1 Chrisropher Columbus was motivated by his Christian faith to make his difficult voyage.
2 The Pilgrims clearly stated that they came to the New World to glorify God and to advance the Christian faith.
3 The Puritans who followed the Pilgrims to New England, created a Bible based commonwealths in order to practice a representative government that was modeled on their church covenants. Their more than 100 governmental covenants and compacts essentially laid the foundation for Americas Constitution, which was drafted in 1787 and ratified in 1789.
4 This nation was founded in large measure as a sanctuary for religious dissidents, seeking asylum from religious pesecution and seeking the opportunity to live in freedom under the laws of God.
5 The education of the settlers and the founders of America was uniquely Christian and Bible based.More than 40% of the signers of the Declaration of Independence had seminary degrees.
6 The Great Awakening, a religious revival, was a key factor in uniting the seperate pre - Revelutionary War colonies and increasing communication among them.
7 Many of the clergy in American colonies "preached liberty" The pulpits of New England were especially important in helping to bring about independence.. Long before the general population understood the threat to American liberty, some colonial ministers saw what was coming and boldly spoke out about it from their pulpits.
8 Biblical Christianity was the driving force behind the men who championed American independence.
9 Christianity played a significant role in the development of our nations birth certificate, the Declaration of Independence.The Declaration of Independence metions God four times.
10 The Biblical understanding of the sinfullness of man was the guiding principle behind the United States Constitution.. The framers of the Constitution drew their inspiration from the Bible. They intended America to be one nation under God.


George Washington
Taken straight from George Washingtons prayer journal..http://www.eadshome.com/WashingtonPrayer...
O most glorious God in Jesus Christ, my merciful and loving father, I acknowledge and confess my guilt, in the weak and imperfect performance of the duties of this day..I have called on Thee for pardon and forgiveness of sins...sounds pretty Christian to me.Unless diests pray to Jesus.Not!

I am always astounded at the amount of partial truths that have been used to rewrite our history and how some statements are taken out of context and used to give a totally false impression of their meanings... for example George Washington's opting out of communion.. It is being used to try and give the impression he was anti communion. Nothing could be further from the truth...He decided at one point that it was not fitting for him to take communion while he was fighting the war against the British and killing soldiers. They use this one instance to make their case. However the truth abut him is that he was the kind of Christian who at one time journeyed a long distance, to the home of a Presbyterian pastor to ask if he could take communion in their church(some churches did not allow others to participate in communion if they did not belong to their church, and he was Anglican and there were no Anglican churches in the town he was at.) Washington did join them in communion and there is a record of this.The very first act of George Washington as president was to bend down and reverently kiss the Bible after being sworn in.He would retire to his library with a candle from 9:00 till 10:00 every evening for prayer and bible study. A fact that is well documentedTher were many times that certain emergencies arose and people would have to seek his attention and would find him on his knees praying before an open bible. Those that knew him closely wrote of him as a devoted Christian.

I hear people say that Lincoln was an atheist...yes he was just as I used to be but I am now Christian.Listen to what Lincoln himself said..."When I was in Springfield I asked the people to pray for me. I was not a Christian. When I buried my son, I was not a christian But when I went to Gettysburg and saw the graves of thousands of our soldiers, I then and there consecrated myself to Christ. Yes I do love Jesus." Those are Lincolns own words. No one can tell me he was an atheist no more than they can tell me that I am one now, even though I was one in the past. If you read my letters before 1981 I would seem to be an atheist.

By the way, James Madison's first draft of the religion clause of the First Amendment is as stated:
" The civil rights of none shall be abridged on account of religious belief of worship, nor shall any national religion be established, nor shall the full and equal rights of Conscience be in any manner, or on any pretext, infringed."
That should make it clear to anyone who want to know the real truth that the Anti Christian society we have in force today is as far from originally intended as possible.It was VERY SIMPLY written because there were numerous Christian denominations and the Founding Fathers wisely built in safeguards so that no one sect could lord over others as the Catholics had in England from which they came.

Take a walk around our nation's capitol.View the monuments such as The Lincoln and Jefferson Memorials. You cannot read them without reading the word "God" carved in stone somewhere.Religious paintings grace the Halls of our government buildings in glorious testament to the value our Founding Fathers placed on religion.

The Northwest Ordinance is one of the principle documents in the history of the founding of America...it states: "Religion, morality and knowledge being essential to good government and the happiness of mankind, schools and the means of education shall forever be encouraged."
Here we see why the Bible used as text books in our schools, and our Univerities teaching Theology was no misunderstanding of the Constitution.

John Quincy adams, our sixth president, said," The highest glory of the American Revolution was this; it connected in one indissoluble bond, the principles of civil government with the principles of Christianity." (Quoted from The Christian History Of The United States Verna M. Hall 1966)


John Adams proposed that when Americas future citizens celebrated The Declaration of Independence, they should have religious services to thank God for what He had brought about. President Adams said Independence Day should" be celebrated by succeeding generations as the great anniversary festival, commemorated as the day of deliverance, by solemn acts of devotion to God Almighty, from one end of the continent to the other, from this time forward and forevermore."

John Adams wrote and distributed a book for 10 year olds that was to teach them how to read the Bible while he was in office.

John Adams warned his countrymen:
We have no government armed with power capable of controlling with human passions, unbridled by morality and religion. Avarice, ambition, revenge, or gallantry, would break the strong cords of our Constitution as a whale goes through a net. Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholy in adequate to the government of any other.

The vast majority of delegates who attended the Constitutional Convention were professing Christians. Only Ben Franklin and James Wilson of Pennsylvania were known to be Deists.

Ben Franklins speech at the Constitutional Convention:
Mr. President. The small progress we have made after four or five weeks close attendance and continual reasoning with each other - our different sentiments on almost every question, several of the last producing as many noes as ayes, is me thinks a meloncholy proof of the imperfection of the human understanding.
We indeed seem to feel our own want of political wisdom, since we have been running about in search of it. We have gone back to ancient history for models of government, and examined the different forms of those republics which, have been formed with the seeds of their own dissolution, now no longer exist.And we have viewed modern states all around Europe, but find none of their Constitutions suitable to our circumstances.
In this situation of this assembly, groping as it were in the dark, to find political truth and scarce able to distinguish it when presented to us, how has it happened, Sir, that we have not hitherto once thought of humbly applying to the Father of lights to illuminate our understanding?
In the beginning of the contes with Great Britan, when we were sensible of danger, we had daily prayer in this room for Divine protection - Our prayers,Sir, were heard & they were graciously answered. All of us who were engaged in the struggle must have observed frequent instances of a superintending Providence in our favor.
To that kind of Providence we owe this happy opportunity of consulting in peace on the means of establishing our future national felicity.And have we now forgotten that powerful Friend?Or do we imagine that we no longer need His assistance?
I have lived, Sir, a long time, and the longer I live, the more convincing proofs I see of this truth - that God governs in the affairs of men.And if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground without His notice , it is probable that an empire can rise without His aid?
We have been assured, Sir, in the Sacred Writings, that "except the Lord build the house, they labor in vain that build it"(Psalm 127:1) I firmly believe this; I also believe that without His concurring aid we shall succeed in this political building no better than the Builders of Babel: we shall be divided by our partial local interests: our projects will be confounded, and we ourselves shall become a reproach and bye word down to future ages.
And what is worse, mankind may hereafter from this unfortunate instance, despair of establishing Governments by human wisdom, and leave it to chance, war and conquest.
I therefor beg leave to move - that henceforth prayers imploring the assistance of heaven, and it's blessings on our deliberations, be held in this assembly every morning before we proceed to business, and that one or more of the clergy of this city be requested to officiate in that service."

Here was probably the least religious of the Founding Fathers calling for prayer and quoting scripture
Congress has opened every session with prayer from the first (September1774)to the most recent.

I guess the Framers of the Constitution didn't understand what they had just written. That is the only way that you can justify the actions that they took that would clearly go against any "separation of church and state. No ten points for me and I don't care, I cannot stand this lie and it is a lie!

Answer 2

Thomas Jefferson would not say we were founded as a Christian nation. We were a nation founded by many Christians based on Christian principles. There were several deists involved in the signing of the Constitution, but it was not popular for a politician to admit not being a Christian then. He wasn't unpatriotic- just living out his beliefs. But Americans try to rewrite history when they try to push Christianity out of the picture. If we look at the Christian symbolism found all through our culture- the fact that freedom of religion was at the top of the list, the fact that Congress HIRED a chaplain to start every session of Congress with prayer, the 10 Commandments being posted in our courtrooms as a basis for law, the first Universities all being started as seminaries to train ministers, "In God we Trust" being put on our money- we have to realize that our founding fathers intended for our country to have an overall faith in God. As Christians, they set up the country based on biblical principles. It is truly a shame that we now try to erase those principles by removing God from our culture. Our forefathers would be horrified if they knew what has happened to America. This was never their intent.

Answer 3

It's not a myth and Thomas Jefferson was, perhaps, THE most patriotic of all of the founding fathers. He's the one that did the most homework and persuaded the others to follow his lead.

If you study ALL of Thomas Jefferson's writings you'll find that he had a profound confidence in all American citizens believing they had an innate ability to gather information, discern the truth, and make the right decisions to choose a good representative government and, therefore, govern themselves all based on an essentially CHRISTIAN morality.

Please stop twisting things around. Without some kind of morality based government, we would be lost... in fact, we're rapidly becoming so, thanks to mindsets such as yours.

Answer 4

Most of our founders seemed to believe that Christianity and reasonability went hand-in-hand. This traces all the way back to Aristotle's rhetorical logos, or argument from reason. The logos was considered to be the divine, spoken word, hence the typical translation of John 1:1: "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." Philo of Alexandria, one of Jesus' contemporaries, taught that the Logos was the image of God. Paul, on the other hand, taught that Christ was the image of God. So long story short, Logos became an official title for Christ in early Christian theology. If you think there's a conflict between Christianity and reason, early Christian theology proves that reason has always been one of the primary concerns of the faith.

Answer 5

It's clear Jefferson was a believer in Jesus and God but had a low opinion of organized religion and the clergy who he saw as perverting the true message of Christ. The fact that the Constitution of the United States is devoid of any religious preference is the true gage of the sentiments of the founders.

If you want support for your religion go to church - don't look to the government of the united States.

Answer 6

Christian values have indeed shaped many of the laws and traditions of this country because we vote and push forward those things we value the most and the majority of those people in the early years of this country were christian.

The Constitution was a mix of soo many different concepts. It wasnt drafted overnight. They did pray before every meeting when drafting it. God given rights were most definetly one of the concepts that made its way into the constititution. A lot of it was based on the British system and things they didnt like about the British system. Masonic concpets of equality and hard work paying off was also a part of the drafting of the Constitution.

But you cant ignore who the voters and the people were that voted on this Constitution then voted on the laws and the voted in the people that would then continue to shape this country at its foundation. The founding fathers were not the only ones that founded this nation. Pioneers, inventors, economists, capitalists, poets, etc all contributed to the foundation of this country. Most of them were christian because most of the country was christian. So you have to acknowledge that the core basic values that the early people of this country voted on were indeed their concept of christian values.


Keep in mind that the Constitution wasnt the first gvt drafted. The articles of confederation were.

Answer 7

It was founded by Christians on Christian principles... sorry! Can't change that and you enjoy the benefits (whether you choose to acknowledge it or not).
Jefferson was a deist - believed there was a greater being. Read the writings of Washington, Madison, Adams, and 90% of the signers of the Constitution - all strong believing Christians.
Do some studying and check for yourself.

Answer 8

Although Thomas Jefferson was a Christian He did not believe in the divinity of Christ and he firmly believed in a secular government like most of the fore fathers who were escaping religious persecution . People have a tendency to distort this especially when overriding the constitution . Otherwise we would have a monarchy of Christianity not unlike the Muslim monarchies have for Islam.

Answer 9

they won't believe it ...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Jefferson#Religious_views

http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Thomas_Jefferson#On_religious_matters

"Christianity neither is, nor ever was, a part of the common law. "

"I am for freedom of religion, & against all maneuvres to bring about a legal ascendancy of one sect over another."

"History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people maintaining a free civil government. This marks the lowest grade of ignorance of which their civil as well as religious leaders will always avail themselves for their own purposes."

Etc

THAT Jefferson. The same Jefferson who contributed to the Godless Constitution (this country is governed by the Constitution, NOT the Declaration of Independence).

The phrasing in the letter to the Danbury Baptists was sufficient for the Supreme Court in interpreting the Establishment clause.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Separation_of_church_and_state_in_the_United_States#_note-0

http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/church-state/decisions.html

To deny that the man opposed theocracy is the most treasonous thing any uninformed buffoon on this forum could do.

Answer 10

People emigrated to America for many freedoms. Freedom of religion was one of them. Many of them were Christians, but did the founding fathers write a "Cristian" constitution? No, because that's what they had to put up with in England, and they hated it (referring to having someone else tell you what to believe).

America was founded on the belief that nobody should have to put his/her brain in a cage, just because "some great person said so."

Answer 11

No, this was meant to protect the people's right to believe in and express whatever religion they want. Thomas Jefferson thought this was an essential right for any human.