What's wrong with an open debate on the Holocaust?

Question

The accepted version of the Holocaust Saga has remained the same despite the fact that many aspects of it have been discredited:

1) Take Auschwitz-Birkenau: The patent lie given by the Soviets that 4 million (based on forced confessions) were killed there is not held by anyone today: the latest estimate is 800,000 - and it is also acknowledged that most of those died due to disease and natural causes. The "gas chambers" ( which are reconstructions built by the "scrupulous" Soviets) are now conceded may actually be fakes. The horrific site of the ovens/crematoria is less so when you consider that this was the most effective way to dispose of corpses with disease.
Moreover, the traces of cyanide found are only those required for delousing and disinfectant purposes.

The damning "Wansee conference minutes" too do not mention any word of systematic genocide but rather of evacuation of Jews to camps in the east pending final settlement after the war.

These are but a few examples.

Michael J: So the holocaust is better documented than 9/11, or the Gulf war or all of the events documented by mass media since WW2: what r u smoking???

Garwy: send me the evidence of these alleged witnesses and I will send you the testimony of people who survived the concentration camps but deny that any gas chambers existed.

Hitler never ordered that Paris should burn!

Nuremberg was a load of nonsense: the victor writes history and so it seems the confessions of the conquered.

Under cross-examination, most survivors of the concentration camps conceded that there were no gas chambers: moreover, I prefer scientific and forensic evidence that proves there were no gas chambers: If you don't believe me about the fact that they were built AFTER the war go to the offical Auschwitz website. I believe in facts, not some anecdotes from geriatric folk ,thank you. I also can infer that the fact that so many people survived the camps is precisly because there was NO GENOCIDE! I also have seen phots of Jewish weddings and bar-mitzvahs being held at Auschwitz, Buchenwald and Dacau. You people have been so thoroughly brainwashed that you believe the tales about Jewish bodies being turned into soap and other such crap!

Perhaps, you should have a look at this link:

http://www.geniebusters.org/915/04g_gas.html

Answer 1

One thing the asker has in common with Ahmadinejad is Holocaust denial. Holocaust denial is illegal in many countries,

Answer 2

All I can say is go there and you will find what you seek. The truth is tangible there.
An open debate is fine, but denial is not

PS Natural causes includes malnutrition/starvation and literally working to death

After your email to me:
My granddad saw the gas chambers at work. He was actually physically there when they were in use. They were not I repeat not built after the war to say there were is in fact stating that my grand father lied. He had many faults, lying wasn't one of them.
It should also be mentioend that there were concentration camps that factually did not have gaschambers and this is a well documented fact (Sachenhausen did not have chambers) These were the camps that were shown to visitors to show them how 'nice' they were to their prisoners However to conclude from this that others did not have chambers is a bridge too far. As long as witnesses are alive that saw the chambers working we know the truth.

As for the numbers that were killed; It doesn't really matter does it ?2, 4, 6 ,8, 10 million It was still a holocaust
The allies did not make this up You are making this up

The Germans were wrong in the the war They paid the price for it The national guilt was huge. By denying the holocaust you are not only denying the dignity of those that fought and died the war, but also of the people who did die in the camps.
But most of all you are saying that the remorse and guilt that Germany bravely faced after the war was not only not required, it was stupid and silly That is adding insult to injury to Germany.
I greatly respect the Germans for facing up to what they did. The repented and paid the price.

It seems that the very well oiled propaganda machine that the Nazi's built is still working. I pity you your ignorance

Answer 3

Holocaust denial is banned in a couple of nations given that it does harm persons's emotions and given that this is a style of inciting hatred. You could say that wondering numbers and so on. isn't always a style of inciting hatred, however honestly it means that the Jews could have made it up for his or her possess abilities, and making persons think this does incite hatred. You ask why that is exceptional for the Holocaust. Well it must now not be that approach. What I wrote above applies to each genocide. It is a disgrace how for illustration many Turks deny the Armenian genocide. France has handed a legislation that makes Armenian genocide denial unlawful in France. Anyway the Holocaust deniers are essentially the most competitive sort of genocide deniers who name for political implications in their suggestions. For illustration they typically attempt to refute the legitimacy of the State of Israel by way of denying the Holocaust. Many Holocaust deniers are neo-Nazis like Ernst Zündel who desire to make use of Holocaust denial to toughen "Aryan" supremacist suggestions. It is hazardous. Another factor is that the proof for the Holocaust is so transparent that there's relatively no have to talk about the query of its old accuracy at tuition. Historians do not debate the accuracy of the Holocaust simply as biologists do not keep in mind creationism an choice, atronomers do not talk about the likelihood that the earth possibly the core of the universe and geologists do not talk about the notion that the earth possibly flat. It is ridiculous to say the exact quantity of the sufferers and resources and so on. would now not be explored. They are explored in first-class element. The Holocaust is surely studied and documentated greater than every other genocide in historical past. Holocaust deniers do not discover some thing, they only make up lies, that's what is frowned upon.

Answer 4

The Holocaust is the most documented event in human history. You're making a fool of yourself trying to find controversy where there is actually none.


***Edit****
After your email to me: So anyone that disagrees with you is a Zionist?
Cite your sources for the debate you'd like to enter into. Who are these historians you use as sources? Furnish information about these concentration camp survivors you say deny the existence of the gas chambers. I stick to my contention that the Holocaust is the most documented event in human history, not reported on but documented, there's a difference...and to be clear I didn't call you an idiot I said you were making a fool of yourself.
There is video evidence
There is photographic evidence
There is evidence from survivors
There is evidence from rescuers
There is evidence from former captors/executioners
There is evidence from observers (Int'l Red Cross for instance).
There is evidence from written Nazi records
There is evidence from forensics

Answer 5

I think your full of crap, it's as simple as that. I think your a hate monger in disguise and, am waiting to jump out at a chance to get "someone"
Well Pal, My family, Polish, were all arrested and disappeared behind the gates of Auschwitz, never to be seen again, I see their pictures on my wall everyday. My Uncle, My Aunt and two cousins, just children, by the way, they weren't Jews.

Answer 6

Why would anyone want to debate a historical, well-documented, fact?
One debates questions that are unresolved. The Holocaust happened. What is there to debate about that?

BTW - Hitler did order Paris destroyed. Another documented fact.

Answer 7

In a court of law the defendant is entitled to a presumption of innocence yet the Germans were never given this chance because they lost the war

Answer 8

The Persecution of the Jews (Part 13 of 14)
Nazi Conspiracy & Aggression
Volume I Chapter XII


[Page 1007]

5. RESULTS OF THE EXTERMINATION PROGRAM The huge scale of the Jewish eliminations is also reflected in the bookkeeping and statistics of the Germans themselves. The 16 December 1941 entry in the diary of Hans Frank contains these figures: "The Jews for us also represent extraordinarily malignant gluttons.

"We have now approximately 2,500,000 of them in General Government -- perhaps with the Jewish mixtures, and everything that goes with it, 3,500,000 Jews." (2233-D-PS) On 25 January 1944, three years and one month later, Frank wrote in his diary these words: "At the present time we still have in the General Government perhaps 100,000 Jews." (2233-F-PS)

Thus, in this period of three years, according to the records of the then Governor General of Occupied Poland, between 2,400,000 and 3,400,000 Jews had been eliminated. The total number of Jews who died by Nazi hands can never be definitely ascertained. It is known, however, that 4 million Jews died in concentration camps, and that 2 million Jews were killed by the State Police in the East, making a total of 6 million murdered Jews. The source of these figures is Adolph Eichmann, Chief of the Jewish Section of the Gestapo. The figures are contained in an affidavit made by Dr. Wilhelm Hoettl, Deputy Group Leader of the Foreign Section of the Security Section, AMT VI, of the RSHA. Hoettl, in his affidavit, states as follows:

"Approximately 4 million Jews had been killed in the various concentration camps, while an additional 2 million met death in other ways, the major part of which were shot by operational squads of the Security Police during the campaign against Russia." (2738-PS)

Hoettl describes the source of his information as follows:

"According to my knowledge, Eichmann was at that time the leader of the Jewish Section of the Gestapo, and in addition to that he had been ordered by Himmler to get a hold of the Jews in all the European countries and to transport them to Germany. Eichmann was then very much impressed with the fact that Rumania had withdrawn from the war in those days. Moreover, he had come to me to get information about the military situation which I received daily from the Hungarian Ministry of War and from the Commander of the Waffen-SS in Hungary. He expressed his conviction that Germany had now lost the war and that he personally had no [Page 1008] further chance. He knew that he would be considered one of the main war criminals by the United Nations, since he had millions of Jewish lives on his conscience. I asked him how many that was, to which he answered that although the number was a great Reich secret, he would tell me since I, as a historian, would be interested, and that he would probably not return anyhow from his command in Rumania. He had, shortly before that, made a report to Himmler, as the latter wanted to know the exact number of Jews who had been killed." ( 2738-PS)

Answer 9

we have first-hand testimony to the existence and use of the gas-chambers at auschwitz (and many other camps).

an 'open debate' on whether the holocaust happened would make as much sense as an open debate on whether the germans invaded poland in 1939.

people were there, they saw it happen.

Answer 10

The Holocaust isn't race specific. Happy? The Jews were not the only ones getting beat down so they should not demand respect for their race.