My pastor says that thinking people can not be true followers of Christ. Agree/disagree?

Question

He says that if you trust to much in your own power of reason, you are putting yourself before God. So intellectuals are inherently unchristian.

What do you think?

Answer 1

Put your hand tightly over your purse and get out of that church. If that pastor as much as uses a microphone, he's a a hypocrite, since that mic was designed by thinking people.

He's telling you to not be curious, not learn anything and listen only to him. Megalomaniac is the term. Get out of there fast, before the scandals hit.

Answer 2

It all depends on where they direct there intellect. The most important thing for anyone is to consider the Bible the ultimate authority on anything. At my job we are extremely safety oriented and we had a manager who would say if its not in the procedure manual we don't do it. We should have a similar attitude. If it doesn't say so in the Bible question it. Try asking your pastor to show you which scriptures support it.
We are in the position of a little child entering a huge library filled with books in many different languages. The child knows someone must have written those books. It does not know how. The child dimly suspects a mysterious order in the arrangement of the books but doesn't know what it is. That, it seems to me, is the attitude of even the most intelligent human being toward God.
-Albert Einstein
Can't get any more intellectual than that.

Answer 3

Wasn't Sir Isaac Newton Christian? Intellectuals can still be Christian. Martin Luther knew that the indulgences were a man made belief that were not to be found in the Bible, and he was right when he said that God does not let people in the Kingdom of Heaven simply by paying.

You can still use the brain that God gave you to explore and reason with the wonders of God. You can also use reason to find loopholes in statements from non believers. If you keep on finding so called proofs that God does not exist, then you are using your brain cells for wrong reasons. God has all of the answers, anyway.

I think that it's fun when you reason with biology and physics, for they are branches of science, and science was made by God (Everything was). Take this from a soon-to-be Christian scientist. I reason with so many things in my life and I constantly think about everything too much; I'm an over thinker. I even have some gray hairs, and I'm sixteen (Although, I think this is hereditary, but you never know).

Bottom line: You can be like Newton - arguably, the "father of physics and calculus" - or Luther in this case and still keep your faith growing strong. Just remember that the Word of God is the Truth. :]

Answer 4

I have to disagree.

I think that people who really question their faith, seeking the truth actively and arriving at the conclusion that their faith is valid, have a truer and deeper faith than those who never question it.

It's not trusting in my own power of reason, it is not putting myself before God, but I do agree, that in itself would be wrong. However not only intellectuals do that.

And I don't think God is threatened by my questions. If God is, then he isn't much of a God!?

If it is true that intellectuals are inherently unchristian, then the church (church in the big sense) is FILLED with unchristian intellectuals- Doctors, lawyers, Ph.Ds, writers, artists, mathmeticians, classical musicians, and scientists.

Your pastor flopped on this one. I hope the intellectual people in your particular church don't stage a mass exodus in protest, but who could blame them? This is a case of your pastor being judgmental.

Answer 5

huh? Perhaps your pastor is influenced by New Age/gnosticism, perhaps even a tad of Atheism, because this is the argument many in those groups use in an attempt to disqualify the gospel, saying that it doesn't make logical sense and that only those who are unenlightened can accept it.

The fact is, our faith is not blind. It takes a heck of a lot more "blind faith" to believe in the alternative. For example, that everything we see around us got here via some unproven, full-of-holes theory of evolution that leaves even more unanswered questions in its wake. Believing in God/creationism, and the atoning work of Jesus Christ is the only thing I have ever found that answers all of the questions regarding why we are here, where we came from, where we're going, etc. I can't imagine that any pastor could possibly be so presumptuous as to reject reasoning abilities of humans that lead to the only logical conclusions of Scripture.

Furthermore, it is God that gave us our reasoning abilities and the free will to make a choice either for or against him. In fact, does not Romans 1:20 say that "the invisible things of Him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, BEING UNDERSTOOD by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse"?

Clearly, God gave us the ability to use our understanding to come to a conclusion about Him, His power, His existance, etc. Then, having come to accept His reality, we next accept His word as truth, including the gospels that lead us to Jesus Christ. I think it is clear that we are meant to use our understanding and intellect to lead us to him, as the Scripture here says.

Would your pastor say, then, that the Apostle Paul could not be a true follower of Christ, considering that the Apostle Paul had been a Pharissee--a religious leader of his day, who would have been extremely well scholared and educated above the average person of his day? By your pastor's thinking, in fact, those of us who are Christian and college educated, cannot really be both.

Moises: a JW and an ex-JW are in agreement on this one.

Answer 6

Each person has a responsibility for their own soul, therefore they had best think about what the Bible says and not listen to men who may mislead them.

I agree that no man should trust too much in his own powers. That speaks of arrogance which will lead them astray and away from God. I think it VERY unfair that your minister would classify all intellectuals into one category. That alone speaks of prejudice on his part.

And if you listen to man and do what they want, you could easily fall under mind control ~ sounds like a cult if someone doesn't want people thinking on their own. Jim Jones and his followers are perfect examples of that flaw.

Read your Bible, think for yourself and if someone isn't preaching the truth, better start searching for someone who does.

Answer 7

Your Pastor is not of God.

Done - fini - nuff said!!!

Confront this pastor as a group. Ask him to leave that he does not teach the word of God. If he does not step down - leave and find a real teacher of God.

“There is a way that seems right to a man, but its end is the way of death” (Proverbs16:25).

God does not error - God does not lie.

Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding. (Proverbs 3:5)

Your Pastor does lie and follows Baalim in that he does not believe what he teaches and lives off of the "flock".

The most intelligent people I know believe in the Creator and His Son Jesus. Among these people are multi degreed and much respected individuals.

Answer 8

Most people would not agree with him I'm sure. Although he is being honest, most people will not accept what he is saying and will leave his church because of it. However, being a freethinker, I believe that a true Christian is not able to completely think for themselves. Believers are subjected to follow and believe the bible and God's word and surrender to his will. Obviously this doesn't mean thinking and doing things based on your own judgment on things that were already set in stone by God. When God says jump you don't ask why, you ask how high right? Speaking against the bible and thinking for yourself could be considered blasphemy. You can chose to think for yourself, but according to the bible, you will be punished for doing so if it is against it's doctrines. One has to accept the doctrines of the bible in order to be considered a true Christian right? I think for myself, I don't let a book tell me what is wrong and what is right.

Answer 9

I would ask this pastor if he considers himself a true follower of Christ. If he says yes, he has just admitted stupidity by his own reasoning. If he says no, you need to leave his church and ask him on the way out why he is a pastor?
I woud ask this pastor if he had a sick child would he pray for God to heal his child? And if he took the same child to a doctor who prescribed medicine, would he give the child medicine?
I can shorten my answer; you asked, what do I think?
I think your pastor is a lying idiot.

Answer 10

I think that your pastor has bought into the lie that is *killing* the Protestant church. Your pastor is right that if we trust in our own minds we are not being Christian in doing so. But God *wants* us to be EXCELLENT in all we do including thinking and reasoning. He COMMANDS us to do everything as unto Him --- in other words, even if you're setting the table, do it as though you're doing it for Him. This *includes* how you use your noggin! I wonder what your pastor says to great Christians of the past who have been mighty intellectual --- like St Augustine, for example? What about C.S. Lewis? And look at the book of Romans --- it is one long argument of reason to convince people to come to Christ.

Please don't think that I'm one of those Christians who wants to exalt humanistic thinking and who believes in picking and choosing when it comes to the Bible. May it NEVER be. But thinking that God actually wants us to be mediocre in things just to be able to love Him more is a lie of the devil. That's like saying that God doesn't want you to be a good violinist otherwise it will take you away from your love for Him.

Also, this assumes that God is illogical or unreasonable in some way and that that is why people who use reason can't worship Him. While God is not *contained* by logic and cannot be understood totally by any human being, He is never illogical.