Athiests, how can you believe that we came from nothing?

Question

I'm not trying to bash by asking this question, and I don't pretend to know everything about athiesm, but I am genuinely curious. Do you believe that we all came from nothing, or from a single cell? Where did all that come from? Believe me, I ask the same questions to Thiests (being that I'm Agnostic) (as in where did their God/gods come from)? I really wish I could be more than a "middle-of-the-roader" but how can you be absolutely, 100% sure that there isn't a higher power of some sort...of any sort? Thanks for reading and answering! Please be nice to others in your answers.

Windom Earle: Thank you for reading the ENTIRE question. Seriously, I can't believe how rude people can get on here. They got their 2+ points, so what are they complaining.

Answer 1

Apparently nobody read the fact that you're agnostic.

I don't believe that we came from nothing. I'm not sure if you're referring to the first living cell or the beginning of the universe, but in either case things already existed.

If you are referring to the first living cell, there are various theories of abiogenesis although none has yet gained acceptance by scientific consensus. You can find them through any search engine.

Also, I'm not 100% sure that there's no higher power. However, based on all available evidence I believe that God does not exist. The idea of God seems like an unnecessary component of the universe to me. I could be wrong, but I suspect that I'm right.

Answer 2

As to agnostism, my friend, technically that means you believe in a god or gods, but claim that we cannot know anything about said god or gods. You should not be questioning where God came from, since you believe he exists, just asking why anyone thinks they know anything about Him. The immensely complex and perfectly designed universe actually tells us quite a bit about God, that there is a design and a designer, and all designers leave their mark on their design, by which we can know something of them. (And they leave a manual) A true Atheist technically believes in nothing beyond the physical. Most I have spoken with also profess belief in past lives, reincarnation, psychics, etc., which is contradictory.

Everyone who "believes" in evolution and the big bang don't realize they have a belief system. They "think" evolution is a fact, though it is called a theory for a reason. They "think" the big bang is a fact, though it is also called a theory for a reason. Scientists cannot prove it, so it is a theory. In fact, not a single proof of evolution exists, and not a single occurance of evolution can be factually cited. Some evolutionists have stated that evolution "stopped" 100,000 years ago. Why would it do that? Was everything at its perfect point of redesigning itself, or was it already pre-designed? It is a very convenient theory to brush aside the fact that there are no current evolutionary evidences. In fact, scientists have been working vary hard at creating an evolutionary change in fruit flies, working now on over 100,000 generations, yet with both inherent and induced mutations, including genetic injections, not a single basic change "up" can be cited, only changes "down" which are always detrimental to the individual, and never passed on to their progeny. 100,000 generations of man would be 2,000,000 years. Scientists cannot even prove the planet has been here that long.

(Consider the amount of dust expected to be on the moon... Issac Asimov (not just a scifi writer, but a very gifted scientist) thought the moon mission would end with the astronauts buried in 20' of dust due to the 2,000,000 + years of accumulation. There was 2". Ever notice the ladder on the Eagle lunar module stopped 4' above the landing pad? A dangerous jump in a very fragile space suit.

And, the moon has been moving AWAY from the earth at a recordable rate (about 1.5" per year now and more earlier), so 20,000 years ago, the high tide would have been over a mile high, basically scrubbing the majority of the earth clean, twice a day!)


You don't have to be a deist to understand the facts. Being a deist simply becomes more obvious once you've considered the facts.

Answer 3

i can't be sure that there isn't a "higher power". i don't even know what that means exactly, but i don't know of any evidence to suggest that such a thing exists. of course, i don't pretend to know about all relevant evidence either.

i can understand if you're skeptical of the claim that we all came from nothing, i don't believe that either. this view seems to imply that 'nothing' has a kind of existence, which doesn't make sense to me. existence is a mystery, which big bang cosmology hasn't got near solving, although it does account pretty well for the various things that exist in the universe, if you see the difference. mind you i don't think that attributing existence to god solves the problem either, it seems to be nothing more than calling it by a different name.

i'm not so sure what the big deal is about the single cell though - cells have all the capabilities required: metabolism, reproduction, autonomy, evolvability... of course there is a vast gulf in between a single cell and modern life on earth, but there seems to me to be no reason to suppose that anything else was involved but natural processes and vast amounts of time. it is less certain how the original cell formed and in what order its properties emerged, but again there seems to be nothing going on that requires a "miracle": the properties of the cell appear to be due to fundamentally physical and chemical processes (although very complicated, and not entirely understood), and presumably originated from the operation of physical and chemical laws. it is only a problem if you think that the cell had to spring into existence all at once.

Answer 4

150 years ago, we didn't know about bacteria. No clue. It wasn't understood until Louis Pasteur determined that germs caused disease.

You are asking the same questions that scientists ask. You have, however, asked this in the Religion & Spirituality section, where we are mostly humanities majors, not biologists or physicists. Would you come to R&S to find out what opus number was Mozart's 40th Symphony? I think not. You're asking us to play to our weakness. Quite frankly, you're being unfair.

So let me suggest two things:

1. If you are serious about wanting to know the current evidence-based understanding on the origins of the universe and on evolutionary theory, there are excellent descriptions found at http://www.talkorigins.org .

2. Consider that you are proposing (not so subtly) that anything that is not explained is a place for God to be discovered. This is commonly referred to in ontology as "the god of the gaps" theory. It typically assigns God to any blank space that science has not yet reached useful conclusions. Remember what I said about disease? Before bacteria were discovered, it was assumed God was punishing the ill, or that they were demon possessed, or some other supernatural phenomenon caused sickness. This is the same god of the gaps.

Science never assumes, and should never assume, anything is supernatural. The purpose of science is to discover through measured observation, testing, and repetition what natural causes lead to our natural world. If you impose a statement "God caused it," then this stops the search for knowledge, because God is ultimately unknowable. This is the reason that the "god of the gaps" theory is discounted among learned ontological academicians, and is ignored by science.

Answer 5

How can anyone believe in nothing? An invisible man in the sky? There is no evidence, no facts, basically there is no vailidity.

Each Atheist has come to their own conclusions regarding a deity. Mine was through studies of religions, r. text, history, sociology, & science. All I can suggest is studies. I was raised a xian & when I started my studies I was xian & within 2yrs of studies I became an Agnostic. Now I am an Atheist & have been for about 9yrs. No one can tell what you believe or feel. Have open eyes & study or try documentries. It was an interesting & amazing journey to my destination of Atheism. I urge more ppl to try it, it is an intelligent way to find your truth, be it religious or not.

Some that have studied became devout xians, but at least they chose to educate themselves on one of the most personal & important subjects of their lives. You may also end up right where you are, an Agnostic. Which is great, as long as you know the facts & made an honest, intelligent decision. Good luck!

Answer 6

There are so many religions and a lot of them have different views of how life began. The point is, how are we supposed to know which one (if any) is true? I'm an atheist. I think that it's just coincidence that Christianity began the norm in western society and think it could just have easily been some other religion. Christianity was just spread so much during the Renaissance I think it was? But anyways.. I'm not a scientist so I don't know everything about the theories of how the world began. I think it's something like there was all this energy and everything started reacting and then there was the big boom and the universe started expanding. To me, this makes more sense. They have proof that even today the universe is expanding. I also support the theory of evolution. Basically (not to offend) but I find it a lot easier to believe modern scientists than whoever wrote the bible thousands of years ago.

Answer 7

While I am not an atheist, I used to be one. A very strong one I might add. So I feel qualified to weigh in on this question.

First of all, nobody can be 100% sure of ANY position. One can only feel convinced beyond a reasonable doubt if one feels they have looked at a preponderance of evidence.

I myself, after apprx 2 years of evaluating "evidence" pro and con became reasonably convinced that the christian position is the only credible one. I'm not going to go into all that here because then I would have to write a book. (And there are already excellent books on the christian position. Its too bad that sceptics never seem to read them. At least I've never met one who has)

I would like to comment on several statments in a couple of the answers that I believe to be erroneous.

1) One answerer stated that "there has always been energy, and there always would be" (paraphrased)

Not true. The universe is "running down". Losing energy. This is called Entrophy. (The Second Law of Thermodynamics still stands today) There will come a point in the future when ALL energy has been dissapated. That point is called Absolute Zero. That will be the end of the universe.

What this means is; The universe is NOT eternal. What has an end, also has to have had a beginning.

Which leaves the question; Where did the original material come from?

4 possibilitys only.

1) Spontaneously emerged from nothing by itself.
Objection; Violates all known laws of science. "From nothing, nothing can come.

2) Always been there.
Objection: That would mean its eternal. (objection stated above)

3) Doesnt exist. Its just an illusion.
Objection: Nobody really believes this, but this idea has been put forth. (If this appeals to you. good luck with it. lol)

4) Created by a Power independent and outside of itself.
(Call it "X" or "God")
Objection; Who made God?

Now, my money is on the fourth possibility.

As to "Who made God?, this question ONLY has validity if God Himself exists in the "Time/Space" continuium.

Remember, If God exists independent of time and space, then the question of His COMING into existence IN the time/space continuium is invalid. (or as I like to say, a "non-question" on the order of "what shape is yellow".

In the biblical explanation, God simply IS. (no time, no space, just Ultimate Reality.

Which to me is the only LOGICAL explanation. He is simply too REAL to have a "beginning" or an "end".

One other point; (credit to the late Walter Martin)

If a person appears before God (say, at the judgement) and gives Him the argument, "Well, I didnt believe in you because I can regress beyond you and reason that someone MUST have made you", then God could reasonably answer back, "Listen buster, it doesnt make any difference who made ME. The only thing that makes any difference is; I made YOU. Now why didnt you do what I told you to do?"

As Mr. Martin points out; Where are you going to go from there? After all, If He's God, and He made the very brain that you are questioning Him with, then its no more possible for you to be "right" and Him to be "wrong" than it is for an infant to be heavyweight champion of the world.

The fact that you FIND yourself standing in front of Him at the judgement shows that your whole reasoning process was wrong. (But of course, that has more to do with "sin in the heart" than with your reasoning process. Most folks dont disbelieve in Him because of real logical reasons, as much as they simply do not want ANYONE telling them what they should do.)

Well, thats some of my thoughts on the subject. Take it for what its worth. I find that its not really sensible arguments or reasons that keep people from believing in Him or His Son.

Frankly, Its just plain Sin.


....theBerean

Answer 8

Just look up 'Abiogenesis' on somewhere like Wikipedia.

In a nutshell, the chemicals of which we're composed are a particular type that have a tendency to self-assemble, and it's possible to duplicate this in a lab in a matter of days.

That process went on in pools on the early earth for hundreds of millions of years. The result was an ocean of biochemicals.

You can read about this here:
http://www.pandasthumb.org/archives/2007/04/primordial_soup.html

CD

Answer 9

something you do not comprehend defies understanding. Then when you're fortunate you paintings flat out and comprehend it. Athiests do not trust. it quite is the point of athiesm. If biogenisis is reproduced in a laboratory, and the attempt is repeated, you've your answer to no matter if it truly is achieveable. Does faith favor to take that wager?

Answer 10

Well I am not sure what you mean by nothing. I believe that we did in fact evolve and share a common ancestor with apes but I do not believe that this god that people talk about simply "POOF" we were created from mud. Because this kind of thinking lack creditable evidence and simply wants people to have blind faith. Blind faith is a bad things, history has shown us this.