I'm not talking about MMA or the UFC, etc... These are sporting competition with rules and willing participants. I don't have a problem with those. I'm talking about these guys who constantly go on about what style works in a real fight and what doesn't.
-If they know all those styles, what are they doing going around beating up street punks? If they don't, what makes them experts in them?
But mostly, this whole street fight thing seems to me to be based on some macho adolescent fantasy. And you can tell what these people are talking about it not self-defence. In self-defence, you don't stand toe-to-toe trying to prove what you know. You get it over with ASAP (And if you're not afraid enough to feel the need to run, how can it be self-defence?).
Do they really think two hours a week of some secret system will give them an edge over a hardened criminal? Someone that won't hesitate to puncture your lung or just shoot you?
I could go on, but does anybody else see my point?
2007-10-01 07:20:02 · 20 answers · asked by Anonymous in Sports ➔ Martial Arts
Martial arts teach self defense not how to fight and a lot of people can't see the difference.Applied to sport karate or any martial art is dysfunctional as rules negate the needs of self defense .
There are only 2 true self defense techniques walk away and ignore it or run away that's it period.
Anything you do other than that is a mutual agreement to do each other harm whether you throw the 1st punch or not.
This is also how the law will veiw it .They dont care who started it they look at it as "could you or both of you avoided it"and usually the answer is yes.
Self defense on the other hand involves sneak attacks which martial arts are well equiped to handle unless of course you walk around with your head up your *** thinking about what a bad dude you are.
2007-10-01 08:03:10 · answer #1 · answered by bunminjutsu 5 · 3⤊ 2⤋
Honestly, I think many of them simply misunderstand what a "real" fight is. I can back up that my art (Aikido) has been used in true self-defense situations by me and others I know. That doesn't mean that everyone who learns Aikido is going to be able to defend themselves.
The arts *all* work. But they don't all work for every individual artist. A great Aikido book I own has a Q&A section where they address the question "Does Aikido work". There were several answers presented, but my favority is:
"Aikido works. I don't know about *your* Aikido."
Substitute Karate, Kung-Fu, Wushu, Judo, Jiu-Jitsu or any other art for Aikido in those statements and they remain true.
As for macho posturing, well, when a guy pulls a knife on you it's time to consider how much your macho is really worth to you. There's a picture wandering around on the net of a guy who got into a knife fight. It's pretty gruesome. (I've heard at least three different versions of the details of the actual fight, none of them substantiated.)
The better fighter will win. Period. It makes no difference what the art is. Maybe a better way to put it is that the fighter with the advantage will win. The particular art is unlikely to be the advantage. A knife might be. Superior training will be. Size and strength can be. Experience in fights is guaranteed to be. A calm and organized mindset is also guaranteed to be.
The combination is what ultimately makes the difference.
2007-10-01 10:45:06 · answer #2 · answered by mriehle 3 · 1⤊ 0⤋
yes and no.
you make a good point in differentiating the realities of a "real fight" and the dangers and point out that learning in the dojo is not the be all end all of skills.
what you learn in the gym is techniques, this is how to fight and how to apply it in a fight (you should learn anyway).
what you do in a fight where there are no rules and weapons can come into play, objects can be thrown, etc. is tactics. this is much different than tactics you would use in a boxing, bjj, muai thai, etc. match.
however the techniques are all the same and will work in both situations and you do NEED to train that in order to learn to fight. but if your goal is self-defence, that is only part of the equation as you also need to be aware.
if that guy got the drop on you with a knife or gun, odds are not in your favor and anything you do is going to be high-risk. Is fighting that going to be "self-defence" or is the better course of action to run or give them your money?
Thats what using your brain and awareness are. you are right, two guys rarely (if ever) just square off, most times in a bar they are either talking trash and playing peacock or someone is going to sucker punch you (or you them).
and part of that also involves legal consequences and the reality of numbers. If you are there with your midget friend and hes got 4 other friends and is a regular, then is fighting him self-defence? hell no.
there is a good reason to learn martial arts, and if your sole goal is about self-defence, then unarmed martial arts (in my book) should be secondary to the study of a weapon style that you can conceal.
one problem I have with many gyms is that they do promote the idea that taking on a guy with a knife is "no sweat". I mean realistically too, you might not even know the knife is in play until after the fight (if you aren't dead).
training in martial arts for self defence certainly has a value, and you can't be good at self-defence without it, however there are other aspects as well. Martial arts is about fighting plain and simple its just damn hard to market "learn how to kick *** and beat the crap out of people" and get followers (especially decades ago) and not have legislators see this as a threat.
2007-10-01 11:33:53 · answer #3 · answered by Anonymous · 1⤊ 1⤋
No, that was you that said "Science is all a bunch of man made hogwash" not me. Lay off the weed sir. @J.R. I'm assuming you are a Christian. Christianity teaches people to accept dogma without question. Science teaches people to be skeptical and base their beliefs on reason and evidence. When was the last time you did an experiment to see if God actually was real?
2016-04-06 22:51:27 · answer #4 · answered by Anonymous · 0⤊ 0⤋
Well Like I always say when this argument comes up You really wanna learn how to fight, go to a prison exercise yard. Those guys will teach you everything you could ever hope to learn about fighting. Needless to say much of what they'll teach you is highly illegal and will get you put there too and even many hardened jail inmates for all their viciousness and cheap shots screw up and still get their throat slit.
You really want to learn how to defend yourself number one avoid places where violence is prone to happen. If you live somewhere where streetfights are a day to day occurence Move. I'm not saying that strategy is 100 percent foolproof and you'll never get robbed but it will certainly help.
Number 2 Do whatever it is you need to do to get out of the bad situation. Real self defense is not about winning anything or defending honor. It's about getting out of a bad situation quickly and with minimal injury.
2007-10-01 15:41:32 · answer #5 · answered by Anonymous · 1⤊ 0⤋
There are a lot of reasons why this happens. Sad to say, a lot of the answers here appear as if the askers still watch dragon ball z.
In kids classes, this comes up among the very beginners. I tell them from the beginning. That is fantasy. I feel I have to nip it in the bud.
The older ones, the mid-teeners, they are just plain ignorant. They are not students at all but those who are disillusioned by movies and ufc.
The first confrontation with a real criminal as described above... can lead to tragedy.
I prove it to them when I put them on the floor to use what I taught them. Sparring in my dojo consists of you on the floor with 2 or more attackers, STREET STYLE.
No freestyle crap. I don't teach tournament/demonstration crap. And whoever doesn't like it is free to leave and find the closest McDojo.
2007-10-01 14:02:25 · answer #6 · answered by Darth Scandalous 7 · 0⤊ 1⤋
I see your point.
I've heard people ask about what martial art they can get in in case they get in a street fight. That's just crap because no amount of training will let you win in a streetfight unless you are ready to use what you've learned. THERE ARE NO RULES IN THE STREETS. You can bite, gouge, kick someone in the groin, or just use a Glock.
Martial arts will definitely give you the advantage as martial arts training enhances speed, power, reflexes, mind set, tolerance to pain, et cetera. All these areas will definitely help if you are in a situation when one is in danger. Thing is, what if you are facing multiple opponents? WHAT IF YOUR OPPONENT IS BENT ON INCAPACITATING OR EVEN KILLING YOU BY ALL MEANS NECCESSARY?
Do you know how difficult it is to face just two people, even though unarmed? I've been in this situation and I got hurt bad because I thought that my training was enough. It's true that martial arts training helped me get less hurt and those two clowns ended up in the hospital; although, I was along with them with a nasty gash at the side of the head, 2 ribs broken, and accompanied by a police officer. My mistake was not backing down from the fight. Turns out that these two were from a rival martial arts group sent to "hit" me. This was a long time ago and the lesson I've learned is that I could've used my training to hit and rrrrrrruuuuuuuun or just defend and rrrrrrrrruuuuuuuuun.. Then I wouldn't have ended up with those guys in the hospital with the LAW on my ***. THERE IS ALWAYS SOMEONE OUT THERE WHO CAN KICK YOUR ***. DO NOT GET THE LAW ON YOUR ***....DON'T BE COCKY.
I realized that anything can happen in a fight. The guy you are facing might be a hardened criminal and no amount of martial arts training will save you if you are not ready to use it. I've seen this cocky blackbelt get his *** handed to him by the resident street punk without training (a friend of the family unfortunately. his mom cooks well. haha. he's a nice guy actually.). HOw? because the street punk was ready to win by all means neccessary and he had the killer mindset. The karate guy was not able to showcase any of his moves! The streetpunk, now my friend, and I tap him and knock him down in closed door MMA tournaments, got an ashtray and tried to smash it on the guys face. Karate guy blocked it but it impact broke some bones in his hand. He couldn't punch! After this streetpunk finished him off. ON THE STREET, THEY WILL TAKE EVERYTHING AND GIVE YOU NOTHING.
It's true I can beat him in the ring, but I know that if I fight him on the sidewalk, I'd really have to be careful and defeat him by all means neccessary as well. If i have to fight him, I need to have the killer mindset as well.
2007-10-01 22:14:10 · answer #7 · answered by beachninjaassasin 1 · 2⤊ 0⤋
I see your point. I personally have always tried to get ahold of my opponent in a fight, rather than stand around playing Marques of Queensbury with them. But I was a high school wrestler and not a boxer, so I suppose its just going with what you know best. Still, getting your opponent up off his feet and slamming him to the ground seems like a pretty effective tactic. They do a lot of that in UFC I notice.
Agreed that if your opponent is a skilled fighter, you have to adapt to what you believe will work in a given situation. But for ordinary people you might run into on the street, get a hold of them and lift them up off their feet. They lose so much leverage that way.
Just a humble two cents worth. certainly not an expert on this.
2007-10-01 07:29:00 · answer #8 · answered by John M 7 · 0⤊ 0⤋
well a 'street fight' could be getting robbed at an ATM or when ur putting stuff in your car at the store or someone trying to rape you.
And yes, 2-3 hours a week of training can give you a HUGE edge in defending yourself and maybe waking away
alive. Weather or not their 'hardened' criminals or not. Being able to react quickly weather it be to run away or strike back is a trained response
And I agree - so many her go on and on about how their kung fu is better than some other does get a little tiring.
2007-10-01 11:03:37 · answer #9 · answered by J7 3 · 1⤊ 0⤋
You may be interested in reading what Mr. MacYoung (an ex-street fighter) has to say about a "real fight" here:
http://www.nononsenseselfdefense.com/REALfighting.htm
That being said, I understand completely what you're saying. Personally, if someone is engaging in "Ook Ook look at how big my d*** is" diatribes about which style works for street fighting, chances are he's never been in a violent altercation outside of high school... and the sum of his martial arts/fighting experience is weekly lessons from a con man peddling a "ultimate fighting system" that enables you to beat *any* opponent. (Always wondered about that particular sales pitch... if it's really an "unbeatable" system, what happens when you go up against someone from that same system?? :-) )
Yeah, I'd say it's just a macho fantasy.
2007-10-01 11:15:24 · answer #10 · answered by ATWolf 5 · 2⤊ 1⤋