JWs: Does the fact that God the Father and Christ can fill all things mean that they are not persons?

Question

JW = Jehovah's Witnesses

If you answered No :

Then why does the Watchtower Society argue that the Holy Spirit cannot be a person simply because the Spirit fills numerous people?

Answer 1

Christ’s divinity is shown over and over again in the New Testament. For example, in John 5:18 we are told that Jesus’ opponents sought to kill him because he "called God his Father, making himself equal with God."

In John 8:58, when quizzed about how he has special knowledge of Abraham, Jesus replies, "Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I Am"—invoking and applying to himself the personal name of God—"I Am" (Ex. 3:14). His audience understood exactly what he was claiming about himself. "So they took up stones to throw at him; but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple" (John 8:59).

In John 20:28, Thomas falls at Jesus’ feet, exclaiming, "My Lord and my God!" (Greek: Ho Kurios mou kai ho Theos mou—literally, "The Lord of me and the God of me!")

In Philippians 2:6, Paul tells us that Christ Jesus "[w]ho, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be grasped" (New International Version). So Jesus chose to be born in humble, human form though he could have simply remained in equal glory with the Father for he was "in very nature God."

Also significant are passages that apply the title "the First and the Last" to Jesus. This is one of the Old Testament titles of Yahweh: "Thus says Yahweh, the King of Israel and his Redeemer, Yahweh of armies: ‘I am the First and I am the Last; besides me there is no god’" (Is. 44:6; cf. 41:4, 48:12).

This title is directly applied to Jesus three times in the book of Revelation: "When I saw him [Christ], I fell at his feet as though dead. But he laid his right hand upon me, saying, ‘Fear not, I am the First and the Last’" (Rev. 1:17). "And to the angel of the church in Smyrna write: ‘The words of the First and the Last, who died and came to life’" (Rev. 2:8). "Behold, I am coming soon, bringing my recompense, to repay every one for what he has done. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the beginning and the end" (Rev. 22:12–13).

This last quote is especially significant since it applies to Jesus the parallel title "the Alpha and the Omega," which Revelation earlier applied to the Lord God: "‘I am the Alpha and the Omega,’ says the Lord God, who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty" (Rev. 1:8).

Answer 2

Actually, there is absolutely no scripture that says Jehovah or hIs son Jesus FILL anything. Time and again there are scriptures that show God using or sending his holy spirit. The only thing described as being poured out is his spirit ... an example of which is when it was poured out and filled the group of 120 disciples in Jerusalem. (Acts 2:2,3)

Thank you for the question.

Answer 3

What is the holy spirit?

A comparison of Bible texts that refer to the holy spirit shows that it is spoken of as ‘filling’ people; they can be ‘baptized’ with it; and they can be “anointed” with it. (Luke 1:41; Matt. 3:11; Acts 10:38) None of these expressions would be appropriate if the holy spirit were a person.

Jesus also referred to the holy spirit as a “helper” (Greek, pa·ra′kle·tos), and he said that this helper would “teach,” “bear witness,” “speak,” and ‘hear.’ (John 14:16, 17, 26; 15:26; 16:13) It is not unusual in the Scriptures for something to be personified. For example, wisdom is said to have “children.” (Luke 7:35) Sin and death are spoken of as being kings. (Rom. 5:14, 21) While some texts say that the spirit “spoke,” other passages make clear that this was done through angels or humans. (Acts 4:24, 25; 28:25; Matt. 10:19, 20; compare Acts 20:23 with 21:10, 11.) At 1 John 5:6-8, not only the spirit but also “the water and the blood” are said to ‘bear witness.’ So, none of the expressions found in these texts in themselves prove that the holy spirit is a person.

The correct identification of the holy spirit must fit all the scriptures that refer to that spirit. With this viewpoint, it is logical to conclude that the holy spirit is the active force of God. It is not a person but is a powerful force that God causes to emanate from himself to accomplish his holy will.—Ps. 104:30; 2 Pet. 1:21; Acts 4:31.

What gives evidence that a person really has the holy spirit, or “the Holy Ghost” (KJ)?

Luke 4:18, 31-35: “[Jesus read from the scroll of the prophet Isaiah:] ‘Jehovah’s spirit is upon me, because he anointed me to declare good news’ . . . And he went down to Capernaum, a city of Galilee. And he was teaching them on the sabbath; and they were astounded at his way of teaching, because his speech was with authority. Now in the synagogue there was a man with a spirit, an unclean demon, and he shouted with a loud voice . . . But Jesus rebuked it, saying: ‘Be silent, and come out of him.’ So, after throwing the man down in their midst, the demon came out of him without hurting him.” (What gave evidence that Jesus had God’s spirit? The account does not say that he trembled or shouted or moved about in a fervor. Rather, it says he spoke with authority. It is noteworthy, however, that on that occasion a demonic spirit did move a man to shout and fall onto the floor.)

Acts 1:8 says that when Jesus’ followers received holy spirit they would be witnesses about him. According to Acts 2:1-11, when they did receive that spirit, observers were impressed by the fact that, although the ones speaking were all Galileans, they were speaking about the magnificent things of God in languages that were familiar to the many foreigners who were present. But the record does not say that there were any emotional outbursts on the part of those who received the spirit.

It is noteworthy that when Elizabeth received the holy spirit and then gave voice to “a loud cry” she was not in a meeting for worship but was greeting a visiting relative. (Luke 1:41, 42) When, as reported at Acts 4:31, holy spirit came upon an assembly of disciples, the place was shaken, but the effect of that spirit on the disciples was, not that they trembled or rolled about, but that they ‘spoke the word of God with boldness.’ Likewise today, boldness in speaking the word of God, zealously engaging in the work of witnessing—these are what give evidence that a person has holy spirit.

Gal. 5:22, 23: “The fruitage of the spirit is love, joy, peace, long-suffering, kindness, goodness, faith, mildness, self-control.” (It is this fruitage, rather than outbursts of religious fervor, that one should look for when seeking to find people who truly have God’s spirit.)

Answer 4

The premise of the question is false. Neither Jehovah God nor Jesus Christ are ever described in the bible as "filling" a person. God and Christ are each a person, and persons do not fill other persons.

By contrast, the Scriptures clearly teach that the Holy Spirit is NOT a person, but an impersonal thing or quality. Here are two obvious lines of reasoning...

1. People are NOT filled with other people; they are filled with impersonal QUALITIES:
(Luke 1:41) Elizabeth was filled with holy spirit
(Luke 2:40) filled with wisdom
(Luke 4:28) became filled with anger
(Luke 5:26) they became filled with fear
(Luke 6:11) they became filled with madness
(Acts 3:10) they became filled with astonishment
(Acts 5:17) Sadducees, rose and became filled with jealousy
(Acts 19:29) the city became filled with confusion

2. Logical connections
Here the impersonal thing Holy Spirit is connected with the impersonal thing "power":
(Acts 10:38) God anointed him with holy spirit and power

Here the impersonal thing Holy Spirit is connected with the impersonal thing "joy":
(Acts 13:52) the disciples continued to be filled with joy and holy spirit

The Scriptures apply anthroporphic qualities to many impersonal things. Trinitarians are required to believe that the Holy Spirit is a person, but literally *ALL* of their so-called "proofs" that the Holy Spirit is a person fail in the light of the entire bible. Here are lines of reasoning that expose the unscripturality of the arguments which pretend that the Holy Spirit is a person.


Comparing these two Scriptures (which describe the identical event) helps explain that the Holy Spirit can be thought of as "God's finger".
(Luke 11:20) If it is by means of God's finger I expel the demons, the kingdom of God has really overtaken YOU. . .
(Matthew 12:28) If it is by means of God’s spirit that I expel the demons, the kingdom of God has really overtaken YOU.

Can a person's finger be "hurt" (or "grieved")? Obviously.
(Isaiah 63:10) They themselves rebelled and made his holy spirit [or "God's finger"] feel hurt
(Ephesians 4:30) Also, do not be grieving God's holy spirit [or "God's finger"]


The Scriptures often personify impersonal things or qualities:
(Luke 7:35) wisdom is proved righteous by all its children
(Romans 5:14) death ruled as king
(Romans 5:21) sin ruled as king

Referring to the "mind" or governing principles of an inanimate thing does not make it a person; neither does referring to a thing's "heart" or core make it a person:
(Matthew 12:40) the heart of the earth
(Exodus 15:8) the heart of the sea
(2 Samuel 18:14) the heart of the big tree
(Deuteronomy 4:11, footnote) the heart of the heavens

The Scriptures clarify that actual PERSONS spoke ON BEHALF OF the Holy Spirit:
(Acts 4:25) holy spirit said by the mouth of our forefather David...
(Acts 28:25) The holy spirit aptly spoke through Isaiah the prophet
(Matthew 10:20) it is the spirit of your Father that speaks by you

Other nonpersons 'testify' or 'bear witness':
(1 John 5:7,8) there are three witness bearers, the spirit and the water and the blood

Arguments pretending that a person can "fill" another person are based on pagan witchcraft and Babylonish mysticism. The Scriptures consistently show that only nonpersonal qualities can "fill" a person. Jehovah's Witnesses are unlikely to trade their Scriptural true worship for witchcraft and Trinitarian false worship; apostasy such as trinitarianism was foretold in the bible.

(2 Thessalonians 2:1-3) We request of you not to be quickly shaken from your reason... the apostasy comes first and the man of lawlessness gets revealed

(2 Peter 2:1) there will also be false teachers among you. These very ones will quietly bring in destructive sects


Finally, if trinitarians are true Christians, why do they ignore Christ's command that each Christian must preach?

(2 Timothy 4:3-5) For there will be a period of time when they will not put up with the healthful teaching, but, in accord with their own desires, they will accumulate teachers for themselves to have their ears tickled; and they will turn their ears away from the truth, whereas they will be turned aside to false stories. You, though, keep your senses in all things, suffer evil, do the work of an evangelizer, fully accomplish your ministry.

(Matthew 28:19,20) Go therefore and make disciples of people of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the holy spirit, teaching them to observe all the things I have commanded

Learn more:
http://watchtower.co.uk/e/ti/article_07.htm
http://watchtower.co.uk/e/ti/article_08.htm
http://watchtower.co.uk/e/ti/
http://watchtower.co.uk/e/20020515/
http://watchtower.co.uk/e/20050422/article_02.htm

Answer 5

Jesus calle dthe Holy Spirit a "HE" in John 14. Peter says in Acts 5 to Ananias,"You have lied to the Holy Spirit...you have not lied to man but to God".
Sounds like a separate personality to me!
1x1x1= One God in 3 persons.

Answer 6

God is the Father of all Kingdoms,,,,,Christ is only Son...both Spirits Watchtower is Brain watch Magazine that comes from Information out of Encyclopedias

Answer 7

Of course they're not people. The bible says God created people in his image, not that God is a person. There's a difference. I think being "in his image" means we have the ability to know good and evil and make our own choices (ie. free will).

Answer 8

JW is a cult.