Question For Atheists relating to the bigbang and the start of the universe?

Question

Start with the question: If you were promised a chocolate bar after an infinite amount of time would you ever get that chocolate bar
A:) No
If you were sent to run an infinitely long playing field would you ever get to the end.
A:) No
Why?-Because you can't logically transcend infinity as it goes on forever,so you can't pass it or come to the end of it, like you can't come to the end of the infinite amount of time to get your chocolate bar.

Considering we are currently living in the present how much time has passed to get to this point. Logically and mathematically it can not be infinite as you can't transcend infinity.
Thus the energy and space-time of the singularity can't have existed forever,why?because it would take an infinite amount of time to get to this point.

So if the universe, with space and time didn't always exist (because its not eternal), where did it come from? Did it just appear from no where?? because that would be pretty miraculous...

To:ruuk Why is it technobabble, think people would agree the universe hasn't existed forever, and that is a good logical reasonw hy it can't have, because You can't transcend infinity.

So if something hasn't always existed it must have been made at some point. Therefore why is it illogical in some people's eyes to think God made it? Because obviously something can't from from nothing, so something must have always existed to create what does exist. and that is required to be transcended of time and space,natural laws and logic ect. (assuming it created all those things like that)

Answer 1

Energy has always been, it can't be created or destroyed.

Answer 2

Your examples are hypothetical, and fail to take into account that both time, and the concept of infinity are man-made. Trust me on this...the universe itself has no concept of time beyond "before now" and "now". "After now" doesn't exist.

Onto your posit on the singularity. We don't know where the matter contained within it came from. There are many possibilities being examined, at the moment. The two which seem to make the most sense are as follows:

The singularity is the end result of a 'big crunch'; essentially, after eons of expansion, there is an equal amount of contraction. This contraction results in the matter becoming highly compressed, until it reaches a critical stage and explosive decompression...or a 'big bang'.

The second deals with string, or M theory. The idea being chased here, puts forth that the singularity, and it's resulting explosion, are the product of two dimensions intersecting (it would take way too much space to go into the theoretical dimensions that M theory deals with...you can do the legwork on that).

Currently, we've only been able to track down the starting point of the current universe, which is the big bang. We're not afraid to say that we don't know, and are working on it. At the same time, we can confidently say, that we've proven time and again, that natural things have natural origins. This will prove to be no different.

Answer 3

The religious version fails on the same grounds. An infinite god created a universe. Since god has existed for an infinite amount of time, and the universe has existed for a finite amount of time, god has existed for an infinite amount of time before creating the universe. Which, by your argument, means the point of time at which the universe is created will never arrive, so the universe was never created.

The problem with your idea is there was no "before" the big bang. Time didn't exist "before" the big bang. No, I don't understand everything fully, but that doesn't mean we should jump to "it must be a divine miracle".

Answer 4

I think you confused athiests with cosmologists or scientists.

I certainly don't believe in this or that deity, ( I have no solid proof either way, but lean towards 'unlikely' owing to the curiously human male-like religious doctines ;-) ) and I certainly don't know (among countless variations) whether or not the universe...

A. ...was always here or not.

B. ...isn't a polyp on the mole of the skin of an alien lifeform which itself is a microscopic speck of dust in a larger ultraverse.

C. ...is a kind of matter that vibrates at a level visible to us but exists within countless other universes that vibrate at a different level and extend back and forth helically along a subjective fault line that both exists and doesnt exist at the same time.

To answer your logic that supposes:

'something must exist to create something, so it might be a god'

Then obviously (going by the same logic) you must also want to know what created a god? Unless you just want to solve the problem of such endless logical conundrum by just slapping a punctuation mark on it and calling it God?

Which begs the question, why even present that 'logic' ?

Answer 5

Thus the energy and space-time of the singularity (IN ASTROPHYSICS,A SINGULARITY IS A POINT WHERE SPACE AND TIME ARE INFINITELY DISTORTED,THEREFORE,THE WORD "FOREVER"IS MEANINGLESS,TIME DOESN'T "MOVE"IN A SINGULARITY,SECONDS,YEARS,
INFINITE TIME DOESN'T APPLY.TIME,AND SPACE, BEGAN WHEN THE SINGULARITY EXPANDED)can't have existed forever,why?because it would take an infinite amount of time to get to this point.

So if the universe, with space and time didn't always exist (because its not eternal), where did it come from?(THE SINGULARITY YOU JUST MENTIONED) Did it just appear from no where?? because that would be pretty miraculous...(CURRENT THEORY HAS IT NOT BEING MIRACULOUS,BUT INSTEAD RATHER COMMON,AN INFINITE NUMBER OF UNIVERSES,SOME IMMEDIATELY COLLAPSE ON THEMSELVES,SOME THE PHYSICAL LAWS,SUCH AS THE SPEED OF LIGHT MAY BE DIFFERENT.HECK,WE'VE EVEN CREATED A UNIVERSE IN THE LAB,AT THE MOMENT OF CREATION,IT SPLITS OFF FROM OURS AS IT MUST.IT IS IT"S OWN UNIVERSE.IT IS ESTIMATED OUR UNIVERSE,COMPLETE WITH IT'S TIME AND SPACE,BEGAN SOME 14.5 BILLION YEARS AGO.THE SINGULARITY WASN'T JUST "SITTING THERE" FOR ETERNITY.TIME BEGAN AT THE POINT THE SINGULARITY EXPANDED)

Google "NOVA:THE ELEGANT UNIVERSE"It is free,several videos that walk you through some very difficult concepts in layman's terms.It is an excellent resource for understanding the big bang,time,and space

Answer 6

for questions relating to the big bang and the start of the universe, you would be best to ask a cosmologist (a scientist who studies such things). if your question is purely for the sake of interest, you may find some experts in the Y!A section "science and mathematics -> astronomy and space".

as an atheist, i don't believe in gods. last i checked, that does not mean that i have to know how the universe started, and indeed, i don't know how the universe started, or even IF it started with the big bang. all of your fancy logic is therefore irrelevant, and even if your premises happened to be correct, i fail to see why it proves that gods exist. you seem to make the usual leap that theists are fond of making from some phenomena that you don't understand, to "god did it". i prefer taking smaller steps. that way i can be fairly sure that i'm not just making stuff up.

Answer 7

It IS a miracle that we're here, yes.

Obviously, the big bang pretty much eliminates the theory of everything having always just been there. That we don't understand exactly what caused a little more matter than anti-matter to be there doesn't really say anything apart form that we don't understand it (yet).

I believe (and I don't know) that there was a lot of luck involved in us being here. Miraculous? Certainly!

Answer 8

Who said the universe was infinite? No physicists I've heard of.

The universe is about 13.8 billion years old (not 6000) though if that bang was caused by the collision of two 3-branes then the cycle may happen again, and indeed may have been happening forever.

Answer 9

That's like saying "you can never count to seven, because numbers are infinite." Take a logic class.

Answer 10

By the same definitions God cannot mathematically exist. And to say that he just is. is a cop out

Answer 11

Go ask a cosmologist or physicist to get an answer.

This atheist is not qualified in those fields. But I sure do know that the answer to everything we don't yet know isn't 'godidit' because that is the lack of an answer.