Is anyone else tired of the Christian argument that without god or an afterlife there is no meaning to life?

Question

Us atheists are often labeled as nihilistic but it seems that the opposite appears to be true. I find a great deal of meaning in my life, and i don't need to believe in a god or afterlife to find this meaning. I know that what i do here and now will affect people, and the environment around me. I know that i can act in ways that make this affect for the better or for the worse. I have a family that cares for me, and a loving pet cat. I have friends and hobbies... To say there is no meaning to life without god or an afterlife is to, in effect, say that all of these wonderful things we have in our lives are worthless and that you don't really care how you interact with other people. That's a very frightening concept to me, and to think that a lot of people who believe in god would consider themselves criminals who don't care one iota how they treat others around them without the threat of hell and the reward of heaven looming over their heads is utterly sickening.

Answer 1

I am. It's a stupid argument.

That argument says that if something is short lived, it is worthless. This is just not true.

As an analogy, I often use the ice cream cone. Ice cream doesn't really offer much nutritional value and it only lasts until it melts. By the above argument, then, ice cream is worthless.

Personally, though, I enjoy ice cream while I'm having it. I don't plod through eating the ice cream cone looking forward to when it is done. That would be stupid. It would be a waste of the ice cream.

In the same way, I value life while I have it. In the ultimate scheme of things, we humans might not have much affect on the universe. However, that doesn't keep me from enjoying my life now. Life's value is in its journey, not in its conclusion. To live your life planning for when you're dead is a waste of life.

Answer 2

Making the claim that atheists are "nihilistic*" or amoral or whatever is a common logical error among apologists for various revelation based religions, including Christianity. It's a error I've made myself . . . and I was, once upon a time, an agnostic myself.

The correct claim is that atheists have no rational (or reasonable or logical) basis for finding meaning in life, or for acting morally, or for valuing beauty. Of course, the lack of a logical reason for something rarely keeps anyone from anything, whether Christian or atheist.

So it's quite true that many atheists do act morally (at least on some occasions) and it's also true that many atheists do feel that their life has meaning even though they lack any logical reason for feeling that way. Conversely, many Christians act immorally (at least on some -- or even many -- occasions) even though they have all sorts of reasons for morals. Likewise, many Christians, myself included, struggle to feel that their lives have meaning even though we have all sorts of reasons for thinking it does.

The bottom line is that neither Christians nor atheists always behave or think in ways that are logically consistent with what they claim to believe. It's just that Christians are being logical when they think their life has meaning, and atheists are being logical when they think it doesn't!

Moray



PS: It's really a logical howler to claim that someone who's still talking is nihilistic. A truly logical nihilist would be utterly silent, or else be as likely to babble as to speak English (or any other known language). But then, there aren't any logically consistent nihilists! However, there have been, and according to Wikipedia, there still are some amazingly talkative, if inconsistent, nihilists. My motto (about this) is, "Nobody is a postmodernist (or nihilist or solipsist) when they count their change at Walmart!" ;-)

Answer 3

Stop before you start foaming at the mouth.

It is not just Christians who label our existence as meaningless. Most of the atheistic response agrees that life has no meaning.

Meaning comes from living for a real purpose:

“Unless you assume a God, the question of life’s purpose is meaningless.” –Bertrand Russell (you can look up Russell and you'll find he is a rather famous atheist)

Things that serve no purpose have no worth. How can you disagree with that?

You have mistaken busyness and good feelings for purpose and meaning. You focus on things that please you, your cat, your friends and hobbies and those good feelings deceive you into thinking that you have a purpose.

As you indicated, the idea of a meaningless, worthless existence is a frightening concept but our human capacity for self deception comes to our aid and our invented purposes seem real.

Look, even criminals condemned to die in the morning can laugh and joke and play cards and be happy all night long. Their capacity for self delusion has allowed them to push their pending death out of their consciousness. I think that is what you are doing.

Answer 4

Ha! I found you!

I'll agree that we can have the impression of temporary meaning in life without a god involved, sure. But seriously, life is meaningless if it's only temporary and ends with absolute finality. And, yes, the average person - probably not me, probably not you... but we've established already that you and I aren't average... we're "above average" :) - would only do what serves themselves with no interest for others well being unless "something greater" was hanging over their heads. That's why we have laws, governments, and police... because the average shmuck DOES NOT do what's good or right or moral UNLESS they have to.

Of course, that doesn't prove there is a god. But I think it gets at the heart of your point. Without "something greater" there is no meaning, no moral compass, and no motivation for people to do anything "good" - whatever "good" may mean with no standard to judge it by.

Answer 5

Of course. What they're saying is, "without God or an afterlife there is no meaning to THEIR life!" But the problem then becomes, if there's no meaning to their life, they want to make sure there is NO LIFE for anyone. That's what we see happening in the world now. Politicians and hypocritical right-wingers cant stand it and they're determined to make sure that life as we know it ends, and ends pretty soon. The link attached will take you to a page that shows another person in history who had a similar spin on life as our unpopular and worthless president.

Answer 6

It is the religious fundamentalists who are the nihilists without knowing it. They cut themselves off from the full potential of 'abundant life' now, obsessed with a fantasized hell after death.

I just bumped into Constantin Brunner (philosopher) who has quite an interesting explanation of superstition's connection to moralism. You might find him interesting.

Answer 7

Well the meaning of life aint 42 as some would have us believe.

Personally I dont want to just be a skin bag of bones and flesh that rots and decays once its dead. I want MORE I want to live forever in a peaceful paradise earth but.... hheeyyy thats just me. Wot eva rocks ya jocks

All people want to enjoy life and you seem to be doing just that, great so we should, but ( and there is always a BUT) there WILL come an end and then what?? Something to think about hey!!!

Answer 8

If God and the afterlife didn't exist, my life would still have a meaning and purpose. But it would be a very DIFFERENT one.

Answer 9

I think its more frightening than it is sickening. Makes a person wonder how many psychos there really are out there that would blow us all up if they thought their god wanted it or didn't exist.

Answer 10

I am too. I get where you are coming from even though I believe in God (my own understanding). Life is meaningful regardless...if not to us and our souls then to our future generations.