On July 4, 1776, the United States founding fathers signed the Declaration of Independence?

Question

And the following words are considered today to have lain the foundation for American democracy:

"...we hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, and they are endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable Rights, among these are Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness..."

These very words, are the seeds of democracy itself, and may well have given rise to the feminist movement and the Civil Rights movements in this country.

Agree or disagree? Your thoughts?

If you believe that "men" meant only men, this would be a sexist statement. Either way (sexist or not) these words may well have inspired some United States citizens to strive for the equality in this country. Could the lack of long-standing democracy in certain countries be the reason why in those countries (such as Iraq, for instance) do not treat women with equal status? Your thoughts?

Or, is the basis for the second-class standing of women in certain countries more religiously based? Or is it a combination of the two (lack of democracy, and religious beliefs.)

BAL: I understand what you are saying, but even if the founding fathers did not envision what they proclaimed, apparently with time, the American people did.

Zhuge: wonderful answer, thank you!

Zhuge: you got a "thumbs up" from me!

Madpol: fascinating- thank you for your answer!

GREAT ANSWERS!

Answer 1

Well yeah... of course those words had a role in voting and civil rights.

"Men" did mean men -- why do you think it took 150 years for women to get the right to vote? It also meant "white" men -- property owners -- and even after legislation was passed to ensure voting rights for all, people continued to try to find ways to exclude certain groups (i.e. tests, poll taxes, etc...), requiring even more legislation. Earlier democracies had similar double-standards as well. It's hard to come together to reach a consensus -- you can't always get everyone on the same page in terms of equality at the time, but you must reach a compromise to establish a republic.

For a long time this country said one thing and did another, though some of the founders wanted to abolish slavery (and a few to give rights to women) from the outset. It just wouldn't work that way, so we had to work with what we had to create this nation, and then slowly adjust over time. There were growing pains to be sure... but here we are, divided as ever, but with a diverse population and the most equality we've had in our history.

As for other countries, I think some of the ones alluded to have more to do with religion and strict sets of law (specifically Islam...Shariah). Democracy would have to be very watered down to work in cooperation with Shariah, so much so that many see them as mutually exclusive.

Another big part of our democracy is the separation of church and state, even though they remain somewhat intermingled, from religious statements on our currency to all presidents ever elected being Christians -- there's even a bit about a "creator" in your quote from the Declaration of Independence. It's an even bigger deal with Islam, and their law, like that in the Bible, does not treat women equally (and let's not even start on other groups, like homosexuals). Women do have certain rights, but they are not equal, not at all. Until you have a secularist society like what has been established in Turkey, it's hard to work towards a democracy with full civil rights.

Some of these countries have been gradually moving forward on their own, just as we did, but certain types of pressure (like that we're applying in Iran) is likely to be counter-productive, causing a conservative cultural backlash and hatred of the USA. Turkey, Lebanon, Iran, etc... many countries are/were already making strides in the right direction.

Edit: Why do people give thumbs downs on factual responses? *boggle*

OP: Ty =)

Answer 2

Well, legally, the Declaration has not standing; the foudation for our country was set out in the Constitution.

And, the Declaration wasn't signed on 7/4/1776, but over a period of time after that (it was ratified by the Continental Congress on that day).

The seeds of democracy were earlier.

The Black Panthers rewrote the Declaration, in the 60s, to make a point about the racial inequality of this country. So it did have a role in that movement.

I believe feminists used it, too, to make that basic point.

At the founding of the country, neither women nor people of color were considered among the "men" that were "created equal".

And, of course, there's that pesky bit about someone having "created" us all.

BTW, Jefferson did a bit of photocopying and a bit of editing.

If you read John Locke (from whom the concepts underlying the Declaration were lifted), you'll see the phrase "life, liberty, and the pursuit of property" prominent.

Answer 3

To be picky, July 4th, 1776 was when Jefferson presented it. The actual signing didn't start until July 6th.

The Declaration became not only the Foundation for American Democracy, but for the French Revolution and Democratic Revolts and Governments Worldwide. So yeah, it inspired Feminists as well. Interestingly, women had the vote in every colony when the Declaration was signed and were later disenfranchised. The first colony to revoke woman sufferage was New York (1777.) The last state to revoke it was New Jersey, (1820.)

Oddly enough, what was self-evident then is considered pretty radical today.

I remember a Social Psych experiment back in the 1970's in which passersby in Malls and Street Corners were handed a clipboard with the Declaration of Independence on it. 90% refused to sign.

And don't even get me started on what a whiny bunch of America Hating Liberals the Framers of the Constitution are now considered....

Answer 4

The 1st Amendment does not force religion on anyone. In that sense, it's not a Christian nation. However, the underlying fabric and moral compass came from Christian principles. Some of these principles are equal justice, equal opportunity, individualism, charity, individual salvation and divine providence. That's not to say this fabric was adhered to. Slavery was an obvious tear in it, which was eventually healed by a Christian revival. Christian principles are also the core of what American freedoms are base on. The rights that are described in the Declaration of Independence and protected in the Constitution are natural rights. These are individual rights that are practiced by the individual. They do not require an outside enabler, like government, to make them work. They are defined as being given by God (i.e. "The Creator) to man. Being so, they cannot be taken away by government. This is in stark contrast to Collective (human) rights that other countries have. They obligate government to create, define and regulate rights. They give government an excuse to be Progressive and make itself the center of it's peoples' lives.

Answer 5

The Declaration of Independence, Said what it meant all Men ( white men) and not all white men were considered Equal such as Irish Catholics. Many of the Fore Fathers were Slaves owners. Women won their voting rights 150 years later and minorities won their Rights in the Civil Rights Act of 1964. White man chose who could prosper in this land and who couldn't. A good example is the Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo, Ending the Mexican-American war, the US Congress delete Article 10 the rights for Mexicans to be guaranteed their full property rights. after it was agree to by both sides. That is where the stolen land issue is based.

You can find Art. 10 in the Mexican Copy of the Treaty signed.

Answer 6

Yes I think early feminists and minority groups at least got inspiration from the declaration and the Constitution. As they should have because that is what it was intended for. But today's groups have turned to hate groups that keep spreading the hysteria around about issues that are either long gone or are on their way out. Both feminism and certain minority groups have little left to complain about as far as equality goes. I do think that minority groups still have some work to do with many black men being wrongly convicted at higher rates than other groups but for the most part I think these groups concentrate too much on things that happened in the past instead of working toward the future and the problems of today.

Answer 7

The Declaration of Independence was signed over the course of weeks, not on a single day. Also, democracy existed before the United States (ancient Athens), and if truth be told, the United States is a republic, not a democracy. Perhaps most disturbingly, we are constantly having our "inalienable" rights trampled upon. Not quite the stuff they told you in elementary school.

Answer 8

If the Founding Fathers said that all men are created equal, people should take it to heart. I would expect them to have had women in mind — it was just more convenient to say "men" at the time, since language was more gendered then.

Answer 9

Agreed 100%! It says all MEN (I would take that as being mankind, women are also included!) It is a shame that what was written is still not followed to this day! Hell people cry about the right to bare arms but god forbid we treat each other as equals! Tell me where are values lie?!?

Answer 10

The Declaration of Independence was followed by the Constitution (which most of the still living signers of the Declaration supported) which excluded voting rights for women, denied slaves citizenship and worse.

Tommy Jefferson, the main author of the Declaration, continued owning slaves.

I don't think the Declaration can be read as a manifesto for human equality.

The seeds for equality and desire for equal (or fair) treatment arise in many individuals. Whether they can achieve it given the society they live in is another matter.