For all that believe the Father & Son are not ONE or believe that Jesus is not God, would you be willing to?

Question

quote Revelation 22:3-4 from your Scriptures.

Thanks for the input!!

Sandra P.

Answer 1

The bible plainly teaches that Jehovah the Father and Jesus the Son are one, as John 10:30 notes "I and the Father are one.” Yet, trinitarians who pretend that verse has anything to do with trinitarianism apparently ignore John 17:11,21. Here is that latter passage from several popular bibles, offered without additional comment.


New American Standard Bible (©1995)
Holy Father, keep them in Your name, the name which You have given Me, that they may be one even as We are. ...that they may all be one; even as You, Father, are in Me and I in You, that they also may be in Us, so that the world may believe that You sent Me.

GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995)
Holy Father, keep them safe by the power of your name, the name that you gave me, so that their unity may be like ours. ...I pray that all of these people continue to have unity in the way that you, Father, are in me and I am in you. I pray that they may be united with us so that the world will believe that you have sent me.

King James Bible
Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are. ...That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

American Standard Version
Holy Father, keep them in thy name which thou hast given me, that they may be one, even as we are ...that they may all be one; even as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be in us: that the world may believe that thou didst send me.

Bible in Basic English
Holy Father, keep them in your name which you have given to me, so that they may be one even as we are one. ...May they all be one! Even as you, Father, are in me and I am in you, so let them be in us, so that all men may come to have faith that you sent me.

Douay-Rheims Bible
Holy Father, keep them in thy name whom thou has given me; that they may be one, as we also are. ...That they all may be one, as thou, Father, in me, and I in thee; that they also may be one in us; that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

Darby Bible Translation
Holy Father, keep them in thy name which thou hast given me, that they may be one as we. ...that they may be all one, as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us, that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

English Revised Version
Holy Father, keep them in thy name which thou hast given me, that they may be one, even as we are. ...that they may all be one; even as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be in us: that the world may believe that thou didst send me.

Tyndale New Testament
Wholly father keep in thine own name them which thou hast given me, that they may be one as we are. ...that they all may be one, as thou father art in me, and I in thee, that they may be also one in us, that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

Weymouth New Testament
"Holy Father, keep them true to Thy name--the name which Thou hast given me to bear--that they may be one, even as we are. ...that they may all be one, even as Thou art in me, O Father, and I am in Thee; that they also may be in us; that the world may believe that Thou didst send me.

Webster's Bible Translation
Holy Father, keep through thy own name those whom thou hast given to me, that they may be one, as we are. ...That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

World English Bible
Holy Father, keep them through your name which you have given me, that they may be one, even as we are. ...that they may all be one; even as you, Father, are in me, and I in you, that they also may be one in us; that the world may believe that you sent me.

Young's Literal Translation
Holy Father, keep them in Thy name, whom Thou hast given to me, that they may be one as we; ...that they all may be one, as Thou Father art in me, and I in Thee; that they also in us may be one, that the world may believe that Thou didst send me.

New World Translation
Holy Father, watch over them on account of your own name which you have given me, in order that they may be one just as we are. ...in order that they may all be one, just as you, Father, are in union with me and I am in union with you, that they also may be in union with us, in order that the world may believe that you sent me forth.

Learn more:
http://watchtower.org/e/ti/index.htm?article=article_08.htm

Answer 2

3 And no more will there be any curse. But the throne of God and of the Lamb will be in [the city], and his slaves will render him sacred service; 4 and they will see his face, and his name will be on their foreheads.
That was Revelation 22:3-4 from my bible(new world translation of the holy scripture). I kinda don't understand what it has to do with your question.
Jesus(the Son) said he did not speak from his own originality. He proved himself that he is separate from his Father(God). Plus, Jesus is a kind of god but not the God.
Hope that helps! :-)

Answer 3

Jewlicious, could you please elaborate on those messianic requirements, with scriptural reference?

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So, Jana M, by your set of requirements, it sounds to me like your messiah didn't come, and will actually NEVER come. So what are you waiting for? Are you absolutely SURE you interpreted those prophecies correctly? How do you account for Jesus' well-documented miracles? Most Christians, on the day before passover, yawn and say "ho-hum" when Isaiah chpater 53 is read, thinking that it's an after the fact commentary on the passion of the Christ, because it's so specific. They forget to remember that it was written 700 years before Jesus.

Jesus WAS the third temple, although the pharisees refused to understand that. John 2:18-20

Fret not, Jesus prophesied several times that you would reject him, so he opened his covenant to the gentiles. There's still room in the world for you. Matt 21:42, Matt 22:1-14.

Answer 4

No. He didn't fulfill the messianic prophecies laid out in the Torah, and G-d is not a man, never was, never will be.

Numbers 23:19: God is not a man, that He should be deceitful, nor the son of man, that He should repent. Would He say and not do, or speak and not confirm?

Psalms 146:3: Do not rely on princes nor in the son of man, for he holds no salvation.
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In response for the request for clarification:

"1) JESUS DID NOT FULFILL THE MESSIANIC PROPHECIES

What is the Messiah supposed to accomplish? The Bible says that he will:

A. Build the Third Temple (Ezekiel 37:26-28).

B. Gather all Jews back to the Land of Israel (Isaiah 43:5-6).

C. Usher in an era of world peace, and end all hatred, oppression, suffering and disease. As it says: "Nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall man learn war anymore." (Isaiah 2:4)

D. Spread universal knowledge of the God of Israel, which will unite humanity as one. As it says: "God will be King over all the world -- on that day, God will be One and His Name will be One" (Zechariah 14:9).

The historical fact is that Jesus fulfilled none of these messianic prophecies.

Christians counter that Jesus will fulfill these in the Second Coming, but Jewish sources show that the Messiah will fulfill the prophecies outright, and no concept of a second coming exists.

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2) JESUS DID NOT EMBODY THE PERSONAL QUALIFICATIONS OF MESSIAH

A. MESSIAH AS PROPHET

Jesus was not a prophet. Prophecy can only exist in Israel when the land is inhabited by a majority of world Jewry. During the time of Ezra (circa 300 BCE), when the majority of Jews refused to move from Babylon to Israel, prophecy ended upon the death of the last prophets -- Haggai, Zechariah and Malachi.

Jesus appeared on the scene approximately 350 years after prophecy had ended.

B. DESCENDENT OF DAVID

The Messiah must be descended on his father's side from King David (see Genesis 49:10 and Isaiah 11:1). According to the Christian claim that Jesus was the product of a virgin birth, he had no father -- and thus could not have possibly fulfilled the messianic requirement of being descended on his father's side from King David!

C. TORAH OBSERVANCE

The Messiah will lead the Jewish people to full Torah observance. The Torah states that all mitzvot remain binding forever, and anyone coming to change the Torah is immediately identified as a false prophet. (Deut. 13:1-4)

Throughout the New Testament, Jesus contradicts the Torah and states that its commandments are no longer applicable. (see John 1:45 and 9:16, Acts 3:22 and 7:37)

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3) MISTRANSLATED VERSES "REFERRING" TO JESUS

Biblical verses can only be understood by studying the original Hebrew text -- which reveals many discrepancies in the Christian translation.

A. VIRGIN BIRTH

The Christian idea of a virgin birth is derived from the verse in Isaiah 7:14 describing an "alma" as giving birth. The word "alma" has always meant a young woman, but Christian theologians came centuries later and translated it as "virgin." This accords Jesus' birth with the first century pagan idea of mortals being impregnated by gods.

B. CRUCIFIXION

The verse in Psalms 22:17 reads: "Like a lion, they are at my hands and feet." The Hebrew word ki-ari (like a lion) is grammatically similar to the word "gouged." Thus Christianity reads the verse as a reference to crucifixion: "They pierced my hands and feet."

C. SUFFERING SERVANT

Christianity claims that Isaiah chapter 53 refers to Jesus, as the “suffering servant.”

In actuality, Isaiah 53 directly follows the theme of chapter 52, describing the exile and redemption of the Jewish people. The prophecies are written in the singular form because the Jews ("Israel") are regarded as one unit. The Torah is filled with examples of the Jewish nation referred to with a singular pronoun.

Ironically, Isaiah's prophecies of persecution refer in part to the 11th century when Jews were tortured and killed by Crusaders who acted in the name of Jesus.

From where did these mistranslations stem? St. Gregory, 4th century Bishop of Nanianzus, wrote: "A little jargon is all that is necessary to impose on the people. The less they comprehend, the more they admire." "
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This is from:
http://www.aish.com/rabbi/ATR_browse.asp?s=messiah&f=tqak&offset=2

There is much more on the matter there. It's easier to copy and paste rather than basically write a book explaining everything.

Answer 5

Scripture bashing proves nothing. All scriptures are open to individual interpretation. You can read a scripture and claim it means one thing. I can read the exact same scripture and claim it means something else. You will never ever prove your religion or your religious beliefs thru scripture bashing.

Answer 6

You're assuming that the bible is true.