Moral Idiocy & Moral Pessimism – Do you believe we are reaping the harvest of liberalism gone wild?

Question

Please make an attempt at reading before answering (you have 3 days to answer you know). For those of you who have picked up on my various moods here at YA - I am looking for deep thoughts on this one if you please.


Moral Idiocy – Defined as having ones sense of morality lowered due to cultural influence. They are ignorant to what is considered immoral.
(But this is of course compared to what, that which is defined as the norm for the current culture?)

Moral Pessimism – Defined as believing everyone else is doing it so, why does it matter?

Empirical studies often find a general tendency to over-estimate how much other people violate social norms – a bias toward moral pessimism. We show that persistence of this bias causes more people to violate the norm than if the bias were corrected. In addition, this bias increases the probability that behavior will settle into a "bad" equilibrium with many wrongdoers, instead of settling into a “good” one with few wrongdoers.....

Empirical studies also find that a person often
over-estimates how many other people act the same as he does – a bias towards social projection.
http://works.bepress.com/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1144&context=robert_cooter


*Please read:
This is of course in accordance with ones perception. I as a moderate conservative consider the majority of what defines CONTEMPORARY liberalism (however fluid that definition may be in accordance with the times).

Is this because I am “stuck” in an old fashioned mode or should we as a society try to reign in the immorality which is a direct result of liberal over-tolerance and that which is the perceived primary grievance of our predominate enemy in “conservative” radical Islam

What say you?

Answer 1

I have found often times the pot calls the kettle black

Torture - well the terrorists are doing it

Jailed without trial and no access to the due process of law -
Well we have to do that - no choice in the matter these are animals they aren't like us at all

Rendition - the act of kidknapping someone from another nation and giving them to a nation that will torture them

Well it wasn't us with the cattle prod in our hands it wasn't us how can we be responsible besides they are animals who cares about them anyway - Are you one of them is that why your defending them ?

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Thos "moral" issues - are very simple from the stand point of a famous German philosopher - When fighting dragons be careful not to become what you fight

Those moral issues appear to have come from a group of self styled Nazi's within the Conservative party not the liberal

That said it should not and in the end does not matter where it came from as much as it does matter it is being acepted

Talk about your moral relativeisim

When Russia did it - that was horrible the fiends When the terrorists do it they are disgusting animals -

When the US did it - You tend to hear the weak and accuseing self interested denials and justifcations that you would from any criminal and facist totalitarian regime that feels it somehow has the "right"

Thanks to the terrorists there will be an entire generation of Americans who will grow up knowing that toriture and rendition are ok things to do

You may be comfortable with that but would the most staunch Conservative of America's from 2 or 3 generations be ok with that ? And it 3 generations from now will the people still be comfortable with what America is signing off on today

All of the things that happened to America from Sept 12 2001 and on are your fault -

Fear and hate - facist style reasoning mistrust and a divided nation - a President that is at best questionable -

You did that yourself and to yourself -

Here is a suggestion

Stop that

Answer 2

The first issue is that what is "moral" is not absolute -- morals are entirely dependent on the particular religious or cultural framework in which they arise. Thus, what is moral (and even required) in one religion or culture may be immoral (and prohibited) in another religion or culture.

Thus, your concept of "moral idiocy" doesn't really work -- unless you include the fact that someone may choose to follow a different moral code becuase they have changed their religious or cultural beliefs -- in which case, you are only calling it idiocy because you disagree with their choice.

As for moral pessimism -- again, it could be a change of moral beliefs -- or it could be a matter of accepting that taking the moral high ground doesn't always work, especially when it creates a handicap that harms your ability to function.

So, I would say that I oppose moral pessimism -- if you have a set of personal beliefs, you should adhere to them even if it puts you at a disadvantage -- but I disagree that someone is an idiot just because they change their belief system.

That has nothing really to do with liberalism -- other than liberals are willing to allow people to have different moral, religious and cultural beliefs -- and more willing to consider each of those different beliefs valid for those who hold them -- as opposed to conservatives who (more often than not) think that only one set of religious and cultural beliefs should be used as a single standard for everyone.

Answer 3

I hardly see how 'liberal over tolerance' lends to being a married with children closeted homosexual who frequents prostitutes in airport restrooms. It seems to me that the right forgets that it does not have the one and only definition of morality. For example, since 'liberal over tolerance', the divorce and crime rates have gone down...many on the right believe that it is morally reprehensible to allow access to abortion, birth control, emergency contraception, etc...where many on the left believe that it is morally reprehensible to bring a child into the world crack addicted, abused, or in a broken house. As far as moral pessimism, people justify their behavior after the fact..that is just human nature. I have seen it here a few times...many are OK with their party leaders doing tyhe worng thing, because the other party does it too...like they don;t think they have more of a choice than 2 parties. It's called thinking for yourself.

Answer 4

Every generation thinks the moral vicissitudes and progressive moral decay of the generation that comes after them will be the downfall of society. In every case, they have been proven wrong. I'm guilty of it as well. I personally believe political correctness and the attack on family values is abhorrently dangerous, but taken into historical context, I may be proven wrong.

Remember - 50 years ago, people thought that Elvis swaying his hips on national TV was a scandal!

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Answer 5

Yes, there is a trend towards being so tolerant as to be morally and ethically retarded. To many libs there is no absolute right or wrong, therefore, there are no consequences to actions. Unless there is a change towards a morally and ethically based belief system, each succeeding generation will become more and more morally idiodic and pessimistic.

Answer 6

And now, for deep thoughts, with Jack Handy...

I remember that one fateful day when Coach took me aside. I knew what was coming. "You don't have to tell me," I said. "I'm off the team, aren't I?" "Well Dubya," said Coach, "you never were really ON the team. You made that uniform you're wearing out of rags and towels, and your helmet is a toy space helmet. You show up at practice and then either steal the ball and make us chase you to get it back, or you try to tackle people at inappropriate times." It was all true what he was saying. And yet, I thought something is brewing inside the head of this Coach. He sees something in me, some kind of raw talent that he can mold. But that's when I felt the handcuffs go on.

Answer 7

I think any answer depends largely on what the answerer considers "moral". And that you'll have one morality for every person.

My answer is, as long as your quest for morality does not interfere with mine... I don't care about your morality.

Answer 8

I see this all the time...couples come to our church looking for somebody to perform their wedding ceremony, and we ask them why they want to be married in a church...the answer is pretty much, "That's where you get married, isn't it?"

Then I say, I have to ask you, are you living together out of wedlock? Usually the response is pretty much, "Yes, isn't everybody?" The idea of morality as opposed to doing what is expedient for the moment never occurs to them...

Answer 9

Paris Hilton and Britney Spears are confessed Bush voters. Admit it, you play this song about morality because you hate gays.

Answer 10

I don't know why you bother posting questions when you already "know" the answer.

Yes, the evil liberals have messed up the world. Shame on us. If only we could go back to the good old days when women stayed home and black stayed at the back of the bus.