Could God have made a meaningful world without evil?

Question

Many people on Yahoo Answers ask variants of "why does God allow bad things to happen?" And the favorite answer is that if we didn't know evil and suffering, we would never know good and benevolence.

My question to believers is this: couldn't god have set up the world such that we *could* know good without experiencing evil and suffering? He's God, after all. He could make 2+2=marmalade if he wanted to.

Now you might object that an all-good universe would be sort of meaningless. But you're missing my argument. God created everything, including the very notion of anything being meaningful -- so he could have made it so that such a universe WAS meaningful.

If God couldn't do these things, is he still omnipotent?

If God didn't do these things, then isn't he still to blame for creating suffering?

You guys aren't getting it. Read what I said more carefully.

When humans create something, we work within the laws of the universe as given. So we couldn't create a world that was both all good AND where people had free will.

But God can do *anything*. ANYTHING. There are no limits. He can make a square circle. So that there's a world with free will and that's all good and where we learn just as much.

Since we know this is the case, what's the justification for a world where evil is even POSSIBLE?

Answer 1

"Just put it this way in your mind. Evil is not a created thing. Evil is not a substance. Evil is not an entity. Evil is not a being. Evil is not a force. Evil is not some floating spirit. Evil is a lack of moral perfection. God created absolute perfection. Wherever a lack of that exists, sin exists. And that cannot exist in the nature of God or in anything that God makes." - John MacArthur

Is there anything that God (Christ Jesus) can't do? Yes. He can't sin.

Evil and suffering are a result of sin.

Answer 2

God DID make a meaningful world, and, at the start, there was no evil. We brought that on ourselves. Do you know the story of the beginning of the world? Everything was perfect. I'm serious. There was only ONE rule, and that was, "Don't eat the fruit off the tree of the knowledge of good and evil." It is very important to note that God created us with free will, because if He wanted us to obey everything like robots, He would have made us...robots. If you think that the universe is meaningless, you are way wrong. God created each one of us with a unique purpose, and He knows exactly what that purpose is, even if we don't. God is still omnipotent, because He has control of everything you do, and he knows everything you say, what you have said, what you are saying, and what you will say. I don't understand what you mean when you ask "If God didn't do these things, then isn't he still to blame for creating suffering?" God didn't create suffering. What he created was perfect. It was mankind's own disobedience that triggered all things bad. I hope that answers your question, keep thinking about it.

Answer 3

Let me ask you: in order to really appreciate your right arm, must you cut off your left? If you are a parent, in order to really appreciate your first born, must you kill the second born? That is hardly reasonable, is it?

It is not necessary for evil to exist to appreciate good. Nevertheless, with free will, there will, of necessity, be the possibility of evil. What I mean is this: if humans could never do wrong, obviously there would never be wickedness. But because humans (and heavenly creatures) have free will, that means there is a possibility to do wrong. Which means there is a possibility for wickedness to exist.

Now, I do not say that an all-good universe would be meaningless or boring. To wit: what is your favorite food? How many times have you had it? Thousands? Do you sigh with boredom when it is put before you? Do you now find it meaningless to eat it? Do you think seeing your little one's face grinning up at you would be meaningless or boring? How meaningless can life possibly be? How meaningless is it to see a gorgeous sunset or smile at the beauty of a full moon? These are gifts from God. How could it possibly be said that he could not make a world without pain and suffering? The very concept is unimaginable.

But I do see your argument. And you have a valid question. It comes up often. Why does a God of power and love allow such pain and suffering when he has the ability to do something about it? Since it hurts God when we hurt, and since he never wanted this for us, there must be a compelling reason for God allowing wickedness to exist RIGHT NOW. Particularly is this so since it is God's will that we have only good things. And his will cannot be thwarted. See Isaiah 55:10-11.

God fully intends to do away with the present wickedness and those who cause it. God fully intends to deliver his human children from pain and sorrow. So what's taking him so long? As I said, there is a compelling reason. This post is already too long. But I should be delighted to share that compelling reason with you. Believe me. There is a very good reason and I really would like to share.

Hannah J Paul

EDIT: Neil, it really is not so that God can do anything. There are many things he cannot do. He cannot die, lie, be tempted with evil. And he cannot violate his justice or righteous standards. That does not mean he is not all powerful. His power is not defined by the suggestion of some that he can do absolutely anything. Even he works within the frame work of his own standards and justice. God does not have to justify anything. But Neil, the reason wickedness is possible is because free will exists. I know you hear that phrase quite a bit and you think people toss it around needlessly. But it does have its place. It is a precious gift with which God has endowed his intelligent creation (human and angel) and he will NEVER take it away. Since we have the ability to choose wrongly that means wickedness has the ability to exist. BUT, as I said before, God is tolerating it now for a reason. Once he has done what he is doing, once he restored paradise, once he restored the world YOU long for, IF wickedness should arise again, it will not be tolerated. It and the wicked person will be dealt with summarily! That means dead. So suffering won't exist anymore. Okay?

Answer 4

God did not create suffering. Suffering in this world is the result of sin. What is sin? Sin is going against God or His wishes. He is omnipotent but one thing He cannot or does not want to control is people's freedom to choose. That is the reason sin arose in the first place. If He would have created angels or men in such a way that they could not go against God then that would be a forcing them to remain under God with no choice.

Let me give you an example. Do parents want to have normal children? Yes. Which means they should be prepared for a situation where the children might go against their wishes since they can think for themselves. The only other option would be to have children that are less than normal. I don't think any parent would want to have that. Same with God. Without the freedom to choose the love and affection shown to Him would be meaningless. He wants His creatures to love Him not out of fear but out of appreciation for His goodness.

Answer 5

I think that you are missing a point but don't feel bad, I believe that most of us do. God did create a universe that was without evil. But the creation is not God, therefore not perfect. When Satan first began to look at God with envious eyes, God certainly could have ended that right then and there. He chose not to. Considering that God could see all possible realities, He chose the one with the best possible outcome. I don't know what that is, I'm only one human being in one time in history. But I do know that they only way humans can behave perfectly without knowing good and evil is when they are completely without intelligence. God told Eve that childbirth would be painful. Well, why is childbirth so painful? Because of the size of our heads at birth. Why are our heads so big? Because of our brain size and capacity. It is our very intelligence which brings on the pain. Thus, while God taught us right from wrong, and even sent His son to rescue us, the evil in the world is our fault and our responsibility.

Answer 6

Yes He can, He could make us to believe God's way and God's form of worship and be one people, but God has created us (humans) with a choice of free will, we are not forced to do anything, we have a mind to think what is right and what is wrong.

Even the Angels do not have a free will to choose they hear and obey.

And if we lead a good life by keeping right with God then Heaven awaits, if not then into the fire of damnation we go, the greater question is which way is right, Christian, Muslim, Jewish, Hindus, Buddhist and so on and so forth, I think religion should be based upon its merits and not judged by how the followers behave.

I say call upon the witnesses like the Scriptures and let us scrutinies them. In my 17 years of study I found only 3 faiths that can hold some light to the answer but only one that leads the way. This is the most mis-understood religion of this world...Islam, and when one reads and acquires knowledge they know it shall lead one to the straight way.

Answer 7

As for the original question:

Yes, but if god did in fact create the world and evil is allowed to dwell in it, then god is a sadistic creator.

The other option would be that god did in fact create the world but did not create evil. It was only allowed. This does not take away omnipotence I don't think, but it is definitely an oversight or a bad decision to allow evil to continue.

Nevertheless, evil could have been an entity a truly loving and truly adoring god could have never brought into being. Because evil is present and definitely accounted for in our daily lives it leaves me only one option. God does not exist and we are basically left to ourselves. Theologians can debate the evil question but it generally unresolved and evil, for what is worth, is unnecessary.

God, do the right thing and just get rid of evil if you so exist and I will be more than happy to show you my appreciation.

Answer 8

Okay, well.. God made you just the way you are knowing the route you would take determined by the environment he placed you in and the genes he chose for you to be born with for the sheer factor of testing you even though that test was already determined and the results known before you or the universe was created so in doing so it would make the plan of God to only allow Christians(tm) into Heaven because .. that was his plan. He created Hell so that people that he created would go to hell, because he chose to allow such people that he already knew were damned to exist.

Don't you get it? God has a plan to save those that were pre-saved before time began, and damn those that were created to be damned.

You have a choice, but god already knows the choices you make far before he created you..

I'm starting to think this God guy is pretty .. well for lack of better terms .. evil.

But, the Christians thinking they are going to Heaven believe he is the greatest thing ever, so we better not question their beliefs in the all loving God.. So let me make an answer that will please them. "God has a plan"..

Answer 9

The world will have no evil for a time, but generally, there must needs be opposition in all things. Adam and Eve didn't know how good they had it until they got thrown out. Think of 9/11... how many people turned to God then who never had before, or who hadn't in a long time? It's natural for us to turn to God in hard times.

In the pre-mortal existence, we had no evil. We are sent here to learn, grow, and be tested. If we had nothing evil or bad to experience, how much would we grow? What would we learn? We'd be as dumb going back to Him as we were when we came down here. We'd be like those people of science fiction (I forget which novelist)... the beautiful people lived above ground and were dumb as sticks. When the sirens went off, the went into the tunnel and became lunch for the ugly monsters who lived below.

The beautiful people ignored books, ate, frolicked, screwed, lounged around, slept and had no interest in improving themselves, using their minds, reading, growth... That'd be us, but without the monsters to eat us. Sounds good, maybe, but I kinda like asking big questions and then seeking after the answers, myself.

Answer 10

Yes God has made a world without evil. He calls it Heaven.
This world of ours is for selecting the people worthy enough to live in that evil free Heaven. God gave people free will to choose out of many available choices of action in every situation to find which one of us will make the best decision.

If God wouldn't give us free will to choose evil or wrong way from right way, God couldn't know which one are the best amongst us to be sent to the evil free Heaven he has made for the good people.

May be God has a higher purpose in Heaven for the good people so He needs this selection process.